Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru

Yn ôl i Chwilio

Y Cyfarfod Llawn

Plenary

08/04/2020

Cyfarfu’r Cynulliad drwy gynhadledd fideo am 13:32 gyda’r Llywydd (Elin Jones) yn y Gadair. 

The Assembly met by video-conference at 13:32 with the Llywydd (Elin Jones) in the Chair.

Croeso i bawb i’n Cyfarfod Llawn ni o’r Senedd. Cyn dechrau, dwi eisiau nodi ychydig bwyntiau. Mae hwn yn Gyfarfod Llawn a gynhelir ar ffurf cynhadledd fideo yn unol â Rheolau Sefydlog y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol, yn gyfystyr â thrafodion y Cynulliad at ddibenion Deddf Llywodraeth Cymru 2006. Ar ôl ymgynghori â’r Pwyllgor Busnes, bydd rhai o ddarpariaethau Rheol Sefydlog 34 yn gymwys ar gyfer y Cyfarfod Llawn heddiw ac mae’r rhain wedi’u nodi ar yr agenda. Bydd y cyfarfod yn cael ei ddarlledu’n fyw a bydd Cofnod y Trafodion yn cael ei gyhoeddi yn y ffordd arferol. Dwi eisiau atgoffa Aelodau bod yr holl Reolau Sefydlog sy'n ymwneud â threfn a threfniadau busnes yn y Cyfarfod Llawn yn gymwys i’r cyfarfod yma.

Welcome, all, to this Senedd Plenary session. Before we begin, I want to set out a few points. This is a Plenary meeting held by video-conference in accordance with the Standing Orders of the National Assembly for Wales, and it constitutes proceedings of the Assembly for the purposes of the Government of Wales Act 2006. Having consulted with the Business Committee, some of the provisions of Standing Order 34 will apply for today’s Plenary meeting and these are noted on our agenda. The meeting will be broadcast live and the Record of Proceedings will be published as usual. I wish to remind Members that all Standing Orders relating to order and the organisation of business in Plenary apply to this meeting.

1. Datganiad a Chyhoeddiad Busnes
1. Business Statement and Announcement

Yr eitem gyntaf, felly, y prynhawn yma yw’r datganiad a chyhoeddiad busnes, a dwi’n galw ar y Prif Weinidog i wneud y datganiad hynny.

The first item, therefore, this afternoon is the business statement and announcement, and I call on the First Minister to make that statement.

Diolch, Llywydd. There are no changes to this week’s agenda. Draft business for the next three sitting weeks is set out on the business statement and announcement, which can be found amongst the papers available to Members electronically.

Diolch, Llywydd. Nid oes unrhyw newidiadau i agenda'r wythnos hon. Mae'r busnes drafft ar gyfer y tair wythnos eistedd nesaf wedi ei nodi yn y datganiad a chyhoeddiad busnes, sydd i'w weld ymhlith y papurau sydd ar gael i'r Aelodau yn electronig.

2. Datganiad gan y Prif Weinidog: Coronafeirws (COVID-19)
2. Statement by the First Minister: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Diolch i’r Prif Weinidog. Yr eitem nesaf, felly, yw’r datganiad gan y Prif Weinidog ar coronafeirws. Dwi'n galw ar y Prif Weinidog i wneud ei ddatganiad.

I thank the First Minister. The next item is a statement by the First Minister on coronavirus. I call on the First Minister to make the statement.

Diolch yn fawr, Llywydd. Heddiw, byddaf yn rhoi’r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i Aelodau am y gwaith sy’n gyrru ymlaen ar draws Cymru mewn ymateb i coronafeirws. Mae pob rhan o Lywodraeth Cymru, llywodraeth leol, y gwasanaeth iechyd, y gwasanaethau brys, y sector wirfoddol a busnes yn rhan o’r ymdrech enfawr hon. Mae pawb yn cydweithio i baratoi gwasanaethau ac i gefnogi busnesau a phobl fregus. Mae pob unigolyn yng Nghymru yn gwneud cyfraniad pwysig drwy ddilyn y cyngor i aros gartref. Mae hyn yn gwneud gwahaniaeth yn barod. Rhaid i ni ddal ati er lles pawb.

Thank you very much, Llywydd. Today, I will provide Members with an update on the work that’s being driven forward across Wales in response to coronavirus. Every part of Welsh Government, local government, the health service, the emergency services, the voluntary sector and business are part of this gargantuan effort. Everyone is working together to prepare services and to support businesses and the vulnerable. Every individual in Wales is making an important contribution through following the advice to stay at home. This is already making a difference. We must persevere for everyone’s benefit.

Llywydd, near the start of my statement this week, I want to begin by sending my best wishes to the Prime Minister following his admission to intensive care for treatment for coronavirus. I wish also to wish our colleague Alun Davies a speedy recovery following his treatment in hospital this week. I know that we will all be wishing them both well.

Llywydd, my aim in these weekly statements is to provide Members with an account of the most recent and significant developments across Wales since our last Plenary meeting. Over the course of the last week, the Welsh Government has taken further action to protect people's health, to strengthen our NHS, and to support businesses as we continue to respond to the coronavirus pandemic.

Llywydd, wrth ddechrau fy natganiad yr wythnos hon, hoffwn ddechrau drwy anfon fy nymuniadau gorau at Brif Weinidog y DU ar ôl iddo gael ei dderbyn i ofal dwys am driniaeth ar gyfer coronafeirws. Hoffwn hefyd ddymuno gwellhad buan i'n cyd-Aelod Alun Davies yn dilyn ei driniaeth yn yr ysbyty yr wythnos hon. Gwn y byddwn ni i gyd yn dymuno'n dda iddyn nhw.

Llywydd, fy nod yn y datganiadau wythnosol hyn yw rhoi adroddiad i'r Aelodau ar y datblygiadau mwyaf diweddar ac arwyddocaol ledled Cymru ers ein Cyfarfod Llawn diwethaf. Yn ystod yr wythnos ddiwethaf, mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi cymryd camau pellach i ddiogelu iechyd pobl, i gryfhau ein GIG, ac i gynorthwyo busnesau wrth i ni barhau i ymateb i bandemig y coronafeirws.

Today, we are approaching the end of the initial three-week period of the stay-at-home rules. I want to again place on record my thanks to people throughout Wales for the solidarity that has been shown in complying with these vitally necessary restrictions. All of this is making a difference—the actions every one of us is taking to limit contact with others and to stay at home and to work from home wherever possible—all of that is helping to slow down the spread of the virus and to protect the most vulnerable.

But, because of the time lag between these measures coming into effect and seeing their results, we know that things will still get worse before they get better. More people will fall ill, more people will need to be admitted to hospital, and more families across Wales will face the heartbreak of losing somebody they love.

The latest figures show a further 291 cases in Wales, bringing the overall confirmed total to 3,790—although we know that the true number of cases will be higher. Very sadly, the total number of deaths now stands at 212, each one of those an individual, each one whose absence we now mourn.

Yesterday, just after midnight, an amendment to those stay-at-home rules came into force, extending the social distancing duty to all workplaces. This means that all workplaces that remain open in Wales must take all reasonable steps to maintain a 2m distance between people to reduce the spread of coronavirus. The workforce is the greatest asset in any workplace, and these regulations underline the obligation to safeguard the health and well-being of those workers through all reasonable measures.

Llywydd, this week has seen a set of developments in our health and social care services, from returning doctors and carers to the creation of field hospitals. In relation to testing, we have seen the development of drive-in testing centres in Wales and testing for social care staff. As our capacity to do more tests increases, we will roll that out to more people and professional groups, including the police and prison staff, as set out in our national testing plan for Wales published this week. 

Llywydd, ensuring health and social care staff have the right personal protective equipment to do their job is a top priority for the Welsh Government. Last week, new UK-wide PPE guidance was issued, and this has simplified where PPE should be used and also extended its use. The new guidance will increase the drawdown from our stocks of PPE. To date, we have issued more than eight million additional items from our pandemic stocks to the NHS and to local authorities, and that's over and above the supplies that are normally held by the NHS itself.   

We are working with England, Scotland and Northern Ireland to ensure an ongoing supply of PPE, but we have also asked Welsh businesses to switch their normal production lines to make PPE for Wales, and we've had a tremendous response from Welsh companies so far. Amongst others, the Royal Mint and the Rototherm Group are making face visors and shields that will be worn by health staff, and a gin distillery, In The Welsh Wind, is making World Health Organization-approved hand sanitisers.

In turning to the economy, I’m pleased to be able to update Members about the progress we have made, with much thanks to our colleagues in local government, in supporting small businesses during the pandemic. In the 10 days since our grant scheme for those smaller businesses was opened, our local authorities have made more than 17,700 awards and paid out £229 million. That figure is rising daily, and I really do want to extend my thanks to our local authority colleagues for the help that they have provided in assuring that this help reaches those who need it most. In the last week, we also confirmed support for Cardiff Airport, and will announce further details about the £500 million economic resilience fund next week.

Llywydd, I am very grateful to you and the Business Committee for agreeing that these Plenary sessions can be used for priority legislation. The Welsh Government continues, for example, to identify key European legislation that will need to be brought before the Senedd.

Llywydd, I want to end by looking ahead. The three weeks of stay-at-home restrictions provided for in legislation, and which we have all faced, are due to end next week. I must be plain with all Members: these restrictions will not end then. We will not throw away the gains we have made and the lives we can save by abandoning our efforts just as they begin to bear fruit.

Since we last met, I have discussed this matter with the First Ministers of Scotland and Northern Ireland, with the Secretary of State for Health in the UK Government, and today with the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster and the Secretary of State for Wales. There is more work to do in reviewing the regulations and in receiving the most up to date scientific and medical advice; the precise nature of what will follow the current regime will be agreed over the coming days.

But I must leave Welsh citizens in no doubt: the efforts we are all making are not yet over. They will not be over next week. Before the restrictions can be lifted and the return to normality begins, there is more for us all to do. I thank every one of those thousands and thousands of people in Wales who make their contribution every day and who will go on doing so over the days ahead. Together, we are making a real difference, we are protecting our national health service and, together, we are saving lives. 

Heddiw, rydym ni'n nesáu at ddiwedd y cyfnod cychwynnol o dair wythnos y rheolau aros gartref. Unwaith eto, hoffwn gofnodi fy niolch i bobl ledled Cymru am yr undod a ddangoswyd o ran cydymffurfio â'r cyfyngiadau gwbl angenrheidiol hyn. Mae hyn i gyd yn gwneud gwahaniaeth—y camau y mae pob un ohonom ni'n eu cymryd i gyfyngu cysylltiad ag eraill ac aros gartref a gweithio gartref pryd bynnag y bo hynny'n bosibl—mae hynny i gyd yn helpu i arafu lledaeniad y feirws ac i ddiogelu'r rhai mwyaf agored i niwed.

Ond, oherwydd y bwlch amser rhwng rhoi'r mesurau hyn ar waith a gweld eu canlyniadau, rydym ni'n gwybod y bydd pethau'n dal i waethygu cyn iddyn nhw wella. Bydd mwy o bobl yn mynd yn sâl, bydd angen i fwy o bobl gael eu derbyn i'r ysbyty, a bydd mwy o deuluoedd ledled Cymru yn wynebu'r sefyllfa dorcalonnus o golli rhywun y maen nhw'n ei garu.

Mae'r ffigurau diweddaraf yn dangos 291 o achosion ychwanegol yng Nghymru, gan ddod â'r cyfanswm a gadarnhawyd i 3,790—er ein bod ni'n gwybod y bydd nifer gwirioneddol yr achosion yn uwch. Yn anffodus iawn, mae cyfanswm y marwolaethau yn 212 erbyn hyn, pob un o'r rheini yn unigolyn, pob un yr ydym ni'n galaru ei absenoldeb yn awr.

Ddoe, ychydig wedi hanner nos, daeth diwygiad i'r rheolau aros gartref hynny i rym, gan ymestyn y ddyletswydd cadw pellter cymdeithasol i bob gweithle. Mae hyn yn golygu bod yn rhaid i bob gweithle sy'n parhau i fod ar agor yng Nghymru gymryd pob cam rhesymol i gadw pellter o 2m rhwng pobl i leihau lledaeniad coronafeirws. Y gweithlu yw'r ased mwyaf mewn unrhyw weithle, ac mae'r rheoliadau hyn yn tanlinellu'r ymrwymiad i ddiogelu iechyd a llesiant y gweithwyr hynny trwy bob mesur rhesymol.

Llywydd, bu cyfres o ddatblygiadau yn ein gwasanaethau iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol yr wythnos hon, o feddygon a gofalwyr yn dychwelyd i greu ysbytai maes. O ran profion, rydym ni wedi gweld datblygiad canolfannau profi drwy ffenestr y car yng Nghymru a phrofion i staff gofal cymdeithasol. Wrth i'n gallu i gynnal mwy o brofion gynyddu, byddwn yn cyflwyno hynny i fwy o bobl a grwpiau proffesiynol, gan gynnwys yr heddlu a staff carchardai, fel y nodir yn ein cynllun profi cenedlaethol i Gymru a gyhoeddwyd yr wythnos hon.  

Llywydd, mae sicrhau bod gan staff iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol y cyfarpar diogelu personol iawn i wneud eu gwaith yn un o brif flaenoriaethau Llywodraeth Cymru. Yr wythnos diwethaf, cyhoeddwyd canllawiau cyfarpar diogelu personol newydd ar gyfer y DU gyfan, ac mae'r rhain wedi symleiddio y dylid defnyddio cyfarpar diogelu personol ac ymestyn ei ddefnydd hefyd. Bydd y canllawiau newydd yn cynyddu'r hyn a gaiff ei gymryd o'n stociau cyfarpar diogelu personol. Hyd yma, rydym ni wedi cyflwyno dros wyth miliwn o eitemau ychwanegol o'n stociau pandemig i'r GIG ac i awdurdodau lleol, ac mae hynny yn ogystal â'r cyflenwadau sydd gan y GIG ei hun fel rheol.    

Rydym ni'n gweithio gyda Lloegr, yr Alban a Gogledd Iwerddon i sicrhau cyflenwad parhaus o gyfarpar diogelu personol, ond rydym ni hefyd wedi gofyn i fusnesau Cymru newid eu llinellau cynhyrchu arferol i gynhyrchu cyfarpar diogelu personol ar gyfer Cymru, ac rydym ni wedi cael ymateb gwych gan gwmnïau yng Nghymru hyd yn hyn. Ymhlith eraill, mae'r Bathdy Brenhinol a Grŵp Rototherm yn cynhyrchu feisorau a gwarchodwyr wyneb a fydd yn cael eu gwisgo gan staff iechyd, ac mae distyllfa gin, In The Welsh Wind, yn cynhyrchu hylif diheintio dwylo a gymeradwywyd gan Sefydliad Iechyd y Byd.

Gan droi at yr economi, rwy'n falch o allu rhoi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i'r Aelodau am y cynnydd yr ydym ni wedi ei wneud, gyda llawer o ddiolch i'n cydweithwyr mewn llywodraeth leol, yn cynorthwyo busnesau bach yn ystod y pandemig. Yn y 10 diwrnod ers agor ein cynllun grant ar gyfer y busnesau llai hynny, mae ein hawdurdodau lleol wedi gwneud mwy na 17,700 o ddyfarniadau ac wedi talu £229 miliwn. Mae'r ffigur hwnnw'n codi bob dydd, a hoffwn ddiolch o galon i'n cydweithwyr yn yr awdurdodau lleol am y cymorth y maen nhw wedi ei roi i sicrhau bod y cymorth hwn yn cyrraedd y rhai sydd ei angen fwyaf. Yn yr wythnos ddiwethaf, cadarnhawyd cymorth i Faes Awyr Caerdydd gennym ni hefyd, a byddwn yn cyhoeddi rhagor o fanylion am y gronfa cydnerthedd economaidd o £500 miliwn yr wythnos nesaf.

Llywydd, rwy'n ddiolchgar iawn i chi a'r Pwyllgor Busnes am gytuno y gellir defnyddio'r Cyfarfodydd Llawn hyn ar gyfer deddfwriaeth sy'n flaenoriaeth. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn parhau, er enghraifft, i nodi deddfwriaeth Ewropeaidd allweddol y bydd angen ei dwyn gerbron y Senedd.

Llywydd, hoffwn orffen drwy edrych ymlaen. Mae'r tair wythnos o gyfyngiadau aros gartref y darparwyd ar eu cyfer mewn deddfwriaeth, ac yr ydym ni i gyd wedi eu hwynebu, yn dod i ben yr wythnos nesaf. Mae'n rhaid i mi fod yn eglur gyda phob Aelod: ni fydd y cyfyngiadau hyn yn dod i ben bryd hynny. Ni fyddwn yn taflu i ffwrdd yr enillion yr ydym ni wedi eu gwneud a'r bywydau y gallwn ni eu hachub, trwy gefnu ar ein hymdrechion ar yr union adeg y maen nhw'n dechrau dwyn ffrwyth.

Ers i ni gyfarfod ddiwethaf, rwyf i wedi trafod y mater hwn gyda Phrif Weinidogion yr Alban a Gogledd Iwerddon, gyda'r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros Iechyd yn Llywodraeth y DU, a heddiw gyda Changhellor Dugiaeth Caerhirfryn ac Ysgrifennydd Gwladol Cymru. Mae mwy o waith i'w wneud o ran adolygu'r rheoliadau ac o ran cael y cyngor gwyddonol a meddygol diweddaraf; bydd union natur yr hyn a fydd yn dilyn y drefn bresennol yn cael ei chytuno yn ystod y dyddiau nesaf.

Ond mae'n rhaid i mi sicrhau peidio â gadael dinasyddion Cymru gydag unrhyw amheuon: nid yw'r ymdrechion yr ydym ni i gyd yn eu gwneud ar ben eto. Ni fyddan nhw ar ben yr wythnos nesaf. Cyn y gellir codi'r cyfyngiadau a dechrau dychwelyd i normalrwydd, mae mwy i ni i gyd ei wneud. Diolch i bob un o'r miloedd ar filoedd o bobl hynny yng Nghymru sy'n gwneud eu cyfraniad bob un dydd ac a fydd yn parhau i wneud hynny dros y dyddiau i ddod. Gyda'n gilydd, rydym ni'n gwneud gwahaniaeth gwirioneddol, rydym ni'n diogelu ein gwasanaeth iechyd gwladol a gyda'n gilydd, rydym ni'n achub bywydau.  

13:40

I want to reiterate my huge thanks to all front line essential workers who continue to do a fantastic job in keeping us all safe. Can I also convey my condolences to those who have lost loved ones during this pandemic? Like you, First Minister, I send my best wishes to the Prime Minister and to Alun Davies, and I wish them a speedy recovery.

Now, First Minister, over the weekend, the newly elected leader of the UK Labour Party, Sir Keir Starmer, made it clear that his party will engage constructively with the UK Government, not oppose for opposition's sake, and not score party political points or make impossible demands. Therefore, can I reiterate that sentiment and say that my colleagues and I will do all that we can to continue to work constructively throughout this period?

He also made it clear that scrutiny is important. And so, in the spirit of that sentiment, I think it's fair to ask why, of all of the issues currently facing the people of Wales, the Welsh Government is continuing to press ahead with the Local Government and Elections (Wales) Bill today, at a time when, quite frankly, any and all Government resources should be dedicated to tackling the impact of coronavirus on our communities? I hope, First Minister, that you'll reflect on that.

Now, also over the weekend, the health Minister made it clear that, while he could not be 100 per cent confident the NHS would cope, he felt that all that could be done was being done. However, like other Members I'm sure, I'm continuing to receive correspondence from anxious and worried constituents who feel that there are still people delivering important front-line services that do not have adequate personal protective equipment. For example, I'm aware that some patients have been denied access to emergency dental treatment due to the lack of protective equipment that's currently available. I know you've made reference in your statement today that an additional eight million pieces of equipment have been distributed, but can you tell us what the Welsh Government is doing to identify any gaps in the provision of PPE, and what further work is being done to expedite the delivery of this equipment of key workers at this time?

Now, I understand that Wales currently has the capacity to administer around 1,100 tests a day with the aim of reaching 5,000 tests a day in a few weeks before hitting up to 9,000 tests a day by the end of April. Given the increased pressure on the NHS due to coronavirus, it's vital that the number of tests administered is now accelerating so that the public can be confident that levels of testing are as high as practically possible. Perhaps you could, therefore, tell us if that's still the case, and whether the Welsh Government is still on track to reach 9,000 tests by the end of the month.

Now, the Welsh Government has also made it clear that it's diversifying the range of people it's working with in order to increase its capacity, and I understand that there has been some dialogue with universities about the role they can play in helping deliver additional capacity at this time. Therefore, can you tell us a bit more about the discussions that are taking place with universities, and indeed other institutions and organisations, about the role that they could play in supporting the NHS and helping to increase Wales's current capacity and resources?

Hoffwn ail-bwysleisio fy niolch enfawr i'r holl weithwyr hanfodol rheng flaen sy'n parhau i wneud gwaith gwych i'n cadw ni i gyd yn ddiogel. A gaf i hefyd gyfleu fy nghydymdeimlad â'r rhai sydd wedi colli anwyliaid yn ystod y pandemig hwn? Fel chithau, Prif Weinidog, anfonaf fy nymuniadau gorau at Brif Weinidog y DU ac at Alun Davies, a dymunaf wellhad buan iddyn nhw.

Nawr, Prif Weinidog, dros y penwythnos, fe'i gwnaed yn eglur gan arweinydd Plaid Lafur y DU sydd newydd gael ei ethol, Syr Keir Starmer, y bydd ei blaid yn ymgysylltu'n adeiladol â Llywodraeth y DU, nid gwrthwynebu er mwyn gwrthwynebu, ac nid sgorio pwyntiau gwleidyddol na gwneud gofynion amhosibl. Felly, a gaf i ailadrodd y safbwynt hwnnw a dweud y bydd fy nghyd-Aelodau a minnau yn gwneud popeth o fewn ein gallu i barhau i weithio'n adeiladol drwy gydol y cyfnod hwn?

Fe'i gwnaeth yn eglur hefyd bod craffu yn bwysig. Ac felly, yn ysbryd y safbwynt hwnnw, credaf ei bod hi'n deg gofyn pam, o'r holl faterion sy'n wynebu pobl Cymru ar hyn o bryd, mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn parhau i fwrw ymlaen â'r Bil Llywodraeth Leol ac Etholiadau (Cymru) heddiw, ar adeg pan, a bod yn gwbl onest, y dylai holl adnoddau'r Llywodraeth gael eu neilltuo i fynd i'r afael ag effaith coronafeirws ar ein cymunedau? Rwy'n gobeithio, Prif Weinidog, y gwnewch chi fyfyrio ar hynny.

Nawr, hefyd dros y penwythnos, fe'i gwnaed yn eglur gan y Gweinidog iechyd, er na allai fod yn 100 y cant yn ffyddiog y byddai'r GIG yn ymdopi, ei fod yn teimlo bod popeth y gellid ei wneud yn cael ei wneud. Fodd bynnag, fel Aelodau eraill rwy'n siŵr, rwy'n parhau i gael gohebiaeth gan etholwyr pryderus a gofidus sy'n teimlo bod pobl yn dal i ddarparu gwasanaethau rheng flaen pwysig pan nad oes ganddyn nhw gyfarpar diogelu personol digonol. Er enghraifft, rwy'n ymwybodol bod rhai cleifion wedi methu â chael triniaeth ddeintyddol frys oherwydd y diffyg cyfarpar diogelu sydd ar gael ar hyn o bryd. Gwn eich bod wedi cyfeirio yn eich datganiad heddiw at y ffaith bod wyth miliwn o ddarnau o gyfarpar ychwanegol wedi eu dosbarthu, ond a allwch chi ddweud wrthym ni beth mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i nodi unrhyw fylchau yn y ddarpariaeth o gyfarpar diogelu personol, a pha waith pellach sy'n cael ei wneud i hwyluso darpariaeth y cyfarpar hwn i weithwyr allweddol ar hyn o bryd?

Nawr, rwy'n deall bod gan Gymru y gallu ar hyn o bryd i gynnal tua 1,100 o brofion y dydd gyda'r nod o gyrraedd 5,000 o brofion y dydd ymhen ychydig wythnosau cyn cyrraedd hyd at 9,000 o brofion y dydd erbyn diwedd mis Ebrill. O ystyried y pwysau cynyddol ar y GIG oherwydd coronafeirws, mae'n hanfodol bod nifer y profion sy'n cael eu cynnal yn cyflymu nawr fel y gall y cyhoedd fod yn ffyddiog bod y lefelau profi mor uchel ag sy'n ymarferol bosibl. Efallai y gallech chi ddweud wrthym ni, felly, pa a yw hynny'n dal yn wir, ac a yw Llywodraeth Cymru yn dal i fod ar y trywydd iawn i gyrraedd 9,000 o brofion erbyn diwedd y mis.

Nawr, mae Llywodraeth Cymru hefyd wedi ei gwneud hi'n eglur ei bod yn arallgyfeirio'r ystod o bobl y mae'n gweithio gyda nhw i gynyddu ei chapasiti, ac rwy'n deall y bu rhywfaint o ddeialog gyda phrifysgolion ynghylch y rhan y gallan nhw ei chwarae i helpu i sicrhau capasiti ychwanegol ar hyn o bryd. Felly, a allwch chi ddweud ychydig yn rhagor wrthym ni am y trafodaethau sy'n cael eu cynnal gyda phrifysgolion, a sefydliadau a mudiadau eraill yn wir, am y rhan y gallen nhw ei chwarae i gefnogi'r GIG a helpu i gynyddu capasiti ac adnoddau presennol Cymru?

13:45

Llywydd, I thank Paul Davies for those questions, and I want to thank him for his continuing engagement in the effort that we are making. I completely agree with him that it's entirely cross-party and cross-Government.

I'm very glad that we have been able to continue with scrutiny here in Wales. It's a very important part of that scrutiny that key elements in our legislative programme can be brought forward and can be scrutinised by the Assembly. I think that's a very proper use of our time. We are in work; we're expecting other people in Wales to be in work, and part of our work as a legislature is to put essential legislation on to the statute book here in Wales. That is why I'm very glad that we will be able to debate the local government Bill; it is very important to all local authorities and to 16 and 17-year-olds here in Wales that that Bill makes progress and is able to reach the statute book. The Welsh Government is clear: we will only bring in front of the Senedd during this period those pieces of legislation that we think are vital to the commitments that we have made to people in Wales and that are necessary to make our statute book coherent. I think an integral part of what a legislature does is to deal with that priority legislation, and I'm very glad that we are able to do that this afternoon.

Of course I hear what Paul Davies says about PPE and all of us as Assembly Members will have heard directly from individuals who are fearful of being put in a position through the necessary work that they are doing in which they may be exposed to risk. We've already released, as Paul Davies recognised, 8 million pieces of PPE from our pandemic stores, and that will continue to rise over the days ahead. I expect it to be nearly 11 million by the time we get over this weekend.

Can I be clear that there are no current gaps in the supplies we hold? We have sufficient supplies at this point. Where there have been some bottlenecks is just in getting the supplies to the people who need it, and that's because this is an enormous effort—far beyond everything that we've ever needed to do before. Not only are we supplying hospitals, but we are supplying dental surgeries, GP surgeries, care homes, local authorities themselves, and an enormous effort is going on to try to make sure that those supplies reach the people who need them.

There is a dedicated helpline and e-mail address for places that feel that they don't have what they need and then, there's a system in place to try and make sure that we get those people what they require as fast as possible. Our ability to replenish those stores is very important indeed, and for that, we rely primarily on the UK-wide procurement effort that is going on. I spoke with Matt Hancock yesterday and received assurances that Welsh stocks will be replenished from that central source, and I'm very grateful for that assurance as we do our best to ramp up the ability to get supplies from indigenous Welsh suppliers as well.

We are accelerating the number of tests that we are able to provide in Wales and the testing centre in Cardiff City stadium is now up; it was working very successfully yesterday afternoon. It will be seeing 200 people today. It will allow us to test more social care workers and then to extend testing to police, prison officers and other front-line workers.

As to diversification, we are indeed in discussions with universities. We're very grateful to them for releasing their stocks of PPE into the system for use by the NHS and, of course, we're discussing matters with laboratory staff to see how we might be able to use their capacity to accelerate the number of tests that we can carry out in Wales.

Llywydd, diolchaf i Paul Davies am y cwestiynau yna, a hoffwn ddiolch iddo am ei ymgysylltiad parhaus â'r ymdrech yr ydym ni'n ei gwneud. Rwy'n cytuno'n llwyr ag ef ei bod yn gwbl drawsbleidiol a thrawslywodraethol.

Rwy'n falch iawn ein bod ni wedi gallu parhau i graffu yma yng Nghymru. Mae'n rhan bwysig iawn o'r gwaith craffu hwnnw y gellir cyflwyno elfennau allweddol yn ein rhaglen ddeddfwriaethol ac y gall y Cynulliad graffu arnyn nhw. Rwy'n credu bod hynny'n ddefnydd priodol iawn o'n hamser. Rydym ni'n gweithio; rydym ni'n disgwyl i bobl eraill yng Nghymru weithio, a rhan o'n gwaith fel deddfwrfa yw rhoi deddfwriaeth hanfodol ar y llyfr statud yma yng Nghymru. Dyna pam rwy'n falch iawn y byddwn ni'n gallu trafod y Bil llywodraeth leol; mae'n bwysig iawn i bob awdurdod lleol ac i bobl ifanc 16 a 17 oed yma yng Nghymru bod y Bil hwnnw'n gwneud cynnydd ac yn gallu cyrraedd y llyfr statud. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eglur: dim ond y darnau hynny o ddeddfwriaeth yr ydym ni'n credu sy'n hanfodol i'r ymrwymiadau yr ydym ni wedi eu gwneud i bobl yng Nghymru ac sy'n angenrheidiol i wneud ein llyfr statud yn gydlynol y byddwn ni'n eu cyflwyno gerbron y Senedd yn ystod y cyfnod hwn. Rwy'n credu bod ymdrin â'r ddeddfwriaeth flaenoriaeth honno yn rhan annatod o'r hyn y mae deddfwrfa yn ei wneud, ac rwy'n falch iawn ein bod ni'n gallu gwneud hynny y prynhawn yma.

Rwy'n deall, wrth gwrs, yr hyn y mae Paul Davies yn ei ddweud am gyfarpar diogelu personol a bydd pob un ohonom ni fel Aelodau Cynulliad wedi clywed yn uniongyrchol gan unigolion sy'n ofni cael eu rhoi mewn sefyllfa drwy'r gwaith angenrheidiol y maen nhw'n ei wneud lle gallen nhw gael eu hamlygu i risg. Rydym ni eisoes wedi cyhoeddi, fel y cydnabuwyd gan Paul Davies, 8 miliwn o ddarnau o gyfarpar diogelu personol o'n storfeydd pandemig, a bydd hynny'n parhau i gynyddu dros y dyddiau i ddod. Rwy'n disgwyl iddo fod yn bron i 11 miliwn erbyn i'r penwythnos hwn ddod i ben.

A gaf i fod yn eglur nad oes unrhyw fylchau ar hyn o bryd yn y cyflenwadau sydd gennym ni? Mae gennym ni gyflenwadau digonol ar hyn o bryd. Bu rhai tagfeydd o ran cael y cyflenwadau i'r bobl sydd eu hangen nhw, ac mae hynny oherwydd bod hon yn ymdrech enfawr—ymhell y tu hwnt i bopeth y bu'n rhaid i ni ei wneud erioed o'r blaen. Nid yn unig yr ydym ni'n cyflenwi ysbytai, ond rydym ni'n cyflenwi deintyddfeydd, meddygfeydd teulu, cartrefi gofal, awdurdodau lleol eu hunain, ac mae ymdrech aruthrol yn cael ei gwneud i geisio gwneud yn siŵr bod y cyflenwadau hynny'n cyrraedd y bobl sydd eu hangen nhw.

Ceir llinell gymorth a chyfeiriad e-bost penodol i leoedd sy'n teimlo nad oes ganddyn nhw'r hyn sydd ei angen arnyn nhw ac yna, mae system ar waith i geisio gwneud yn siŵr ein bod ni'n cael yr hyn sydd ei angen ar y bobl hynny iddyn nhw mor gyflym â phosibl. Mae ein gallu i ailgyflenwi'r storfeydd hynny'n bwysig dros ben, ac ar gyfer hynny, rydym ni'n dibynnu'n bennaf ar yr ymdrech gaffael sy'n cael ei gwneud ar draws y DU gyfan. Siaradais â Matt Hancock ddoe a chefais sicrwydd y bydd stociau Cymru yn cael eu hailgyflenwi o'r ffynhonnell ganolog honno, ac rwy'n ddiolchgar iawn am y sicrwydd hwnnw wrth i ni wneud ein gorau glas i gynyddu'r gallu i gael cyflenwadau gan gyflenwyr cynhenid o Gymru hefyd.

Rydym ni'n cyflymu nifer y profion y gallwn ni eu darparu yng Nghymru ac mae'r ganolfan brofi yn stadiwm Dinas Caerdydd ar agor erbyn hyn; roedd yn gweithio'n llwyddiannus iawn brynhawn ddoe. Bydd yn gweld 200 o bobl heddiw. Bydd yn caniatáu i ni brofi mwy o weithwyr gofal cymdeithasol ac yna ymestyn y profion i'r heddlu, swyddogion carchardai a gweithwyr rheng flaen eraill.

O ran arallgyfeirio, mae'n wir ein bod ni mewn trafodaethau â phrifysgolion. Rydym ni'n ddiolchgar iawn iddyn nhw am ryddhau eu stociau o gyfarpar diogelu personol i'r system i'w defnyddio gan y GIG ac, wrth gwrs, rydym ni'n trafod materion gyda staff labordai i weld sut y gallem ni ddefnyddio eu gallu i gyflymu nifer y profion y gallwn ni eu cynnal yng Nghymru.

First Minister, as the Easter holidays approach us, it is absolutely critical that the Welsh Government redoubles its public messaging to make crystal clear that people must stay at home. Sadly, we are continuing to see and hear reports of people not adhering to the Government advice and whilst the police have some powers now to fine those going against Government guidance, there still appears to be a problem with the enforcement of the stay-at-home rule. I know that both the UK Government and the Welsh Government are considering further measures if this activity continues to take place, so perhaps you could tell us a bit more about the discussions that are taking place on this specific issue and the types of further measures that are actually being considered.

I know in my own constituency as well as other areas, there are still holiday home owners travelling to their second homes rather than staying at home, and whilst I welcome the steps that the Welsh Government has already taken to close caravan parks and other holiday parks, clearly more now needs to be done. Therefore, what more is the Welsh Government doing to prohibit the travel of second home owners to holiday hotspots here in Wales?

Whilst families are forced to spend more and more time inside their own homes, it's crucial that they have access to the very latest information and guidance both online and offline. Clearly, more needs to be done to support communities that are still living with substandard broadband provision so that those living in those areas can have access to important educational resources, financial applications, and, of course, the latest health and Government guidance. Therefore, can you provide an update on the Welsh Government's work to ensure that all households are able to have access to a decent broadband service at this time?

And finally, Llywydd, there are still some very real concerns for many people unable to access business support, especially start-up businesses, and many people feel that they've fallen through the gaps in terms of the support on offer, by both the UK and Welsh Governments—for example, companies like hauliers and agency workers like supply teachers and others. Therefore, given the circumstances and the desperate need to ensure that those who need support have access to it, can you tell us what review of Government support the Welsh Government is looking at to identify gaps in the packages that are available, and what further work is the Welsh Government doing to get those who currently fall between the gaps access to business support?

Prif Weinidog, wrth i wyliau'r Pasg agosáu, mae'n gwbl hanfodol bod Llywodraeth Cymru yn cynyddu ei negeseuon cyhoeddus i'w gwneud yn gwbl eglur bod yn rhaid i bobl aros gartref. Yn anffodus, rydym ni'n parhau i weld a chlywed adroddiadau am bobl nad ydyn nhw'n cydymffurfio a chyngor y Llywodraeth, ac er bod gan yr heddlu rai pwerau erbyn hyn i ddirwyo'r rhai sy'n mynd yn groes i ganllawiau'r Llywodraeth, mae'n ymddangos bod problem o hyd o ran gorfodi'r rheol aros gartref. Gwn fod Llywodraeth y DU a Llywodraeth Cymru yn ystyried mesurau pellach os bydd y gweithgarwch hwn yn parhau, felly efallai y gallech chi ddweud ychydig mwy wrthym ni am y trafodaethau sy'n cael eu cynnal ar y mater penodol hwn a'r mathau o fesurau pellach sy'n cael eu hystyried mewn gwirionedd.

Gwn yn fy etholaeth i fy hun yn ogystal ag ardaloedd eraill, bod perchnogion tai gwyliau yn dal i deithio i'w hail gartrefi yn hytrach nag aros gartref, ac er fy mod i'n croesawu'r camau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru eisoes wedi eu cymryd i gau parciau carafanau a pharciau gwyliau eraill, mae'n amlwg bod angen gwneud mwy erbyn hyn. Felly, beth arall y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i wahardd perchnogion ail gartrefi rhag teithio i fannau poblogaidd ar gyfer gwyliau yma yng Nghymru?

Er bod teuluoedd yn cael eu gorfodi i dreulio mwy a mwy o amser y tu mewn i'w cartrefi eu hunain, mae'n hanfodol bod yr wybodaeth a'r canllawiau diweddaraf ar gael iddyn nhw ar-lein ac oddi ar-lein. Yn amlwg, mae angen gwneud mwy i gynorthwyo cymunedau sy'n dal i fyw gyda darpariaeth band eang is-safonol fel y gall y rhai sy'n byw yn yr ardaloedd hynny gael mynediad at adnoddau addysgol pwysig, ceisiadau ariannol, ac, wrth gwrs, y canllawiau iechyd a Llywodraeth diweddaraf. Felly, a allwch chi roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf i ni am waith Llywodraeth Cymru i sicrhau bod pob aelwyd yn gallu cael gafael ar wasanaeth band eang da yn ystod y cyfnod hwn?

Ac yn olaf, Llywydd, ceir rhai pryderon gwirioneddol iawn o hyd i lawer o bobl nad ydyn nhw'n gallu cael gafael ar gymorth busnes, yn enwedig busnesau newydd sbon, ac mae llawer o bobl yn teimlo eu bod nhw wedi disgyn drwy'r bylchau o ran y cymorth sydd ar gael, gan Lywodraethau Cymru a'r DU—er enghraifft, cwmnïau fel cludwyr nwyddau a gweithwyr asiantaeth fel athrawon cyflenwi ac eraill. Felly, o ystyried yr amgylchiadau a'r angen taer i sicrhau bod gan y rhai sydd angen cymorth fynediad ato, a allwch chi ddweud wrthym ni pa adolygiad o gymorth gan y Llywodraeth y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei ystyried i ganfod bylchau yn y pecynnau sydd ar gael, a pha waith pellach y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei wneud i gael mynediad at gymorth busnes i'r rhai sy'n disgyn drwy'r bylchau ar hyn o bryd.

13:50

Well, again, Llywydd, I thank Paul Davies for those questions. Can I join him in reinforcing the message that we have sent over the last two weekends and want to send again in the clearest possible terms? In advance of the Easter weekend, the stay-at-home advice means you; it's not advice to somebody else, for somebody else to follow, it's advice for every one of us and every one of us is under an obligation to follow that advice. And a journey to a second home is not an essential journey, and where the police in Wales stop people who are doing that, they will take enforcement action against them.

Now, we have a call with the chief constables prior to the weekend and immediately after the weekend to make sure that they are geared up for the very important work that we are asking them to do and then to receive a report from them on how they discharged their responsibilities. On Monday of this week, the reports from all four chief constables were that while there had been incidents right across Wales, they were sporadic rather than organised, they did not, in the view of the chief constables, represent affraying of the astonishing levels of observance that Welsh citizens have shown to the obligations that we all face, and that, where they had come across incidents, the powers that they currently have—including road blocks, for example, as well as fines—that repertoire of enforcement actions was still sufficient for them to be able to deal with the infringements they saw. And I once again made it clear in those discussions with chief constables that, if that view were to change and their advice to the Welsh Government was that they needed a strengthened repertoire of enforcement actions, we will not hesitate to do that. At this point, their advice to us was that what they currently have is sufficient to meet the challenges that they face and I will be guided by that advice.

Even in these really very difficult times, work does go on to try to strengthen broadband where it is not as good as we would like it to be and I recognise the context in which Paul Davies set out why that is particularly important. I don't have with me the detail of the additional work that's going on, but I'm happy to supply that, of course. As to business support, I think there are two roles that the Welsh Government fulfils. One is that, because we are a participant, every day, in sub-groups of the COBRA system, we are able to convey directly to UK Government Ministers the gaps in the provision that people are finding as the very welcome measures that the UK Government put in place are rolled out in practice. It's not a criticism at all to suggest that as ideas move from being on paper to being delivered on the ground some glitches will emerge in the way that those things are happening.

Our direct face-to-face contact gives us an opportunity to put those points on behalf of Welsh businesses directly to the Chancellor of the Exchequer, who chairs some of these meetings, and directly to the Secretary of State for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy, who chairs some of these meetings. That's something that we're very pleased to do—to be a direct voice for Welsh businesses in helping the UK Government to improve the practical delivery of the schemes it has put in place.

Next week, when we make announcements on the remaining £400 million of business support that we intend to make in Wales, focusing that help on gaps in help that is otherwise already available has been a key test for us in shaping that package. We do it in discussions with others—the Confederation of British Industry, the Federation of Small Businesses and so on. Challenging as it is, given the scale of need out there, our aim is to focus that £400 million in the way that Paul Davies suggested, so that its impact lands in those places where other forms of help are not currently available.

Wel, unwaith eto, Llywydd, diolchaf i Paul Davies am y cwestiynau yna. A gaf i ymuno ag ef i atgyfnerthu'r neges yr ydym ni wedi ei hanfon dros y ddau benwythnos diwethaf ac yr ydym ni eisiau ei hanfon eto yn y termau mwyaf eglur posibl? Cyn penwythnos y Pasg, mae'r cyngor aros gartref yn eich golygu chi; nid yw'n gyngor i rywun arall, i rywun arall ei ddilyn, mae'n gyngor i bob un ohonom ni ac mae'n rwymedigaeth ar bob un ohonom ni i ddilyn y cyngor hwnnw. Ac nid yw taith i ail gartref yn daith hanfodol, a phan fydd yr heddlu yng Nghymru yn stopio pobl sy'n gwneud hynny, byddan nhw'n cymryd camau gorfodi yn eu herbyn.

Nawr, mae gennym ni alwad gyda'r prif gwnstabliaid cyn y penwythnos ac yn syth ar ôl y penwythnos i wneud yn siŵr eu bod nhw'n barod ar gyfer y gwaith pwysig iawn yr ydym ni'n gofyn iddyn nhw ei wneud ac yna cael adroddiad ganddyn nhw ar sut y gwnaethon nhw gyflawni eu cyfrifoldebau. Ddydd Llun yr wythnos hon, yr adroddiadau gan bob un o'r pedwar prif gwnstabl oedd, er y bu digwyddiadau ledled Cymru gyfan, eu bod nhw'n wasgarog yn hytrach nag wedi'u trefnu, nad oedden nhw, ym marn y prif gwnstabliaid, yn gyfystyr ag affráe yn erbyn y lefelau syfrdanol o ufuddhad y mae dinasyddion Cymru wedi ei ddangos i'r rhwymedigaethau yr ydym ni i gyd yn eu hwynebu, a phan yr oedden nhw wedi dod ar draws digwyddiadau, roedd y pwerau sydd ganddyn nhw ar hyn o bryd—gan gynnwys blociau ffyrdd, er enghraifft, yn ogystal â dirwyon—roedd y gyfres o gamau gorfodi honno yn dal yn ddigonol iddyn nhw allu ymdrin â'r troseddau a welsant. Ac fe'i gwnaed yn eglur gennyf unwaith eto yn y trafodaethau hynny gyda phrif gwnstabliaid, pe byddai'r farn honno'n newid ac mai eu cyngor i Lywodraeth Cymru fyddai bod nhw angen cyfres gryfach o gamau gorfodi, y byddem ni'n gwneud hynny ar unwaith. Ar hyn o bryd, eu cyngor i ni oedd bod yr hyn sydd ganddyn nhw ar hyn o bryd yn ddigonol i ymateb i'r heriau y maen nhw'n eu hwynebu a byddaf yn cael fy llywio gan y cyngor hwnnw.

Hyd yn oed yn y cyfnod anodd iawn hwn, mae gwaith yn parhau i geisio cryfhau band eang lle nad yw cystal ag yr hoffem iddo fod, ac rwy'n cydnabod y cyd-destun y nododd Paul Davies pam mae hynny'n arbennig o bwysig. Nid yw manylion y gwaith ychwanegol sy'n cael ei wneud gen i, ond rwy'n hapus i gyflenwi hynny, wrth gwrs. O ran cymorth i fusnesau, rwy'n credu bod dwy swyddogaeth y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn eu cyflawni. Un yw, gan ein bod ni'n cymryd rhan, bob dydd, mewn is-grwpiau o'r system COBRA, rydym ni'n gallu cyfleu yn uniongyrchol i Weinidogion Llywodraeth y DU y bylchau yn y ddarpariaeth y mae pobl yn eu canfod wrth i'r mesurau sydd i'w croesawu yn fawr gan Lywodraeth y DU gael eu gweithredu’n ymarferol. Nid yw'r feirniadaeth o gwbl i awgrymu, wrth i syniadau symud o fod ar bapur i gael eu cyflwyno ar lawr gwlad, y bydd rhai anawsterau yn dod i'r amlwg yn y ffordd y mae'r pethau hynny'n digwydd.

Mae ein cysylltiad wyneb yn wyneb uniongyrchol yn rhoi cyfle i ni gyflwyno'r pwyntiau hynny ar ran busnesau Cymru yn uniongyrchol i Ganghellor y Trysorlys, sy'n cadeirio rhai o'r cyfarfodydd hyn, ac yn uniongyrchol i'r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros Fusnes, Ynni a Strategaeth Ddiwydiannol, sy'n cadeirio rhai o'r cyfarfodydd hyn. Mae hynny'n rhywbeth yr ydym ni'n falch iawn o'i wneud—bod yn llais uniongyrchol i fusnesau Cymru o ran helpu Llywodraeth y DU i wella darpariaeth ymarferol y cynlluniau y mae wedi eu rhoi ar waith.

Yr wythnos nesaf, pan fyddwn ni'n gwneud cyhoeddiadau am y £400 miliwn o gymorth busnes sy'n weddill yr ydym ni'n bwriadu ei ddarparu yng Nghymru, gan ganolbwyntio ar fylchau mewn cymorth sydd eisoes ar gael fel arall wedi bod yn brawf allweddol i ni o ran llunio'r pecyn hwnnw. Rydym ni'n gwneud hynny mewn trafodaethau ag eraill—Cydffederasiwn Diwydiant Prydain, y Ffederasiwn Busnesau Bach, ac yn y blaen. Er ei fod yn anodd, o ystyried maint yr angen sy'n bodoli, ein nod yw canolbwyntio £400 miliwn yn y ffordd a awgrymodd Paul Davies, fel bod ei effaith yn glanio yn y mannau hynny lle nad yw mathau eraill o gymorth ar gael ar hyn o bryd.

13:55

Gaf i ategu'r hyn y dywedodd y Prif Weinidog ac estyn ein dymuniadau gorau ni i gyd, wrth gwrs, i Brif Weinidog y Deyrnas Gyfunol, a hefyd i bawb arall sy'n sâl ar hyn o bryd? Gobeithio y caiff Alun Davies, wrth gwrs, wellhad buan. A gaf i hefyd ddiolch i chi, Brif Weinidog, am y cyfle i mi gael fy mriffio y bore yma gan y prif swyddogion sydd yn arwain yr ymateb i'r argyfwng?

May I endorse what the First Minister said and extend our best wishes to the UK Prime Minister, and to everyone else who is unwell at the moment? I hope that Alun Davies also makes a speedy recovery. May I also thank you, First Minister, for the opportunity to be briefed this morning by the lead officials leading the response to this crisis?

If we turn to PPE, you recognised, First Minister, that PPE is, obviously, a concern. The Royal College of Nursing say that they have repeatedly asked the Welsh Government to share the distribution schedule for PPE so that they can reassure their members. Can you give a commitment today that that will now happen? And can you say by what date all of the front-line staff that you have identified as needing PPE will receive it in the quantities required?

Because of the bottlenecks in PPE that you referred to, some public bodies—Carmarthenshire County Council, for example—are beginning to procure directly from China themselves. What steps are you taking, as a Government, as a complement to the UK-wide approach that you referred to, to procure additional resources internationally? In particular, what approaches have you made, either directly as Ministers or officials, to the Chinese Government and to Chinese suppliers, where, of course, the majority of sources reside?

International experience suggests that earlier intervention can keep the unwell out of hospital and aid recovery. Physicians in Italy, for example, suggest that early oxygen therapy and pulse oximeters delivered at the homes of the mildly ill would limit hospitalisation. Will you confirm whether or not you are actively looking at such a new treatment regime? 

If I could turn to ventilators, I think between those we currently have and those that are on order we have just over 1,000 invasive ventilators, I believe, that will be available to us. When will we know whether that supply—that projected supply—will be enough to meet the current projected peak demand?

On 12 March, the policy of widespread community testing was discontinued. Professor Anthony Costello, professor of global health at University College London and a former director of the World Health Organization, says that case detection, tracking and isolation will get the epidemic down much quicker. Are you going to adopt this approach of testing, tracing and isolation in Wales?

And finally, following your confirmation that Roche were the company involved in the collapsed deal, will you now publish the agreement that existed between the Welsh Government and the company? If you're unwilling to do so now, will you at least commit today to do so at the earliest possible opportunity, once a semblance of normality has returned? And in terms of the numbers of tests now, would it be possible for us to have daily figures for the number of tests, as happens in Scotland, for example, so we can track progress towards the figure of 9,000, I believe—perhaps you could confirm that—of daily tests that you're aiming to achieve by the end of this month?

Os trown ni at gyfarpar diogelu personol, cydnabuwyd gennych chi, Prif Weinidog, bod cyfarpar diogelu personol, yn amlwg, yn bryder. Dywed y Coleg Nyrsio Brenhinol eu bod nhw wedi gofyn droeon i Lywodraeth Cymru rannu'r amserlen ddosbarthu ar gyfer cyfarpar diogelu personol fel y gallan nhw dawelu meddyliau eu haelodau. A allwch chi roi ymrwymiad heddiw y bydd hynny'n digwydd nawr? Ac a allwch chi ddweud erbyn pa ddyddiad y bydd yr holl staff rheng flaen yr ydych chi wedi nodi bod angen cyfarpar diogelu personol arnyn nhw yn ei dderbyn yn y niferoedd sydd eu hangen?

Oherwydd y tagfeydd o ran cyfarpar diogelu personol y gwnaethoch chi gyfeirio atynt, mae rhai cyrff cyhoeddus—Cyngor Sir Caerfyrddin, er enghraifft—yn dechrau caffael yn uniongyrchol gan Tsieina eu hunain. Pa gamau ydych chi'n eu cymryd, fel Llywodraeth, i ategu'r dull DU gyfan y cyfeiriasoch ato, i gaffael adnoddau ychwanegol yn rhyngwladol? Yn benodol, pa gysylltiad ydych chi wedi ei wneud, naill ai'n uniongyrchol fel Gweinidogion neu swyddogion, â Llywodraeth Tsieina ac â chyflenwyr yn Tsieina, lle, wrth gwrs, y ceir mwyafrif y ffynonellau?

Mae profiad rhyngwladol yn awgrymu y gall ymyrraeth gynharach gadw pobl sâl allan o'r ysbyty a chynorthwyo gwellhad. Mae meddygon yn yr Eidal, er enghraifft, yn awgrymu y byddai therapi ocsigen cynnar ac ocsimetrau pwls yn cael eu danfon i gartrefi'r rhai sydd â salwch ysgafn yn cyfyngu ar y nifer sy'n mynd i'r ysbyty. A wnewch chi gadarnhau pa un a ydych chi'n ystyried trefn driniaeth newydd o'r fath yn ymarferol?  

Os caf i droi at awyryddion, rwy'n credu rhwng y rhai sydd gennym ni ar hyn o bryd a'r rhai sydd ar archeb, bod gennym ni ychydig dros 1,000 o awyryddion mewnwthiol, rwy'n credu, a fydd ar gael i ni. Pryd y byddwn ni'n gwybod a fydd y cyflenwad hwnnw—y cyflenwad rhagweledig hwnnw—yn ddigon i fodloni'r galw brig a ragwelir ar hyn o bryd?

Ar 12 Mawrth daethpwyd â'r polisi o brofion cymunedol eang i ben. Mae'r Athro Anthony Costello, athro iechyd byd-eang yng Ngholeg Prifysgol Llundain a chyn gyfarwyddwr Sefydliad Iechyd y Byd, yn dweud y bydd canfod, olrhain ac ynysu achosion yn tawelu'r epidemig yn llawer cyflymach. A ydych chi'n mynd i fabwysiadu'r dull hwn o brofi, olrhain ac ynysu yng Nghymru?

Ac yn olaf, ar ôl i chi gadarnhau mai Roche oedd y cwmni a oedd yn rhan o'r cytundeb aflwyddiannus, a wnewch chi gyhoeddi nawr y cytundeb a oedd yn bodoli rhwng Llywodraeth Cymru a'r cwmni? Os ydych chi'n amharod i wneud hynny nawr, a wnewch chi o leiaf ymrwymo heddiw i wneud hynny cyn gynted â phosibl, ar ôl i ryw fath o normalrwydd ddychwelyd? Ac o ran nifer y profion nawr, a fyddai'n bosibl i ni gael ffigurau dyddiol ar gyfer nifer y profion, fel sy'n digwydd yn yr Alban, er enghraifft, fel y gallwn ni olrhain cynnydd tuag at y ffigur o 9,000, rwy'n credu—efallai y gallech chi gadarnhau hynny—o brofion dyddiol yr ydych chi'n bwriadu eu cynnal erbyn diwedd y mis hwn?

14:00

Diolch i Adam Price am y cwestiynau yna a beth ddywedodd e i ddechrau.

I thank Adam Price for those questions and for his opening remarks.

In relation to PPE and the distribution schedule, the chief medical officer has a weekly meeting with the Academy of Medical Royal Colleges; the Royal College of Nursing is, I'm sure, represented there and I'm sure the chief medical officer would be very happy to discuss whether a distribution schedule is an useful tool for members of royal colleges. Our own shared services organisation procures on behalf of Wales. In addition to the supplies we get through the new UK arrangements, we've always been able to secure our own supplies. And in general, my advice to local authorities and others is that it is better to be part of that national effort, although I understand that many organisations have their own suppliers and some long-standing arrangements that they are able to draw on. But we are lucky to have NHS shared services here in Wales—a national organisation with a very good reputation and a very skilled workforce, who are working hard to secure PPE, including from overseas, including contacts in China as well.

Adam asked me a couple of questions, Llywydd, about clinical matters, and my answer can only ever be that I have to be guided by the best clinical advice that I have. So, our clinicians will of course be looking at international evidence of early intervention, and whether there are regimes we should adopt here in Wales. They are far better placed than me to make that assessment, and where our clinicians believe that there are new things that can be done, and that they will be clinical effective in responding to the coronavirus, then of course we will support them in their efforts. The same has to be said as far as our approach to testing, tracking and isolation. The regime we have is the regime recommended to us by the four chief medical officers of the United Kingdom. If there comes a point where their advice to Government is that we need to move in a new direction in relation to testing, then you can be sure the Welsh Government will take their advice. There's no such thing as uncontested advice. We know that there are many different views amongst clinicians and academics and other experts. What Government can't do, what Ministers in the Welsh Government can't to, is to pick and choose between those competing voices. We have to rely on the most senior and authoritative voices that we have, and those are the four chief medical officers that work together very closely to advise all four Governments across the United Kingdom. It's their advice we rely on, and their advice that I continue to take.

As far as ventilators, our concern is—. It's a very good question. Vaughan Gething published on 5 April a detailed statement setting out existing capacity, invasive, non-invasive, the store that is on order, the number of ventilators that have already arrived in Wales. What we then have to do, as I know that Adam Price understands, is we have to match that capacity to the curve of the disease, and because we are not yet completely sure when that peak will be, a precise answer to the 'Have we got enough?' question remains a bit in the balance. What I think we can say with confidence is that the actions we have all taken in recent weeks have suppressed the curve to a point where we can have a much greater degree of confidence that the additional supplies we have of ventilators will match the current pattern of illness much more closely than would have been the case a month ago when we had fewer ventilators in the system and a very different pattern of disease in front of us.

Llywydd, as far as Roche is concerned, I've answered questions on that for about 10 days now, and I've really nothing further to add this afternoon to what I've already said on the record.

O ran cyfarpar diogelu personol a'r amserlen ddosbarthu, mae'r prif swyddog meddygol yn cael cyfarfod wythnosol gydag Academi'r Colegau Meddygol Brenhinol; rwy'n siŵr bod y Coleg Nyrsio Brenhinol yn cael ei gynrychioli yn y fan honno ac rwy'n siŵr y byddai'r prif swyddog meddygol yn hapus iawn i drafod pa un a yw amserlen ddosbarthu yn arf defnyddiol i aelodau'r colegau brenhinol. Mae ein sefydliad cydwasanaethau ein hunain yn caffael ar ran Cymru. Yn ogystal â'r cyflenwadau yr ydym ni'n eu cael trwy drefniadau newydd y DU, rydym ni wedi gallu sicrhau ein cyflenwadau ein hunain erioed. Ac yn gyffredinol, fy nghyngor i awdurdodau lleol ac eraill yw ei bod hi'n well bod yn rhan o'r ymdrech genedlaethol honno, er fy mod i'n deall bod gan lawer o sefydliadau eu cyflenwyr eu hunain a rhai trefniadau hirsefydlog y gallan nhw fanteisio arnynt. Ond rydym ni'n lwcus i gael cydwasanaethau'r GIG yma yng Nghymru—sefydliad cenedlaethol sydd ag enw da iawn a gweithlu medrus iawn, sy'n gweithio'n galed i sicrhau cyfarpar diogelu personol, gan gynnwys o dramor, gan gynnwys cysylltiadau yn Tsieina hefyd.

Gofynnodd Adam un neu ddau o gwestiynau i mi, Llywydd, am faterion clinigol, a'r unig ateb y gallaf i ei roi ar unrhyw adeg yw bod yn rhaid i mi gael fy llywio gan y cyngor clinigol gorau sydd gen i. Felly, bydd ein clinigwyr, wrth gwrs, yn edrych ar dystiolaeth ryngwladol o ymyrraeth gynnar, a pha un a oes trefnau y dylem ni eu mabwysiadu yma yng Nghymru. Maen nhw mewn sefyllfa well o lawer na mi i wneud yr asesiad hwnnw, a phan fydd ein clinigwyr yn credu bod pethau newydd y gellir eu gwneud, ac y byddan nhw'n effeithiol yn glinigol o ran ymateb i'r coronafeirws, yna wrth gwrs byddwn ni'n eu cynorthwyo nhw yn eu hymdrechion. Mae'n rhaid dweud yr un peth o ran ein dull profi, olrhain ac ynysu. Y drefn sydd gennym ni yw'r drefn a argymhellwyd i ni gan bedwar prif swyddog meddygol y Deyrnas Unedig. Os daw adeg pan mai eu cyngor nhw i'r Llywodraeth yw bod angen i ni symud i gyfeiriad newydd o ran profi, yna gallwch fod yn siŵr y bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn cymryd eu cyngor. Does dim y fath beth â chyngor heb ei gwestiynu. Rydym ni'n gwybod bod llawer o wahanol safbwyntiau ymhlith clinigwyr ac academyddion ac arbenigwyr eraill. Yr hyn na all Llywodraeth ei wneud, a'r hyn na all Gweinidogion yn Llywodraeth Cymru ei wneud, yw dewis a dethol rhwng y lleisiau hynny sy'n cystadlu. Mae'n rhaid i ni ddibynnu ar y lleisiau uchaf a mwyaf awdurdodol sydd gennym ni, a'r pedwar prif swyddog meddygol sy'n gweithio'n agos iawn gyda'i gilydd i gynghori pob un o'r pedair Llywodraeth yn y Deyrnas Unedig yw'r rheini. Eu cyngor nhw yr ydym ni'n dibynnu arno, a'u cyngor nhw yr wyf i'n parhau i'w gymryd.

O ran awyryddion, ein pryder yw—. Mae'n gwestiwn da iawn. Ar 5 Ebrill, cyhoeddodd Vaughan Gething ddatganiad manwl yn nodi capasiti presennol, mewnwthiol, anfewnwthiol, y stoc sydd ar archeb, nifer yr awyryddion sydd eisoes wedi cyrraedd Cymru. Yr hyn y mae'n rhaid i ni ei wneud wedyn, fel y gwn fod Adam Price yn ei ddeall, yw bod yn rhaid i ni gyfateb y capasiti hwnnw â thrywydd y clefyd, a chan nad ydym ni'n gwbl sicr eto pa bryd fydd y cyfnod brig hwnnw, mae ateb manwl i'r cwestiwn 'A oes gennym ni ddigon?' yn y fantol o hyd braidd. Yr hyn yr wyf i'n credu y gallwn ni ei ddweud yn hyderus yw bod y camau yr ydym ni i gyd wedi eu cymryd yn ystod yr wythnosau diwethaf wedi gostwng y gromlin i bwynt lle y gallwn ni fod yn llawer mwy ffyddiog y bydd y cyflenwadau ychwanegol sydd gennym ni o awyryddion yn cyfateb yn llawer agosach i'r patrwm presennol o salwch nag a fyddai wedi bod yn wir fis yn ôl pan oedd gennym ni lai o awyryddion yn y system a phatrwm gwahanol iawn o glefyd o'n blaenau.

Llywydd, cyn belled ag y mae Roche yn y cwestiwn, rwyf i wedi ateb cwestiynau am hynny am tua 10 diwrnod bellach, ac nid oes gen i ddim byd pellach i'w ychwanegu y prynhawn yma at yr hyn yr wyf i eisoes wedi ei ddweud ar y cofnod.

14:05

Just on the issue of contact tracing, testing and tracing, where there is, obviously, a range of views and a difference of opinion amongst scientists, epidemiologists and public health experts, given that the demographics of Wales are different—and, indeed, Ministers have referred to this—would it be possible for the Welsh Government to commission its own independent modelling, or ask SAGE and the various sub-committees to conduct specific modelling on the issue of whether we in Wales, as we come out of the lockdown, should adopt this policy, the South Korean policy of testing and tracing?

In relation to PPE, can I just say we've been contacted today by one despairing care home owner, who is trying to order PPE from the leading supplier for care homes in the UK only to be told that these supplies were given to them for distribution by Public Health England, and as such they had to be reserved for English-based homes only? Could you make urgent enquiries, First Minister, to verify if that is correct?

And also, in relation to the economic situation that was referred to earlier, it's obviously concerning to learn that the £100 million business loan scheme by the Development Bank of Wales is now fully subscribed after one week? Can you say when and how you plan to extend it?

And finally, in relation to the Easter bank holiday weekend and sending out the right signal, as I'm sure you as First Minister will do, do you think it would be useful for the UK Government, as you have done, to announce, in advance of the weekend, that they were extending the lockdown rather than waiting for the three weeks to be up effectively next Tuesday, so that that would send the strongest possible signal that this is a national emergency, it's not a national holiday?

Dim ond ar y mater o olrhain, profi ac olrhain cysylltiad, lle ceir, yn amlwg, amrywiaeth o safbwyntiau a gwahaniaeth barn ymhlith gwyddonwyr, epidemiolegwyr ac arbenigwyr iechyd cyhoeddus, o gofio bod demograffeg Cymru yn wahanol—ac, yn wir, mae Gweinidogion wedi cyfeirio at hyn—a fyddai'n bosibl i Lywodraeth Cymru gomisiynu ei modelu annibynnol ei hun, neu ofyn i SAGE a'r gwahanol is-bwyllgorau wneud modelu penodol ar y mater o ba un a ddylem ni yng Nghymru, wrth i ni ddod allan o'r cyfyngiadau symud, fabwysiadu'r polisi hwn, polisi De Corea o brofi ac olrhain?

O ran cyfarpar diogelu personol, a gaf i ddweud y cysylltwyd â ni heddiw gan un perchennog cartref gofal diobaith, sy'n ceisio archebu cyfarpar diogelu personol gan y prif gyflenwr ar gyfer cartrefi gofal yn y DU, dim ond i gael gwybod y rhoddwyd y cyflenwadau hyn iddyn nhw i'w dosbarthu gan Public Health England, ac felly bod yn rhaid eu neilltuo ar gyfer cartrefi yn Lloegr yn unig? A allwch chi wneud ymholiadau brys, Prif Weinidog, i gadarnhau a yw hynny'n gywir?

A hefyd, o ran y sefyllfa economaidd y cyfeiriwyd ati'n gynharach, mae'n amlwg yn destun pryder darganfod bod y cynllun benthyciadau busnes gwerth £100 miliwn gan Fanc Datblygu Cymru wedi ei danysgrifio'n llawn bellach ar ôl wythnos. A allwch chi ddweud pryd a sut yr ydych chi'n bwriadu ei ymestyn?

Ac yn olaf, o ran penwythnos gŵyl banc y Pasg ac anfon y neges gywir, fel yr wyf i'n siŵr y byddwch chi fel Prif Weinidog yn ei wneud, a ydych chi'n credu y byddai'n ddefnyddiol i Lywodraeth y DU, fel yr ydych chi wedi ei wneud, gyhoeddi, cyn y penwythnos, eu bod nhw'n ymestyn y cyfyngiadau symud yn hytrach nag aros i'r tair wythnos ddod i ben yn bendant ddydd Mawrth nesaf, fel y byddai hynny'n anfon y neges gryfaf bosibl bod hwn yn argyfwng cenedlaethol, a nid gwyliau cenedlaethol?

Llywydd, I thank Adam Price for those important questions. He's right, of course, about the range of views. We have a Welsh representative on SAGE, we have our own chief medical officer. They distil the advice and give bespoke advice for Wales, and that includes some specific modelling that they are able to do, and I will raise with them the specific question that Adam Price has raised about modelling in a contact-tracing area to see whether different advice would come for Wales. Up until now, that hasn't been the case, but we shouldn't stop asking the question, I agree.

On PPE, there is a UK procurement, the product of that gets divided out to Wales, to Northern Ireland, to Scotland and England, and it's then for us to onwardly transmit that to people who need it. If there is someone who is anxious about not getting what they need, they should use the dedicated helpline that's available to them. That way they will get the right answer in the quickest possible way.

On the DBW point, I'm absolutely struck by the signal it sends about the level of distress in the economy. The Development Bank of Wales would normally get about 500 applications a year for the sort of funds that were set aside a week or so ago; they had 1,100 applications in a single week for that £100 million. The good news—and, again, I want to just pay tribute to the staff of the bank, because within three days, they were making the first decisions, and by the end of last week, the first moneys were in the hands of Welsh businesses. The challenge for Welsh Government now is to see whether there's anything more we can do to augment that fund. As Members listening can, I'm sure, understand, there are calls for funding from absolutely every aspect of Welsh life in this crisis, and a finite amount of money from which to meet all those calls. The Welsh Government is squeezing money out of every pocket we can find to try to dedicate to meeting those most urgent needs, and we will be doing that again in the Development Bank of Wales context.

Finally, on Adam Price's point about a concerted UK message in advance of this weekend, that was the purpose of my discussions with the First Ministers of Scotland and Northern Ireland earlier, to try to get a common message. I think we are all agreed that, as I said in my introductory statement, there is no prospect at all that the measures we are all having to observe will come to an end at the end of this three-week period. They will be continuing in Wales next week. I believe they will be continuing elsewhere in the United Kingdom, and if we could get that single message in a concerted, united way out across the United Kingdom, that would, of course, give it additional force and strength.

Llywydd, hoffwn ddiolch i Adam Price am y cwestiynau pwysig yna. Mae'n iawn, wrth gwrs, am yr amrywiaeth o safbwyntiau. Mae gennym ni gynrychiolydd Cymru ar SAGE, mae gennym ni ein prif swyddog meddygol ein hunain. Maen nhw'n distyllu'r cyngor ac yn rhoi cyngor wedi'i deilwra ar gyfer Cymru, ac mae hynny'n cynnwys rhywfaint o fodelu penodol y gallan nhw ei wneud, a byddaf yn codi gyda nhw y cwestiwn penodol y mae Adam Price wedi ei godi am fodelu mewn ardal olrhain cysylltiad i weld a fyddai gwahanol gyngor yn dod i Gymru. Hyd yn hyn, nid felly y bu, ond ni ddylem ni roi'r gorau i ofyn y cwestiwn, rwy'n cytuno.

O ran cyfarpar diogelu personol, ceir caffaeliad ar sail y DU, mae cynnyrch hynny'n cael ei rannu i Gymru, i Ogledd Iwerddon, i'r Alban ac i Loegr, a'n cyfrifoldeb ni wedyn yw trosglwyddo hwnnw'n fewnol i bobl sydd ei angen. Os oes rhywun sy'n poeni am beidio â chael yr hyn sydd ei angen arno, dylai ddefnyddio'r llinell gymorth benodol sydd ar gael iddo. Fel hynny, bydd yn cael yr ateb cywir yn y modd cyflymaf posibl.

O ran y pwynt am Fanc Datblygu Cymru, rwy'n cael fy nharo'n bendant gan y neges y mae'n ei hanfon am lefel yr adfyd yn yr economi. Fel rheol, byddai Banc Datblygu Cymru yn cael tua 500 o geisiadau y flwyddyn am y math o gyllid a neilltuwyd rhyw wythnos yn ôl; cawsant 1,100 o geisiadau mewn un wythnos am y £100 miliwn hwnnw. Y newyddion da—ac, unwaith eto, hoffwn dalu teyrnged i staff y banc, oherwydd o fewn tri diwrnod, roedden nhw'n gwneud y penderfyniadau cyntaf, ac erbyn diwedd yr wythnos diwethaf, roedd yr arian cyntaf yn nwylo busnesau yng Nghymru. Yr her i Lywodraeth Cymru nawr yw gweld a oes unrhyw beth arall y gallwn ni ei wneud i ychwanegu at y gronfa honno. Fel y gall yr Aelodau sy'n gwrando ei ddeall, rwy'n siŵr, mae galwadau am gyllid o bob agwedd ar fywyd Cymru yn yr argyfwng hwn, a swm cyfyngedig o arian ar gyfer ateb yr holl alwadau hynny. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn gwasgu arian o bob poced y gallwn ni ddod o hyd iddi i geisio diwallu'r anghenion mwyaf taer hynny, a byddwn yn gwneud hynny eto yng nghyd-destun Banc Datblygu Cymru.

Yn olaf, ar bwynt Adam Price ynghylch neges unedig i'r DU cyn y penwythnos hwn, dyna oedd pwrpas fy nhrafodaethau gyda Phrif Weinidogion yr Alban a Gogledd Iwerddon yn gynharach, i geisio cael neges gyffredin. Rwy'n credu ein bod ni i gyd yn cytuno, fel y dywedais yn fy natganiad rhagarweiniol, nad oes gobaith o gwbl y bydd y mesurau hyn yr ydym ni i gyd yn gorfod eu parchu yn dod i ben ar ddiwedd y cyfnod tair wythnos hwn. Byddan nhw'n parhau yng Nghymru yr wythnos nesaf. Rwy'n credu y byddan nhw'n parhau mewn mannau eraill yn y Deyrnas Unedig, a phe gallem ni gyfleu'r un neges honno mewn ffordd gyfunol ac unedig ar draws y Deyrnas Unedig, byddai hynny, wrth gwrs, yn rhoi grym a chryfder ychwanegol iddi.

14:10

Thank you for your statement, First Minister. I would like to send my condolences to the families and friends of those who have lost loved ones to COVID-19, my best wishes also to the Prime Minister, our colleague Alun Davies, and, indeed, all those battling this disease at this moment; and my thanks to all who are involved in the fight against the disease: health workers and social care staff, shop workers, delivery drivers, prison officers, and thousands of volunteers, from dog walkers helping the vulnerable to those designing and manufacturing face shields. As the disease continues to wreak havoc throughout Wales, we know no community or person is safe, but we also know that some people still believe that coronavirus only attacks the very old or the very sick. So, my first question here is: will you ensure the Welsh Government message, moving forward, is far stronger?

Technically, we know that the elderly and those with underlying health issues are more at risk, but, at present, our hospitals are filled with people who are under the age of 60, and we also know that young children, very young children, have died through coronavirus with no underlying health issues.

I'm also concerned that not everyone who is particularly prone to this disease is being shielded, and I have been contacted by an NHS worker who flagged up the fact that motor neurone disease has not been included on the extremely vulnerable list in Wales, and measures have been taken in England and Northern Ireland to ensure that those with motor neurone disease are shielded, but there is no such mechanism in Wales. So, First Minister, will you ensure that motor neurone disease sufferers are shielded from this disease?

First Minister, will you also update the public health messaging to reaffirm that the only way people can avoid catching this disease is to avoid contact with others, unless absolutely essential? Already, some people are calling for the relaxation of some of the measures, and some are still failing to follow public health advice. We all want to return to our normal lifestyles as soon as possible, but, in reality, this is not likely to be for some time yet, and this message has to be reinforced. I ask if the Welsh Government is looking to put stronger mitigation measures in place.

First Minister, you have introduced new laws to ensure businesses comply with social distancing guidance, and I welcome the move. However, I am concerned that 'reasonable measures' is vastly open to interpretation. First Minister, why has your stance on this softened from when you first touted the measures before the weekend, and can you outline the scientific evidence that informed your decision-making process? I accept not everyone will have the luxury of staying 2m apart, but those who do not should have the best protection available to shield them from this virus.

First Minister, what steps are you taking to ensure Wales has a constant supply of PPE, especially respirators, given the move by the US to seize supplies manufactured by US firms and destined for other nations? Therefore, do the Welsh Government and UK Government have adequate supplies of non-US vital equipment? The US have enacted wartime legislation to prevent US companies exporting material and equipment needed to fight the virus. One company has developed testing that returns results within five minutes as opposed to five hours, but it's strictly restricted to the US. Faster, more reliable testing will help combat this disease so much sooner. First Minister, are you aware of any discussions with the US Government about securing the technology for use in the UK?

First Minister, efforts to combat the COVID-19 pandemic are being severely hampered by misinformation being spread on social media. Across the UK, mobile phone base stations are being destroyed in arson attacks because of conspiracy theories that are being spread about the role of 5G in this outbreak. Vaccines are also being blamed as the real cause of death across the globe. So, the longer this misinformation is allowed to spread, the greater the risk to our critical infrastructure, and the flow of data is as important to the fight against the disease as is the flow of medicines and equipment. First Minister, what discussions have you had with the US Government and social media companies about the best way to combat misinformation, and also what discussions have you had with the mobile operators about the best way of securing and protecting our vital mobile infrastructure? Diolch yn fawr.
 

Diolch am eich datganiad, Prif Weinidog. Hoffwn anfon fy nghydymdeimlad at deuluoedd a chyfeillion y rhai sydd wedi colli anwyliaid i COVID-19, ac fy nymuniadau gorau hefyd i Brif Weinidog y DU, ein cyd-Aelod Alun Davies, ac, yn wir, pawb sy'n brwydro'r clefyd hwn ar hyn o bryd; a diolch i bawb sy'n rhan o'r frwydr yn erbyn y clefyd: gweithwyr iechyd a staff gofal cymdeithasol, gweithwyr siopau, gyrwyr danfoniadau, swyddogion carchar, a miloedd o wirfoddolwyr, o gerddwyr cŵn sy'n helpu pobl agored i niwed i'r rhai sy'n dylunio a gweithgynhyrchu gwarchodwyr wyneb. Wrth i'r clwyf barhau i greu llanastr ledled Cymru, rydym ni'n gwybod nad oes yr un gymuned na pherson yn ddiogel, ond rydym ni hefyd yn gwybod bod rhai pobl yn dal i gredu bod coronafeirws yn ymosod ar bobl oedrannus iawn neu bobl sâl iawn yn unig. Felly, fy nghwestiwn cyntaf yn y fan yma yw: a wnewch chi sicrhau bod neges Llywodraeth Cymru, yn y dyfodol, yn gryfach o lawer?

Yn dechnegol, rydym ni'n gwybod bod yr henoed a'r rhai sydd â phroblemau iechyd sylfaenol mewn mwy o berygl, ond, ar hyn o bryd, mae ein hysbytai yn llawn pobl sydd o dan 60 oed, ac rydym ni hefyd yn gwybod bod plant ifanc, plant ifanc iawn, wedi marw trwy coronafeirws heb unrhyw broblemau iechyd sylfaenol.

Rwyf i hefyd yn bryderus nad yw pawb sy'n arbennig o agored i'r clefyd hwn yn cael eu diogelu, ac mae un o weithwyr y GIG wedi cysylltu â mi gan dynnu sylw at y ffaith nad yw clefyd niwronau motor wedi'i gynnwys ar y rhestr arbennig o agored i niwed yng Nghymru, a chymerwyd camau yn Lloegr a Gogledd Iwerddon i sicrhau bod y rhai sydd â chlefyd niwronau motor yn cael eu diogelu, ond nid oes mecanwaith o'r fath yng Nghymru. Felly, Prif Weinidog, a wnewch chi sicrhau bod dioddefwyr clefyd niwronau motor yn cael eu diogelu rhag y clefyd hwn?

Prif Weinidog, a wnewch chi hefyd ddiweddaru'r negeseuon iechyd cyhoeddus  i ail-bwysleisio mai'r unig ffordd y gall pobl osgoi dal y clefyd hwn yw osgoi cysylltiad ag eraill, oni bai ei fod yn gwbl hanfodol? Eisoes, mae rhai pobl yn galw am lacio rhai o'r mesurau, ac mae rhai yn dal i fethu â dilyn cyngor iechyd cyhoeddus. Rydym ni i gyd eisiau dychwelyd i'n ffordd arferol o fyw cyn gynted â phosibl, ond, mewn gwirionedd, nid yw hyn yn debygol o fod am beth amser eto, ac mae'n rhaid atgyfnerthu'r neges hon. Gofynnaf a yw Llywodraeth Cymru yn bwriadu rhoi mesurau lliniaru cryfach ar waith.

Prif Weinidog, rydych chi wedi cyflwyno deddfau newydd i sicrhau bod busnesau'n cydymffurfio â chanllawiau cadw pellter cymdeithasol, ac rwy'n croesawu'r cam. Fodd bynnag, rwy'n pryderu bod 'mesurau rhesymol' yn agored iawn i wahanol ddehongliadau. Prif Weinidog, pam mae eich safbwynt ar hyn wedi meddalu o'r adeg y gwnaethoch chi grybwyll y mesurau gyntaf cyn y penwythnos, ac a allwch chi amlinellu'r dystiolaeth wyddonol a hysbysodd eich proses o wneud y penderfyniad? Rwy'n derbyn na fydd pawb yn ddigon ffodus i allu cadw 2m oddi wrth ei gilydd, ond dylai'r bobl hynny gael y mesurau diogelu gorau sydd ar gael i'w hamddiffyn rhag y feirws hwn.

Prif Weinidog, pa gamau ydych chi'n eu cymryd i sicrhau bod gan Gymru gyflenwad cyson o gyfarpar diogelu personol, yn enwedig anadlyddion, o gofio'r cam gan yr Unol Daleithiau i atafaelu cyflenwadau a weithgynhyrchir gan gwmnïau yn yr Unol Daleithiau ac a fwriadwyd ar gyfer gwledydd eraill? Felly, a oes gan Lywodraeth Cymru a Llywodraeth y DU gyflenwadau digonol o offer hanfodol nad yw'n dod o'r Unol Daleithiau? Mae'r Unol Daleithiau wedi cyflwyno deddfwriaeth adeg rhyfel i rwystro cwmnïau'r Unol Daleithiau rhag allforio deunydd ac offer sydd eu hangen i ymladd y feirws. Mae un cwmni wedi datblygu profion sy'n rhoi canlyniadau o fewn pum munud yn hytrach na phum awr, ond maen nhw wedi eu cyfyngu'n llym i'r Unol Daleithiau. Bydd profion cyflymach a mwy dibynadwy yn helpu i frwydro'r clefyd hwn gymaint ynghynt. Prif Weinidog, a ydych chi'n ymwybodol o unrhyw drafodaethau gyda Llywodraeth yr Unol Daleithiau ynghylch sicrhau'r dechnoleg i'w defnyddio yn y DU?

Prif Weinidog, mae ymdrechion i frwydo'r pandemig COVID-19 yn cael eu llesteirio'n ddifrifol gan rannu gwybodaeth anghywir ar gyfryngau cymdeithasol. Ledled y DU, mae gorsafoedd sylfaen ffonau symudol yn cael eu dinistrio mewn pyliau o danau bwriadol oherwydd damcaniaethau cynllwyn sy'n cael eu rhannu am ran 5G yn yr argyfwng hwn. Mae brechlynnau hefyd yn cael eu beio fel achos gwirioneddol marwolaethau ledled y byd. Felly, po hiraf y caniateir i'r wybodaeth anghywir hon ledaenu, y mwyaf yw'r risg i'n seilwaith hanfodol, ac mae llif y data yr un mor bwysig i'r frwydr yn erbyn y clefyd â'r llif o feddyginiaethau ac offer. Prif Weinidog, pa drafodaethau ydych chi wedi eu cael gyda Llywodraeth yr Unol Daleithiau a chwmnïau cyfryngau cymdeithasol ynglŷn â'r ffordd orau o fynd i'r afael â gwybodaeth anghywir, a hefyd pa drafodaethau ydych chi wedi eu cael gyda'r gweithredwyr ffonau symudol am y ffordd orau o sicrhau a diogelu ein seilwaith symudol hanfodol? Diolch yn fawr.

14:15

Diolch, Caroline. I thought you set out very convincingly at the start of what you said that huge range of individuals and occupations who are engaged in the collective effort we're making here in Wales. We rightly focus on healthcare workers and social care workers, but the effort goes well beyond that, and you set that out at the start of your contribution.

Briefly, to run through some of those questions, there is a small minority of people who somehow believe that coronavirus doesn't mean them, but it's a virus that is no respecter of people or of places, and we just have to go on reminding them, and some of the difficult examples that they will have seen of individuals surely will convince them that this is not a virus that reserves itself for the elderly or for people with underlying health conditions. Anybody can get it and anybody can get it very badly.

The motor neurone disease point has been raised this morning with the chief medical officer here in Wales, and he is carrying out a piece of work immediately to see if there's anything further we need to do on that. Of course, I agree with what Caroline Jones said—that the best way to preserve yourself is to avoid contact with other people. But I do have the most enormous sympathy for people who find themselves confined to home in circumstances that are even more challenging for them than they would be for others—if you are looking after somebody with dementia, for example, who's no longer able to go out in the way that they could before; if you have a child with autism, whose life depends upon routine and regularity and being able to go to places where they know people and where life is predictable, and suddenly life is not predictable at all, and you're having to deal with all of that as well as everything you have to do yourself. So, of course I agree with what Caroline Jones said about people sticking to the rules, remaining at home, but I do think that all of us, our hearts would go out, wouldn't they, to people who are having to cope with all of that in circumstances that will be so very challenging.

On businesses and reasonable measures, we put that in there because the more we discuss this with business organisations in Wales, the more apparent it becomes the huge range of different sorts of businesses there are in Wales, and workplace settings. The huge majority of businesses in Wales already are enormously thoughtful about their workforce—as I said in my opening statement, their most important asset—are already doing everything, but we wanted to use the force of law behind the advice that has been there all along, and to bear down on that minority of businesses where people say to us—I'm sure they say to you—when they write to us as individual Members, 'I've got to go to work but I don't feel safe when I'm there', and the change in the law in Wales is designed to be on the side of those people. 

We're in a global competition for PPE. As a Welsh Government, we've had no direct discussions with the US Government, but we are sure that those discussions will be happening at a UK level. 

And just finally to say I completely recognise the point that Caroline Jones made about misinformation. That is no respecter of national boundaries, and it requires an international effort to try to make sure that we bear down on it wherever we see it. The positive advice, though, is to rely on trusted sources of advice and, here in Wales, the Public Health Wales website, the Welsh Government website, the NHS Wales websites—those are places you can go knowing that the advice you get is the product of people who know what they're talking about. Rely on that and don't get drawn into those other sources of information that we know are designed to throw people down the wrong track.

Diolch, Caroline. Roeddwn i'n meddwl eich bod chi wedi cyflwyno'n argyhoeddiadol iawn ar ddechrau'r hyn a ddywedasoch yr amrywiaeth enfawr honno o unigolion a galwedigaethau sy'n rhan o'r ymdrech gyfunol yr ydym ni'n ei gwneud yma yng Nghymru. Rydym ni'n canolbwyntio'n briodol ar weithwyr gofal iechyd a gweithwyr gofal cymdeithasol, ond mae'r ymdrech yn mynd ymhell y tu hwnt i hynny, a nodwyd hynny gennych chi ar ddechrau eich cyfraniad.

Yn gryno, i fynd drwy rhai o'r cwestiynau hynny, ceir lleiafrif bach o bobl sy'n credu rywsut nad yw coronafeirws yn berthnasol iddyn nhw, ond mae'n feirws nad yw'n parchu pobl na lleoedd, ac mae'n rhaid i ni barhau i'w hatgoffa, a siawns y bydd rhai o'r enghreifftiau anodd y byddan nhw wedi eu gweld o unigolion yn eu hargyhoeddi nad yw hwn yn feirws sy'n cadw ei hun ar gyfer yr henoed nac ar gyfer pobl â chyflyrau iechyd sylfaenol. Gall unrhyw un ei gael a gall unrhyw un ei gael yn wael iawn.

Codwyd y pwynt am glefyd niwronau motor y bore yma gyda'r prif swyddog meddygol yma yng Nghymru, ac mae'n gwneud darn o waith ar unwaith i weld a oes unrhyw beth arall y mae angen i ni ei wneud ynglŷn â hynny. Wrth gwrs, rwy'n cytuno â'r hyn a ddywedodd Caroline Jones—mai'r ffordd orau o gadw eich hun yn iach yw drwy osgoi cysylltiad â phobl eraill. Ond mae gen i'r cydymdeimlad mwyaf enfawr â phobl sy'n canfod eu hunain yn gaeth i'w cartref o dan amgylchiadau sy'n fwy heriol fyth iddyn nhw nag y bydden nhw i bobl eraill—os ydych chi'n gofalu am rywun â dementia, er enghraifft, nad yw'n gallu mynd allan mwyach, fel y gallai o'r blaen; os oes gennych chi blentyn ag awtistiaeth, y mae ei fywyd yn dibynnu ar drefn a rheoleidd-dra a gallu mynd i leoedd lle mae'n adnabod pobl a lle mae bywyd yn rhagweladwy, ac yn sydyn nid yw bywyd yn rhagweladwy o gwbl, ac rydych chi'n gorfod ymdopi â hynny i gyd yn ogystal â phopeth y mae'n rhaid i chi ei wneud eich hun. Felly, wrth gwrs fy mod i'n cytuno â'r hyn a ddywedodd Caroline Jones am bobl yn cadw at y rheolau, yn aros gartref, ond rwy'n credu y byddai pob un ohonom ni, y byddai ein calonnau'n mynd allan, oni fydden nhw, i bobl sy'n gorfod ymdopi â hynny i gyd o dan amgylchiadau a fydd mor arbennig o anodd.

O ran busnesau a mesurau rhesymol, fe wnaethom ni gynnwys hynny oherwydd po fwyaf yr ydym ni'n trafod hyn â sefydliadau busnes yng Nghymru, y mwyaf amlwg y daw'r ystod enfawr o wahanol fathau o fusnesau sydd yng Nghymru, a safleoedd gweithle. Mae'r mwyafrif helaeth o fusnesau yng Nghymru eisoes yn hynod o feddylgar ynghylch eu gweithlu—fel y dywedais yn fy natganiad agoriadol, eu hased pwysicaf—eisoes yn gwneud popeth, ond roeddem ni eisiau ddefnyddio grym y gyfraith y tu ôl i'r cyngor sydd wedi bod ar gael drwy'r amser, ac i ddylanwadu ar y lleiafrif hwnnw o fusnesau lle mae pobl yn dweud wrthym—rwy'n siŵr eu bod yn dweud wrthych chi—pan eu bod yn ysgrifennu atom fel Aelodau unigol, 'Mae'n rhaid i mi fynd i'r gwaith ond dydw i ddim yn teimlo'n ddiogel pan fydda i yno', ac mae'r newid yn y gyfraith yng Nghymru wedi ei gynllunio i fod ar ochr y bobl hynny.

Rydym ni mewn cystadleuaeth fyd-eang ar gyfer cyfarpar diogelu personol. Fel Llywodraeth Cymru, nid ydym wedi cael unrhyw drafodaethau uniongyrchol gyda Llywodraeth yr Unol Daleithiau, ond rydym yn sicr y bydd y trafodaethau hynny'n digwydd ar lefel y DU.

A dim ond i ddweud i gloi fy mod i'n llwyr gydnabod y pwynt a wnaeth Caroline Jones am wybodaeth anghywir. Nid yw hynny'n parchu ffiniau cenedlaethol, ac mae angen ymdrech ryngwladol i geisio sicrhau ein bod yn gwasgu arno pa le bynnag y byddwn yn ei weld. Y cyngor cadarnhaol, er hynny, yw dibynnu ar ffynonellau cyngor dibynadwy ac, yma yng Nghymru, gwefan Iechyd Cyhoeddus Cymru, gwefan Llywodraeth Cymru, gwefannau GIG Cymru—mae'r rhain yn lleoedd y gallwch fynd iddynt gan wybod bod y cyngor a gewch yn gynnyrch pobl sy'n gwybod am yr hyn y maen nhw'n sôn amdano. Dylech ddibynnu ar hynny a pheidio â chael eich tynnu i mewn i'r ffynonellau gwybodaeth eraill hynny y gwyddom sydd wedi eu cynllunio i daflu pobl i lawr y llwybr anghywir.

14:20

It's been a number of weeks now since Aneurin Bevan University Health Board has been a hotspot. From the statistics, we know that Newport has the highest confirmed cases in Wales per 100,000 of population. The announcement on the weekend of 7,000 critical beds is welcome, with the addition of field hospitals. In this, Aneurin Bevan health board will see the smallest numerical increase in critical beds across all Welsh health boards. With the Royal Gwent Hospital in my constituency under pressure, can you assure me that the plans are in place to ensure that support is available for Newport and Gwent patients to have access to beds, especially as we're ahead of other parts of Wales and the UK at the moment?

And, secondly, we know that carers of all ages who are living with loved ones who are self-isolating or shielding are under a great deal of pressure in these times. Many are not able to have access to the respite services that they usually have, and some are shielding with loved ones who are at the end of their life. Specifically, young carers often rely on the direct support they receive at school, and young carers are more likely to feel isolated, lonely and overburdened. What more can the Welsh Government do to ensure that our carers of all ages are not forgotten?   

Bu nifer o wythnosau erbyn hyn ers i Fwrdd Iechyd Prifysgol Aneurin Bevan fod yn ardal â nifer fawr o achosion. O'r ystadegau, rydym ni'n gwybod mai Casnewydd sydd â'r nifer fwyaf o achosion a gadarnhawyd yng Nghymru ar gyfer pob 100,000 o'r boblogaeth. Mae'r cyhoeddiad dros y penwythnos o 7,000 o welyau critigol i'w groesawu, gan ychwanegu ysbytai maes. Yn hyn o beth, bwrdd iechyd Aneurin Bevan fydd â'r cynnydd rhifiadol lleiaf i nifer y gwelyau critigol ar draws holl fyrddau iechyd Cymru. Gydag Ysbyty Brenhinol Gwent yn fy etholaeth i o dan bwysau, a allwch chi fy sicrhau i bod y cynlluniau ar waith i sicrhau bod cymorth ar gael i gleifion Casnewydd a Gwent allu cael gwelyau, yn enwedig gan ein bod ni ar y blaen i rannau eraill o Gymru a'r DU ar hyn o bryd?

Ac, yn ail, rydym ni'n gwybod bod gofalwyr o bob oed sy'n byw gydag anwyliaid sy'n hunanynysu neu sy'n gwarchod o dan lawer iawn o bwysau yn y cyfnod hwn. Nid yw llawer ohonyn nhw'n gallu cael gafael ar y gwasanaethau seibiant sydd ganddyn nhw fel arfer, ac mae rhai yn gwarchod eu hanwyliaid sydd ar ddiwedd eu hoes. Yn benodol, mae gofalwyr ifanc yn aml yn dibynnu ar y cymorth uniongyrchol y maen nhw'n ei gael yn yr ysgol, ac mae gofalwyr ifanc yn fwy tebygol o deimlo'n ynysig, yn unig ac wedi eu gorlwytho. Beth arall all Llywodraeth Cymru ei wneud i sicrhau nad yw ein gofalwyr o bob oed yn cael eu hanghofio?

Llywydd, I thank Jayne for both of those questions. Of course, there are additional beds coming on stream in the Gwent area, particularly with the acceleration into use of the Grange Hospital, which will not be a field hospital, but which will be a fully-blown and equipped hospital. But the general point I want to make is that, when we talk about the NHS, the 'N' really means something in this sort of crisis. It is a national health service, in which mutual aid and a sense of a resource in common really matters. So, the fact that there are beds being provided in Cardiff does not mean that they cannot be used for people in neighbouring areas where the need is greatest. The Cardiff City Stadium new testing facility was first used with social care staff from Gwent, because the need to provide tests to that community was the most urgent. So, we have a national health service in which we expect that those people whose needs are the most urgent will get the help that they need, and that will absolutely apply for the people of Newport and the people of Gwent. 

Jayne makes such an important point about carers. I tried to refer to it indirectly in my answer to Caroline Jones about people who remain at home in even more difficult circumstances than others. Young carers are vulnerable in their own way. That's why we've kept schools open in Wales, and those people who have caring responsibilities at such a young age, who need some respite during the day, then the youth service and our education service are alert to that. And I hope that they will be able to go on finding some help, in those really difficult circumstances, from services that are still there, still available to them, and ready and willing to help.

Llywydd, hoffwn ddiolch i Jayne am y ddau gwestiwn yna. Wrth gwrs, mae gwelyau ychwanegol yn cael eu cyflwyno yn ardal Gwent, yn enwedig gyda'r cyflymiad i'r defnydd o Ysbyty'r Grange, na fydd yn ysbyty maes, ond a fydd yn ysbyty gwirioneddol gyda'r holl gyfarpar. Ond y pwynt cyffredinol yr wyf i eisiau ei wneud yw, pan ein bod ni'n sôn am y GIG, bod yr ail 'G' wir yn golygu rhywbeth yn y math hwn o argyfwng. Gwasanaeth iechyd gwladol ydyw, lle mae cyd-gymorth a synnwyr o adnodd cyffredin yn wirioneddol bwysig. Felly, nid yw'r ffaith bod gwelyau'n cael eu darparu yng Nghaerdydd yn golygu na ellir eu defnyddio ar gyfer pobl mewn ardaloedd cyfagos lle mae mwyaf o angen. Defnyddiwyd cyfleuster profi newydd Stadiwm Dinas Caerdydd gyntaf gyda staff gofal cymdeithasol o Went, gan mai'r angen i ddarparu profion i'r gymuned honno oedd y brys mwyaf. Felly, mae gennym ni wasanaeth iechyd gwladol lle'r ydym ni'n disgwyl i'r bobl hynny y mae eu hanghenion o'r brys mwyaf gael y cymorth sydd ei angen arnynt, a bydd hynny'n sicr yn berthnasol i bobl Casnewydd ac i bobl Gwent.

Mae Jayne yn gwneud pwynt mor bwysig am ofalwyr. Ceisiais gyfeirio ato yn anuniongyrchol yn fy ateb i Caroline Jones am bobl sy'n aros gartref mewn amgylchiadau hyd yn oed anoddach nag eraill. Mae gofalwyr ifanc yn agored i niwed yn eu ffordd eu hunain. Dyna pam yr ydym ni wedi cadw ysgolion ar agor yng Nghymru, a'r bobl hynny sydd â chyfrifoldebau gofalu ar oedran mor ifanc, sydd angen ychydig o seibiant yn ystod y dydd, yna mae'r gwasanaeth ieuenctid a'n gwasanaeth addysg yn effro i hynny. Ac rwy'n gobeithio y byddan nhw'n gallu parhau i ddod o hyd i rywfaint o gymorth, o dan yr amgylchiadau gwirioneddol anodd hyn, gan wasanaethau sy'n dal i fod yno, sy'n dal ar gael iddyn nhw, ac sy'n barod ac yn fodlon i helpu.

14:25

We've now had questions from all of the political groups. I want to be able to call as many Members as possible, if we can have succinct questions from Members from now on. And please can you seek to not repeat issues that have already been asked and answered. And if I could say to the First Minister as well, please do not feel obliged to repeat an answer you've already given to previous questions. Jack Sargeant.

Rydym ni wedi cael cwestiynau gan bob un o'r grwpiau gwleidyddol erbyn hyn. Hoffwn allu galw ar gynifer o Aelodau â phosibl, os gallwn ni gael cwestiynau cryno gan yr Aelodau o hyn ymlaen. Ac a allwch chi geisio peidio ag ailadrodd materion sydd eisoes wedi eu gofyn a'u hateb os gwelwch yn dda. Ac os caf i ddweud wrth y Prif Weinidog hefyd, peidiwch â theimlo rheidrwydd i ailadrodd ateb yr ydych chi eisoes wedi ei roi i gwestiynau blaenorol. Jack Sargeant.

Thank you, Llywydd. If I may start by saying my best wishes to the Prime Minister and Alun Davies and all those who are suffering as well.

The issues I want to bring up with you directly, First Minister, are those of the self-employed. Now, the self-employed and I do welcome plans that are in place for their support. However, I am concerned about the time it will take for those avenues to be accessed. So, what can the Welsh Government do to urge the UK Government to bring forward this support for the self-employed and also to seek assurances for those who have recently become self-employed so that they will also qualify for this support?

And my second question, First Minister, relates to vulnerable people, and those who are in self-isolation who require priority delivery slots when shopping. Does the Welsh Government have any plans to work with supermarkets across Wales to help them get priority, and, if so, when are we likely to expect this to be in practice? Thank you.

Diolch, Llywydd. Os caf i ddechrau drwy anfon fy nymuniadau gorau at Brif Weinidog y DU ac at Alun Davies a phawb sy'n dioddef hefyd.

Y materion yr wyf i eisiau eu codi gyda chi yn uniongyrchol, Prif Weinidog, yw'r rhai sy'n ymwneud â phobl hunangyflogedig. Nawr, mae pobl hunangyflogedig a minnau yn croesawu cynlluniau sydd ar waith i'w cynorthwyo. Fodd bynnag, rwy'n poeni am yr amser y bydd yn ei gymryd i gael mynediad at y llwybrau hynny. Felly, beth all Llywodraeth Cymru ei wneud i annog Llywodraeth y DU i gyflymu'r cymorth hwn i bobl hunangyflogedig a hefyd i geisio sicrwydd ar gyfer y rhai sydd wedi dod yn hunangyflogedig yn ddiweddar fel y byddant hwythau hefyd yn gymwys i gael y cymorth hwn?

Ac mae fy ail gwestiwn, Prif Weinidog, yn ymwneud â phobl agored i niwed, a'r rhai sy'n hunanynysu sydd angen slotiau danfon blaenoriaethol wrth iddyn nhw siopa. A oes gan Lywodraeth Cymru unrhyw gynlluniau i weithio gydag archfarchnadoedd ledled Cymru i'w helpu i gael blaenoriaeth, ac, os felly, pryd ydym ni'n debygol o ddisgwyl i hyn fod ar waith? Diolch.

Thank you to Jack Sargeant. It’s very good to see you, Jack, after these weeks.

On the self-employed, it is a matter of concern that that help will not become available until June, and Jack is absolutely right—there is a big gap for people who didn't have returns, tax returns, that they were able to supply for 2019. I said earlier, Llywydd, that we are able to put these points directly to the UK Ministers responsible. There'll be further opportunities to do that and I'll make sure that we continue to report the concerns that Assembly Members have.

Lesley will, I’m sure, give a fuller answer in relation to vulnerable people and food. Just to be clear, across the United Kingdom, the priority slots that supermarkets are able to offer are for the shielded group, not the vulnerable group, which is much bigger than that. We concluded data agreements with supermarkets in Wales this week. That's really important—we can't release people's personal data to supermarkets without proper safeguards in place. All the data were supplied to three of the eight supermarkets yesterday. The rest of them will get it today. That means they will be able to schedule home deliveries for people in the shielded group here in Wales and we expect that to begin this week.

Diolch yn fawr i Jack Sargeant. Mae'n dda iawn eich gweld chi, Jack, ar ôl yr wythnosau diwethaf.

O ran yr hunangyflogedig, mae'n destun pryder na fydd y cymorth hwnnw ar gael tan fis Mehefin, ac mae Jack yn llygad ei le—ceir bwlch mawr i bobl nad oedd ganddyn nhw ffurflenni, ffurflenni treth, yr oedden nhw'n gallu eu cyflenwi ar gyfer 2019. Dywedais yn gynharach, Llywydd, ein bod ni'n gallu gwneud y pwyntiau hyn yn uniongyrchol i Weinidogion y DU sy'n gyfrifol. Bydd rhagor o gyfleoedd i wneud hynny a byddaf yn gwneud yn siŵr ein bod ni'n parhau i hysbysu am y pryderon sydd gan Aelodau'r Cynulliad.

Rwy'n siŵr y bydd Lesley yn rhoi ateb llawnach ynglŷn â phobl agored i niwed a bwyd. Dim ond i fod yn eglur, ar draws y Deyrnas Unedig, mae'r slotiau blaenoriaeth y gall archfarchnadoedd eu cynnig ar gyfer y grŵp sy'n cael ei warchod, nid y grŵp agored i niwed, sy'n llawer mwy na hynny. Cwblhawyd cytundebau data gennym gydag archfarchnadoedd yng Nghymru yr wythnos hon. Mae hynny'n wirioneddol bwysig—ni allwn ni rannu data personol pobl gydag archfarchnadoedd heb fod mesurau diogelu priodol ar waith. Darparwyd yr holl ddata i dair o'r wyth archfarchnad ddoe. Bydd y gweddill ohonyn nhw'n eu cael heddiw. Mae hynny'n golygu y byddan nhw'n yn gallu trefnu danfoniadau cartref i bobl yn y grŵp sy'n cael ei warchod yma yng Nghymru ac rydym ni'n disgwyl i hynny ddechrau yr wythnos hon.

First Minister, last week, there was an announcement made about field hospitals in north Wales, which obviously was very welcome indeed. But some of my constituents have pointed out to me that the number of beds in north Wales in these field hospitals is fewer than those that are planned for individual cities in the south, including Cardiff and Swansea, and they feel very much that the region may not be getting its fair share of these beds and the resources that are needed to equip them. What assurances can you provide to my constituents and others in north Wales that we are getting the appropriate resources that we need?

Another issue that we have up here in north Wales is in relation to the seasonal nature of the tourism industry, and, as a result of that, of course, there are many seasonal workers who would not have been employed by 28 February and who are, therefore, not entitled to qualify for the coronavirus job-retention scheme. Given, obviously, the significance of the tourism industry to Wales, is this something that you have identified already as a Welsh Government, and, if so, what sort of action might you be able to take in order to plug this particular gap in that scheme so that people can get the support that they need and that they rely on very much in terms of their family income?

And, just finally, one issue in relation to tuition fees, if I may, for students. Obviously, many students have been sent back home by their universities—they are now doing their courses online rather than actually being able to study in lecture theatres and in laboratories. Some students are saying that paying £9,000 per year does not represent value for money, given the current situation, and I wonder what consideration the Welsh Government has actually given to looking at reducing the tuition fees for this year, and perhaps also, looking into the next year, the additional support that might be available to help students with those costs. I think I'd be grateful for answers on those three questions. Thank you. 

Prif Weinidog, gwnaed cyhoeddiad yr wythnos diwethaf am ysbytai maes yn y gogledd, a oedd yn amlwg i'w groesawu'n fawr iawn. Ond mae rhai o'm hetholwyr wedi dweud wrthyf i bod nifer y gwelyau yn y gogledd yn yr ysbytai maes hyn yn llai na'r rhai sydd wedi eu cynllunio ar gyfer dinasoedd unigol yn y de, gan gynnwys Caerdydd ac Abertawe, ac maen nhw'n teimlo'n bendant iawn efallai nad yw'r rhanbarth yn cael ei gyfran deg o'r gwelyau hyn a'r adnoddau sydd eu hangen i'w darparu. Pa sicrwydd allwch chi ei roi i'm hetholwyr i ac i eraill yn y gogledd ein bod ni'n cael yr adnoddau priodol sydd eu hangen arnom ni?

Mae mater arall sydd gennym ni yma yn y gogledd yn ymwneud â natur dymhorol y diwydiant twristiaeth, ac, o ganlyniad i hynny, wrth gwrs, ceir llawer o weithwyr tymhorol na fydden nhw wedi bod mewn gwaith erbyn 28 Chwefror ac nad ydyn nhw, felly, yn gymwys ar gyfer y cynllun cadw swyddi drwy gyfnod y coronafeirws. O ystyried, yn amlwg, arwyddocâd y diwydiant twristiaeth i Gymru, a yw hyn yn rhywbeth yr ydych chi wedi ei nodi eisoes fel Llywodraeth Cymru, ac, os felly, pa fath o gamau y gallech chi eu cymryd i lenwi'r bwlch penodol hwn yn y cynllun hwnnw fel y gall pobl gael y cymorth sydd ei angen arnyn nhw ac y maen nhw'n dibynnu'n fawr iawn arno o ran eu hincwm teuluol?

Ac, yn olaf, un mater yn ymwneud â ffioedd dysgu, os caf i, i fyfyrwyr. Yn amlwg, mae llawer o fyfyrwyr wedi cael eu hanfon yn ôl adref gan eu prifysgolion—maen nhw'n cyflawni eu cyrsiau ar-lein erbyn hyn, yn hytrach na gallu astudio mewn theatrau darlithio ac mewn labordai. Mae rhai myfyrwyr yn dweud nad yw talu £9,000 y flwyddyn yn cynrychioli gwerth am arian, o ystyried y sefyllfa bresennol, ac rwy'n meddwl tybed pa ystyriaeth y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi ei rhoi i edrych ar ostwng y ffioedd dysgu ar gyfer eleni, ac efallai hefyd, gan edrych ar y flwyddyn nesaf, y cymorth ychwanegol a allai fod ar gael i helpu myfyrwyr gyda'r costau hynny. Rwy'n credu y byddwn yn ddiolchgar am atebion i'r tri chwestiwn hynny. Diolch.

14:30

Llywydd, I thank Darren for all three questions. Field hospital capacity in Wales is a developing picture. Vaughan's statement of 5 April was the position on that day. We continue to work with all local health boards to make sure that they have the resources that they will need. The field hospital in Cardiff will serve a population far greater than Cardiff itself. As I suggested in my answer to Jayne Bryant, it's a resource available to that wider population. But, of course, we continue to work hard with Betsi Cadwaladr and staff there to make sure that the 837 beds, I think it was, that Vaughan announced on 5 April—if more are needed then more will be planned and provided. 

It's a very good point that Darren makes on the tourism industry. Can I thank all those many tourism businesses who have put their facilities at the disposal of the coronavirus outbreak? Sometimes they are physical facilities, sometimes in encouraging their staff to take up places in care roles, because, as they say, these are very often people who are used to dealing with members of the public, they have that basic interpersonal set of skills that are really important in the care sector, and when that sector is under pressure then people who would otherwise have been working in tourism being willing to help out, I really want to recognise the efforts that have been made.

The gap in the job retention scheme is a gap that only the UK Government can plug. But I will be very happy—. And I'm sure Darren probably has more details than he was able to convey in his question, but if he wanted to pass those to me, I'm very happy indeed to make sure that that point is conveyed to people who are responsible for the scheme.

And, as far as tuition fees are concerned, our universities, like every other organisation, are under huge pressure, because they have lost income and they are anxious about the recruitment of students from elsewhere in the world and what will happen in September. But Kirsty Williams remains in very close discussion, both with them and the National Union of Students, to make sure that we hear all sides of that story and see how we can make sure that students themselves don't feel that they are being short-changed at the moment, and that, when education resumes again, if there is a need for some additional help for those people to catch up on studies that they may have lost out on, that we're absolutely aware of that. 

Llywydd, hoffwn ddiolch i Darren am bob un o'r tri chwestiwn. Mae capasiti ysbytai maes yng Nghymru yn ddarlun sy'n datblygu. Datganiad Vaughan ar 5 Ebrill oedd y sefyllfa ar y diwrnod hwnnw. Rydym yn dal i weithio gyda phob bwrdd iechyd lleol i sicrhau bod ganddyn nhw yr adnoddau y bydd arnyn nhw eu hangen. Bydd yr ysbyty maes yng Nghaerdydd yn gwasanaethu poblogaeth lawer yn fwy na Chaerdydd ei hun. Fel yr awgrymais yn fy ateb i Jayne Bryant, mae'n adnodd sydd ar gael i'r boblogaeth ehangach honno. Ond, wrth gwrs, rydym ni'n parhau i weithio'n galed gyda Bwrdd Iechyd Betsi Cadwaladr a staff y fan honno i wneud yn siŵr bod y 837 o welyau, rwy'n credu mai dyna oedd y nifer, a gyhoeddodd Vaughan ar 5 Ebrill—os oes angen mwy yna caiff mwy eu cynllunio a'u darparu.

Mae'n bwynt da iawn y mae Darren yn ei wneud am y diwydiant twristiaeth. A gaf i ddiolch i bob un o'r busnesau twristiaeth hynny sydd wedi rhoi eu cyfleusterau at wasanaeth yr ymgyrch yn erbyn y coronafeirws? Weithiau mae hynny drwy gyfleusterau diriaethol, weithiau mae hynny drwy annog eu staff i ymgymryd â swyddogaethau gofal, oherwydd, fel y maen nhw'n ei ddweud, pobl yw'r rhain yn aml iawn sydd wedi arfer ymdrin ag aelodau'r cyhoedd, mae ganddyn nhw'r gyfres ryngbersonol sylfaenol honno o sgiliau sydd yn wirioneddol bwysig yn y sector gofal, a phan fydd y sector hwnnw dan bwysau yna bydd pobl a fyddai fel arall wedi bod yn gweithio yn y maes twristiaeth yn barod i helpu, rwyf wir eisiau cydnabod yr ymdrechion a wnaed.

Mae'r bwlch yn y cynllun cadw swyddi yn fwlch na all ond Llywodraeth y DU ei lenwi. Ond byddaf yn hapus iawn—. Ac rwy'n siŵr bod gan Darren fwy o fanylion nag a allodd eu crybwyll yn ei gwestiwn, ond os hoffai drosglwyddo'r rheini i mi, rwy'n fodlon iawn i wneud yn siŵr y caiff y sylw hwnnw ei gyfleu i bobl sy'n gyfrifol am y cynllun.

Ac, o ran ffioedd dysgu, mae ein prifysgolion, fel pob sefydliad arall, o dan bwysau aruthrol, oherwydd eu bod wedi colli incwm ac maen nhw'n bryderus ynghylch recriwtio myfyrwyr o fannau eraill yn y byd a'r hyn a fydd yn digwydd ym mis Medi. Ond mae Kirsty Williams yn dal i gael trafodaeth agos iawn, gyda nhw ac Undeb Cenedlaethol y Myfyrwyr, i sicrhau ein bod yn clywed pob ochr o'r stori honno ac yn gweld sut y gallwn ni sicrhau nad yw'r myfyrwyr eu hunain yn teimlo eu bod yn cael cam ar hyn o bryd, a phan fydd addysg yn ailddechrau eto, os oes angen rhywfaint o gymorth ychwanegol ar y bobl hynny i ddod i drefn â’r astudiaethau y gallen nhw fod wedi'u colli, ein bod ni'n gwbl ymwybodol o hynny.  

First Minister, we heard yesterday that several members of staff in the Aneurin Bevan health board had received the wrong test results. Could you please indicate whether they've been re-tested and how long it'll take for all NHS and care staff to be tested with accurate results?

And related to that, the level of anxiety and trauma suffered by these members of staff and all front-line staff is considerable. By failing to provide PPE and testing, do you agree that what the Government is effectively doing is the equivalent of asking soldiers to go to war but to bring their own kitchen knives instead of weapons? And unlike soldiers, they don't have care and respite time, so they're having to take their own fear back home with them, because they're afraid they'll infect their own families. So, do you agree that, as well as the immediate steps of ensuring PPE and testing are available to all, in the future there'll need to be far more consideration of the welfare of NHS and care staff, including counselling for trauma? What are you doing now to ensure that's available and that the welfare of staff is paramount? 

Prif Weinidog, fe glywsom ni ddoe fod nifer o aelodau staff Bwrdd Iechyd Aneurin Bevan wedi cael y canlyniadau profion anghywir. A fyddech chi gystal â chadarnhau a ydyn nhw wedi cael eu hailbrofi a pha mor hir y bydd yn ei gymryd i'r GIG a'r staff gofal gael eu profi a chael y canlyniadau cywir?

Ac yn gysylltiedig â hynny, mae'r pryder a'r trallod y mae'r aelodau hyn o staff a phob aelod o staff rheng flaen yn ei ddioddef yn sylweddol iawn. Drwy fethu â darparu cyfarpar diogelu personol a phrofion, a ydych chi'n cytuno bod yr hyn y mae'r Llywodraeth yn ei wneud i bob pwrpas yn gyfystyr â gofyn i filwyr fynd i ryfel ond mynd â'u cyllyll cegin eu hunain yn lle arfau? Ac yn wahanol i filwyr, dydyn nhw ddim yn cael gofal na seibiant, felly maen nhw'n gorfod mynd â'u hofn yn ôl adref gyda nhw, oherwydd maen nhw'n ofni y byddan nhw'n heintio eu teuluoedd eu hunain. Felly, a ydych chi'n cytuno, yn ogystal â'r camau uniongyrchol o sicrhau bod cyfarpar diogelu personol a phrofion ar gael i bawb, y bydd angen yn y dyfodol rhoi llawer mwy o ystyriaeth i les y GIG a staff gofal, gan gynnwys cwnsela ar gyfer trawma? Beth ydych chi'n ei wneud nawr i sicrhau fod hynny ar gael a bod lles y staff o'r pwys mwyaf?

Well, Llywydd, I don't agree with the caricature of the position in Wales that Delyth Jewell offered. It is true that a very small number of staff in Aneurin Bevan were given the wrong test results, and that's very regrettable, but it was identified very quickly. And all of those people have been since provided with direct contact by Public Health Wales, who've investigated that no harm actually resulted from that small number of test results. I Bitterly regret the anxiety that that will have caused to those individuals, but that is a very small part of a bigger picture in which everything that can be done is being done to protect the well-being of people who are at the front line, both through PPE and by extended testing. We started testing NHS staff in Wales ahead of the rest of the United Kingdom. Our percentages of testing of staff are still ahead of other places. We want to do more, which is why we are bringing more tests online, and that is to recognise, of course, the astonishing bravery and commitment of people who provide help to other people in the most challenging of circumstances.

Where I do agree with Delyth Jewell is that this will leave an aftermath. It will leave an aftermath in the lives of people who are facing things and making decisions they never expected to be faced with, and sometimes having to do that very early on in their careers. I'm very struck at the number of people who are returning to work in the NHS, that one of the things that motivates them, after retirement, to come back in is to be able to offer their experience and their lifetime of dealing with huge difficulties, to put that at the disposal of young NHS staff, to be able to stand alongside them, to be able to offer some of that advice and guidance and a shoulder to lean on during these hard times. I think that's a very generous offer that those people are making. We'll have to systematise that as we come out the other side of coronavirus because some of these things will live on for a long time after it in the lives of people who've been on the front line.

Wel, Llywydd, dydw i ddim yn cytuno â'r darlun dychanol o'r sefyllfa yng Nghymru y mae Delyth Jewell yn ei chynnig. Mae'n wir y cafodd nifer fach iawn o staff ym Mwrdd Iechyd Aneurin Bevan y canlyniadau anghywir, ac mae hynny'n anffodus iawn, ond sylwyd ar hynny yn gyflym iawn. Ac mae Iechyd Cyhoeddus Cymru wedi cysylltu'n uniongyrchol â'r holl bobl hynny yn y cyfamser, ac wedi ymchwilio i'r ffaith na ddeilliodd unrhyw niwed mewn gwirionedd o'r nifer fechan honno o ganlyniadau profion. Rwy'n gresynu'n arw at y pryder y bydd hynny wedi'i achosi i'r unigolion hynny, ond mae hynny'n rhan fach iawn o ddarlun ehangach lle mae popeth y gellir ei wneud yn cael ei wneud i ddiogelu lles pobl sydd ar y rheng flaen, drwy gyfarpar diogelu personol a phrofion estynedig. Fe wnaethom ni ddechrau profi staff y GIG yng Nghymru cyn gweddill y Deyrnas Unedig. Mae ein canrannau profi staff yn parhau i fod yn well na mannau eraill. Rydym ni eisiau gwneud mwy, a dyna pam yr ydym ni'n cyflwyno mwy o brofion ar-lein, ac mae hynny er mwyn cydnabod, wrth gwrs, dewrder ac ymrwymiad rhyfeddol pobl sy'n rhoi cymorth i bobl eraill yn yr amgylchiadau mwyaf heriol.

Y lle yr wyf yn cytuno â Delyth Jewell yw y bydd goblygiadau i hyn. Bydd hyn yn effeithio ar fywydau pobl sy'n wynebu pethau ac yn gwneud penderfyniadau nad oedden nhw byth yn disgwyl y byddent yn eu hwynebu, ac weithiau'n gorfod gwneud hynny'n gynnar iawn yn eu gyrfaoedd. Mae nifer y bobl sy'n dychwelyd i weithio yn y GIG wedi creu argraff fawr arnaf, gan mai un o'r pethau sy'n eu cymell, ar ôl ymddeol, i ddychwelyd i'r maes yw gallu cynnig eu profiad a'u hoes o ymdrin ag anawsterau enfawr, i gynnig y profiad hwnnw i staff ifanc y GIG, i allu cyd-sefyll â nhw, i allu cynnig rhywfaint o'r cyngor a'r arweiniad hwnnw ac i fod yn gefn iddyn nhw yn ystod y cyfnod anodd hwn. Rwy'n credu bod hynny'n gynnig hael iawn ar ran y bobl hynny. Bydd yn rhaid i ni gael rhyw drefn i hynny ar ôl i ni oresgyn y gwaethaf o'r coronafeirws oherwydd bydd rhai o'r pethau hyn yn parhau am amser hir wedi hynny ym mywydau pobl sydd wedi bod ar y rheng flaen.

14:35

First Minister, can I first of all thank you for your efforts and your Ministers and, indeed, your officials over the course of the last few weeks, and also extend that thanks to those in Government outside Wales as well? It's a hugely difficult situation. The Prime Minister, I'm sure, has our best wishes, and my old friend and colleague Alun Davies has already been mentioned, and I add to all that's been said about him. I also know what it's like to receive advice that's not always uniform, that sometimes is not wholly in agreement with other sets of advice, and how difficult it can be to choose which advice to follow.

Two things from me. In my constituency of Bridgend, I have the town of Porthcawl. Porthcawl, of course, is a large tourist destination, very busy usually at Easter time. If you go down Danygraig hill, such are the times we live in, you'll see a sign that says 'Welcome to Porthcawl' and then a few yards down the road a sign that says 'Please turn back and go home', and rightly so, given the situation we find ourselves in. First Minister, would you join me in begging people—if that is the right word—to stay home this weekend, not to travel in the usual fashion to places like Porthcawl, in order to make sure that people in that town and beyond are properly protected from the spread of the virus? Of course, we all hope that people, as they have been, will obey the advice they have been given. There are still instances where I've seen small groups of younger people—four or five usually—congregating together, and that will need to be dealt with. But there are, of course, many of us who are there providing support for older relatives, and if there is a need to increase the restrictions that we have at the moment in future, could I ask you to make sure that that doesn’t adversely affect those of us who are in that situation?

The second point, very quickly from me then, is this: I've noticed by going to various different food shops that different approaches are taken by different shops. It's pretty universal now, actually, that you have to wait outside until it is your turn to go in. There's spacing inside the supermarkets and a particular one-way system for going around the supermarket or the shop, but in some shops, trolleys and baskets are sanitized before being made available to a customer and are sanitized when they are returned. In other shops that isn't happening at all. Where should supermarkets and food shops go for advice, in terms of best practice, when it comes to protecting their customers to the level that they and their customers would expect? Diolch, Llywydd.

Prif Weinidog, a gaf i yn gyntaf ddiolch i chi am eich ymdrechion ac i'ch Gweinidogion ac, yn wir, i'ch swyddogion yn ystod yr wythnosau diwethaf, a hefyd estyn y diolch hwnnw i'r rheini yn y Llywodraethau y tu allan i Gymru hefyd? Mae'n sefyllfa hynod anodd. Rydym ni'n dymuno'r gorau i Brif Weinidog y DU, rwy'n siŵr, ac mae fy hen gyfaill a'm cyd-Aelod Alun Davies wedi ei grybwyll eisoes, ac rwy'n ategu'r cwbl a ddywedwyd amdano. Rwyf hefyd yn gwybod sut beth yw derbyn cyngor nad yw bob amser yr un fath, nad yw weithiau'n cytuno'n llwyr â chyngor blaenorol a gafwyd, a pha mor anodd y gall hi fod i ddewis pa gyngor i'w ddilyn.

Dau beth gennyf i. Yn fy etholaeth i, sef Pen-y-bont ar Ogwr, mae tref Porthcawl. Mae Porthcawl, wrth gwrs, yn gyrchfan fawr i dwristiaid, yn brysur iawn fel arfer ar adeg y Pasg. Os ewch i lawr Allt Danygraig, oherwydd y cyfnod yr ydym ni ynddo, fe welwch chi arwydd sy'n dweud 'Croeso i Borthcawl' ac yna ychydig lathenni i lawr y ffordd arwydd sy'n dweud 'Trowch yn ôl ac ewch adref', a hynny'n briodol, o ystyried y sefyllfa yr ydym ni ynddi. Prif Weinidog, a wnewch chi ategu fy erfyniad—os mai dyna'r gair cywir—i bobl aros gartref y penwythnos yma, i beidio â theithio yn y modd arferol i leoedd fel Porthcawl, er mwyn sicrhau y caiff pobl yn y dref honno a thu hwnt eu diogelu'n briodol rhag lledaeniad y feirws? Wrth gwrs, rydym ni i gyd yn gobeithio y bydd pobl, fel y buon nhw, yn ufuddhau i'r cyngor a roddwyd iddynt. Mae achosion o hyd lle'r wyf wedi gweld grwpiau bach o bobl iau—pedwar neu bump fel arfer—yn ymgasglu gyda'i gilydd, a bydd angen ymdrin â hynny. Ond mae llawer ohonom ni, wrth gwrs, mewn sefyllfaoedd lle yr ydym ni'n darparu cymorth i berthnasau hŷn, ac os oes angen cynyddu'r cyfyngiadau sydd gennym ni ar hyn o bryd yn y dyfodol, a gaf i ofyn i chi wneud yn siŵr nad yw hynny'n effeithio'n andwyol ar y rheini ohonom ni sydd yn y sefyllfa honno?

Yr ail bwynt, yn gyflym iawn gennyf i felly, yw hwn: rwyf wedi sylwi drwy fynd i wahanol siopau bwyd amrywiol bod gwahanol siopau'n mynd ati mewn gwahanol ffyrdd. Mae'n eithaf cyffredinol nawr, mewn gwirionedd, bod yn rhaid i chi aros y tu allan nes daw eich tro chi i fynd i mewn. Mae marciau y tu mewn i'r archfarchnadoedd a system unffordd benodol ar gyfer mynd o amgylch yr archfarchnad neu'r siop, ond mewn rhai siopau, caiff trolïau a basgedi eu glanhau cyn iddyn nhw fod ar gael i gwsmer ac fe gânt eu glanhau pan gânt eu dychwelyd. Mewn siopau eraill nid yw hynny'n digwydd o gwbl. I ble y dylai archfarchnadoedd a siopau bwyd fynd i gael cyngor, o ran yr arferion gorau, o ran amddiffyn eu cwsmeriaid i'r graddau y bydden nhw a'u cwsmeriaid yn eu disgwyl? Diolch, Llywydd.

Diolch, Llywydd, and thank you very much to Carwyn Jones for those questions and for just allowing me to say very briefly that the pressures of coronavirus are felt in every part of our lives, including in the Welsh Government. I am in Cathays Park today. There is a tiny number of people here compared to the normal number you would see working physically in the Welsh Government. They are people working very long hours, making some very challenging decisions, and I'm immensely grateful to the huge efforts that they are making to enable us to put in place a whole range of things that Members have been asking me about this afternoon.

The message to people thinking of going to Porthcawl or other places over the weekend is, 'Just don’t do it. Go outside, by all means, but stay local to where you live, stay away from other people and don’t think that this is the right moment to pose a risk to yourselves and a risk to others by doing things that you know are outside the guidelines that we are all required to abide by.'

If there is a need for increased enforcement, if that day comes and the police advise us of it, we will pursue that with them. I hope it won’t be advice that says we have to clamp down even further on the very limited opportunities that people have to be outside their own homes. It would be a great, great shame if the actions of just a few people were to place those restrictions on the very many people who are working so hard to do the right thing already.

As far as food shops are concerned, Lesley will be answering questions after me and she’ll have heard what the former First Minister has said. I know that she meets weekly with the food industry and the retailers here in Wales every Monday. It’s a forum in which those sorts of issues of common standards and common practices can be explored. I completely agree with what Carwyn Jones said that you can already see in some aspects that sort of standardisation beginning to happen, but there are other examples of the sort that he raised that I know can be discussed there.

Diolch Llywydd, a diolch i Carwyn Jones am y cwestiynau yna ac am adael i mi ddweud yn fras iawn y caiff y pwysau o ran y coronafeirws ei deimlo ym mhob rhan o'n bywydau, gan gynnwys yn Llywodraeth Cymru. Rwyf ym Mharc Cathays heddiw. Mae nifer bychan iawn o bobl yma o'i gymharu â'r nifer arferol y byddech yn ei weld yn gweithio yn adeilad Llywodraeth Cymru. Maen nhw'n bobl sy'n gweithio oriau hir iawn, yn gwneud rhai penderfyniadau heriol iawn, ac rwy'n hynod ddiolchgar am yr ymdrechion enfawr y maen nhw yn eu gwneud i'n galluogi ni i roi amrywiaeth eang o bethau ar waith y mae'r Aelodau wedi bod yn fy holi yn eu cylch y prynhawn yma.

Y neges i bobl sy'n ystyried mynd i Borthcawl neu leoedd eraill dros y penwythnos yw, 'Peidiwch â gwneud y fath beth. Ewch allan, ar bob cyfrif, ond arhoswch yn lleol i'r ardal lle yr ydych chi'n byw ynddi, cadwch draw oddi wrth bobl eraill a pheidiwch â meddwl mai dyma'r adeg briodol i'ch peryglu eich hunan nac i beryglu eraill drwy wneud pethau yr ydych chi'n gwybod sydd y tu hwnt i'r canllawiau y mae'n ofynnol i ni i gyd lynu wrthynt.'

Os oes angen mwy o orfodaeth, os daw'r diwrnod hwnnw a bod yr heddlu'n ein cynghori ni felly, byddwn yn cydweithio gyda nhw yn hynny o beth. Rwy'n gobeithio na fydd yn gyngor sy'n dweud bod yn rhaid i ni gyfyngu mwy fyth ar y cyfleoedd cyfyngedig iawn sydd ar gael i bobl y tu allan i'w cartrefi eu hunain. Byddai'n drueni mawr pe bai gweithredoedd ychydig o bobl yn unig yn gosod y cyfyngiadau hynny ar y nifer mawr iawn o bobl sy'n gweithio mor galed i wneud y peth iawn eisoes.

O ran siopau bwyd, bydd Lesley yn ateb cwestiynau ar fy ôl i a bydd wedi clywed yr hyn a ddywedodd y cyn Brif Weinidog. Gwn ei bod yn cwrdd bob wythnos â'r diwydiant bwyd a'r manwerthwyr yma yng Nghymru bob dydd Llun. Mae'n fforwm lle gellir gwyntyllu'r mathau hynny o faterion sy'n ymwneud â safonau cyffredin ac arferion cyffredin. Cytunaf yn llwyr â'r hyn a ddywedodd Carwyn Jones eich bod eisoes yn gallu gweld mewn rhai agweddau y math hwnnw o safoni'n dechrau digwydd, ond ceir enghreifftiau eraill o'r fath a grybwyllodd y gwn y gellir eu trafod yn y fan yna.

14:40

Two final questions, and the first by Mark Isherwood.

Dau gwestiwn olaf, a'r cyntaf gan Mark Isherwood.

What policy or guidance has the Welsh Government issued regarding provision for critical workers to access educational childcare settings for their children? A number of contacts have been made with me, by or on behalf of critical NHS staff living in Flintshire, who have been told that both parents have to be critical workers to qualify, one of whom has had to stay at home rather than join a clinical team, another is living apart from her children and husband in accommodation provided by Glyndŵr University in order to access her shifts at Wrexham Maelor.

Finally, how do you respond to the call by TCC, Trefnu Cymunedol Cymru—Together Creating Communities—Wrexham-based but representing a coalition of community bodies, regarding provision of free school meals for eligible pupils during the crisis? They’re asking for cash to be provided directly to parents or carers so that they can freely purchase food for their families where they believe the grab-and-go systems are forcing the poorest families to take unnecessary risks. The voucher scheme in England doesn’t include all supermarket chains and they’re concerned the voucher scheme in Wales may mean that supermarkets are not accessible for all families in receipt of free school meals, and they believe the provision of cash allows for shopping to be done at local shops, supporting social distancing by reducing the need to travel to supermarkets.

Pa bolisi neu ganllawiau y mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi'u cyhoeddi ynghylch sicrhau y gall gweithwyr allweddol anfon eu plant i leoliadau sy'n cynnig darpariaeth gofal addysgol? Mae nifer o bobl wedi cysylltu â mi, yn staff hanfodol y GIG sy'n byw yn Sir y Fflint, neu bobl yn siarad ar eu rhan, y dywedwyd wrthyn nhw bod yn rhaid i'r ddau riant fod yn weithwyr hanfodol i fod yn gymwys, ac mae un ohonyn nhw wedi gorfod aros gartref yn hytrach nag ymuno â thîm clinigol, ac mae rhywun arall yn byw ar wahân i'w phlant a'i gŵr mewn llety a ddarperir gan Brifysgol Glyndŵr er mwn gallu mynd i'w gwaith yn Ysbyty Maelor Wrecsam. 

Yn olaf, sut ydych chi'n ymateb i'r alwad gan TCC, Trefnu Cymunedol Cymru—Together Creating Communities—sydd â'u swyddfa yn Wrecsam ond sy'n cynrychioli clymblaid o gyrff cymunedol, ynghylch darparu prydau ysgol am ddim i ddisgyblion cymwys yn ystod yr argyfwng? Maen nhw'n gofyn i arian parod gael ei ddarparu'n uniongyrchol i rieni neu ofalwyr er mwyn iddyn nhw allu prynu bwyd yn rhwydd i'w teuluoedd os ydyn nhw'n credu bod y systemau bachu a mynd yn gorfodi'r teuluoedd tlotaf i beryglu eu hunain yn ddiangen. Nid yw'r cynllun talebau yn Lloegr yn cynnwys pob cadwyn o archfarchnadoedd ac maen nhw'n poeni y gall y cynllun talebau yng Nghymru olygu nad yw archfarchnadoedd yn hygyrch i bob teulu sy'n cael prydau ysgol am ddim, ac maen nhw'n credu bod darparu arian parod yn caniatáu siopa mewn siopau lleol, gan gefnogi pobl i gadw pellter cymdeithasol drwy leihau'r angen i deithio i archfarchnadoedd.

I thank Mark Isherwood for both of those important points. In relation to childcare and critical workers, on 6 April Julie Morgan issued a statement explaining how we are changing the childcare offer here in Wales. We’re closing it to new applicants in the current circumstances and we are allowing the money that would have been needed for those previous applicants to be diverted to make sure that childcare can be available at no cost to children of critical workers from the age of nought to five. The detail is set out in the statement. If there are questions beyond the statement that Members have, then I know that Julie will be very pleased to try and respond to them.

On cash for free school meals, well, of course I agree entirely with that principle. I would rather the families had the money they needed to be able to provide food for their children. The right way to do it is through child benefits. The UK Government should agree that in these circumstances they will put an extra amount of money in the child benefit that goes with the child that lands in those families that need it the most and would allow them to do it.

In Wales, we will move to a system where a sum will be provided through vouchers. There will be a BACS transfer of money from the Welsh Government to those families where that is feasible. Personally, I continue to believe that there will be a need for some residual direct provision. We know that there are some families whose circumstances are so difficult and where parents struggle so much with other issues in their lives that we could not be absolutely confident that money going into that household would find its way into food for children. For some very vulnerable children, I think there may still be the need for some residual system in which we can be confident that food itself is being provided, so that those children can be sure of being able to eat.

Diolch i Mark Isherwood am y ddau bwynt pwysig yna. O ran gofal plant a gweithwyr hanfodol, ar 6 Ebrill cyhoeddodd Julie Morgan ddatganiad yn esbonio sut yr ydym ni'n newid y cynnig gofal plant yma yng Nghymru. Rydym yn ei gau i ymgeiswyr newydd o dan yr amgylchiadau presennol ac rydym yn caniatáu dargyfeirio'r arian a fyddai wedi bod ei angen ar gyfer yr ymgeiswyr blaenorol hynny i wneud yn siŵr y gall gofal plant fod ar gael heb ddim cost i blant gweithwyr allweddol o ddim i bump oed. Mae'r manylion yn y datganiad. Os oes cwestiynau y tu hwnt i'r datganiad sydd gan yr Aelodau, yna rwy'n gwybod y bydd Julie yn falch iawn o geisio ymateb iddyn nhw.

O ran arian ar gyfer prydau ysgol am ddim, wel, wrth gwrs, cytunaf yn llwyr â'r egwyddor honno. Byddai'n well gennyf i'r teuluoedd gael yr arian yr oedd ei angen arnyn nhw i allu darparu bwyd ar gyfer eu plant. Y ffordd gywir i'w wneud yw trwy fudd-daliadau plant. O dan yr amgylchiadau hyn, dylai Llywodraeth y DU gytuno y bydd yn rhoi swm ychwanegol o arian yn y budd-dal plant sy'n berthnasol i'r plentyn penodol hwnnw, i'r teuluoedd hynny sydd ei angen fwyaf ac a fyddai'n caniatáu iddyn nhw wneud hynny.

Yng Nghymru, byddwn yn defnyddio system lle caiff swm ei ddarparu drwy dalebau. Bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn trosglwyddo arian fel taliad BACS i'r teuluoedd hynny lle bo hynny'n ymarferol. Yn bersonol, rwy'n parhau i gredu y bydd angen rhywfaint o ddarpariaeth uniongyrchol yn ychwanegol at hynny. Gwyddom fod rhai teuluoedd y mae eu hamgylchiadau mor anodd a lle mae rhieni'n ymgodymu cymaint â materion eraill yn eu bywydau fel na allem ni fod yn gwbl ffyddiog y cai'r arian a roddir i'r aelwyd honno ei wario ar fwyd i blant. I rai plant sy'n agored iawn i niwed, rwy'n credu y gallai fod angen rhyw fath o system ychwanegol o hyd lle gallwn ni fod yn ffyddiog y caiff bwyd ei ddarparu mewn gwirionedd, fel y caiff y plant hynny fwyd.

14:45

I want to ask you a little bit about enforcement of the social distancing legislation in the workplace, and I suppose in doing so also put on record the tremendous work that our trade unions are actually doing in contributing to that. The efforts with the branches, the union representatives, the safety representatives, working alongside their employers, their businesses, I think are making a very, very significant contribution to that safety. And it's indicative, I think, that most of the enquiries that we are getting about workers who are concerned about their workplace safety are really coming from workplaces that don't have trade unions. Perhaps there's a lesson there for the future.

But in terms of the enforcement, it's very clear that this is not a matter for the police; they've said themselves that they are not competent to deal with workplace safety matters. One of the concerns I have is the role the Health and Safety Executive has been able to play—not so much the people working for the Health and Safety Executive, but of course it is an organisation that has been massively underfunded over the years. I would have thought that the Health and Safety Executive would be playing a key role in workplace safety.

This isn't a devolved body, but clearly it has a very important role. It has incredible enforcement powers, it has investigation powers, it has all sorts of advice powers and, in fact, prosecution powers. So, my first question would be: what engagement have you actually had with the UK Government and/or with the Health and Safety Executive in order to ensure that they maximise their input into this really important role of enforcement of social distancing within the workplace and in general with regard to workplace safety?

The second question I'd just like to ask about is this—it's been commented on a little bit in the media over the weekend—and that is: we will collectively get through this crisis, and I've been wondering what your thoughts are on, when we do get through this crisis, that we have a complete new evaluation of the importance of our NHS, of our public sector workers, and the investment in those services.

I know, if I was ill, I wouldn't want a hedge fund manager sat by my bedside looking after me. It's given us a completely new evaluation of our public sector, and we've really got to start valuing them, not just in terms of, of course, we clap them in the evening, and we say nice things, but in the future we're going to have to start looking at a real calibration of what is important in our society. Perhaps the first step for Welsh Government would be something like the social partnership legislation that is being proposed. I wonder what your thoughts are about what preparations are necessary for the, I think, economic difficulties that we are going to face when we are eventually through this pandemic.

Rwyf eisiau eich holi ychydig am orfodi'r ddeddfwriaeth cadw pellter cymdeithasol yn y gweithle, ac wrth wneud hynny mae'n debyg yr hoffwn i hefyd gydnabod ar goedd y gwaith aruthrol y mae ein hundebau llafur yn ei wneud mewn gwirionedd o ran cyfrannu at hynny. Mae'r ymdrechion gyda'r canghennau, cynrychiolwyr yr undebau, y cynrychiolwyr diogelwch, sy'n gweithio ochr yn ochr â'u cyflogwyr, eu busnesau, yn gwneud cyfraniad pwysig iawn i'r diogelwch hwnnw. Ac mae'n dweud cyfrolau, rwy'n credu, fod y rhan fwyaf o'r ymholiadau yr ydym yn eu cael am weithwyr sy'n pryderu am eu diogelwch yn y gweithle yn dod o weithleoedd sydd heb undebau llafur. Efallai bod gwers yn y fan yna ar gyfer y dyfodol.

Ond o ran y gorfodi, mae'n glir iawn nad mater i'r heddlu yw hyn; maen nhw wedi dweud eu hunain nad ydyn nhw'n gymwys i ymdrin â materion diogelwch yn y gweithle. Un o'r pryderon sydd gennyf yw'r hyn y mae'r Awdurdod Gweithredol Iechyd a Diogelwch wedi gallu ei wneud o ran ei swyddogaeth—nid yn gymaint y bobl sy'n gweithio i'r Awdurdod Gweithredol Iechyd a Diogelwch, ond wrth gwrs mae'n sefydliad sydd wedi'i danariannu'n aruthrol dros y blynyddoedd. Byddwn wedi tybio y byddai gan yr Awdurdod Gweithredol Iechyd a Diogelwch swyddogaeth allweddol o ran diogelwch yn y gweithle.

Nid corff datganoledig mo hwn, ond mae'n amlwg bod ganddo swyddogaeth bwysig iawn. Mae ganddo bwerau gorfodi anhygoel, mae ganddo bwerau ymchwilio, mae ganddo bob math o bwerau cynghori ac, mewn gwirionedd, pwerau erlyn. Felly, fy nghwestiwn cyntaf fyddai: pa drafodaethau ydych chi wedi eu cael mewn gwirionedd â Llywodraeth y DU a/neu gyda'r Awdurdod Gweithredol Iechyd a Diogelwch er mwyn sicrhau eu bod yn cyfrannu cymaint â phosib at y swyddogaeth wirioneddol bwysig hon o orfodi cadw pellter cymdeithasol yn y gweithle ac yn gyffredinol o ran diogelwch yn y gweithle?

Yr ail gwestiwn yr hoffwn i ei ofyn yw hyn—bu peth sôn yn ei gylch yn y cyfryngau dros y penwythnos—sef: byddwn yn goresgyn yr argyfwng hwn gyda'n gilydd, ac rwyf wedi bod yn pendroni beth yw eich barn, pan fyddwn ni wedi goresgyn yr argyfwng hwn, bod gennym ni werthusiad cwbl newydd o bwysigrwydd ein GIG, o'n gweithwyr yn y sector cyhoeddus, a'r buddsoddiad yn y gwasanaethau hynny.

Rwy'n gwybod, pe bawn i'n sâl, na fyddwn i eisiau rheolwr cronfa rhagfantoli yn eistedd wrth erchwyn y gwely yn gofalu amdanaf. Mae wedi rhoi gwerthusiad hollol newydd i ni o'n sector cyhoeddus, ac mae'n rhaid i ni ddechrau eu gwerthfawrogi, nid yn unig o ran, wrth gwrs, rydym yn curo dwylo iddyn nhw gyda'r nos, ac rydym ni'n dweud pethau caredig, ond yn y dyfodol bydd rhaid i ni ddechrau cloriannu mewn difrif calon yr hyn sy'n bwysig yn ein cymdeithas. Efallai mai'r cam cyntaf i Lywodraeth Cymru fyddai rhywbeth fel y ddeddfwriaeth partneriaeth gymdeithasol sy'n cael ei chynnig. Tybed beth yw eich barn ynghylch pa baratoadau sy'n angenrheidiol ar gyfer yr anawsterau economaidd, yr wyf yn credu, y byddwn yn eu hwynebu pan fyddwn ni o'r diwedd wedi trechu'r pandemig hwn.

Llywydd, I thank Mick for both those questions. On enforcement, he's right, the Health and Safety Executive has very important responsibilities, but a decade into austerity its ability to discharge those responsibilities has been really compromised. It just doesn't have the resources to do the job it's asked to do. We hope it will make its contribution in Wales.

Generally, I hope that the 2m rule won't rely in the end on enforcement. I hope it will be self-policing. I hope that it will send that message to employers of the importance that they must attach to the health and well-being of their employees. The best policing of it will be by the people in the workplace. They will be the eyes and ears of this arrangement. There are enforcement rules within the regulations. People can be fined and so on. I met the TUC general council in Wales earlier this week—virtually, in the way we are now—and I know that trade unions will be the eyes and ears of the workforce in the workplace. I hope it won't come to enforcement, I hope people will recognise the obligation that most other employers have already recognised to put the health and well-being of their employees at the top of the list, and our regulations just reinforce that.

I'm allergic to the phrase that I hear and read occasionally of, 'When everything gets back to normal', because I think the crisis tells us we don't want to just go back to what was normal before. Surely, we recognise that the only way that we are getting through this whole experience together is by collective and co-operative effort rather than by competition between one another.

I think it also tells us that, when we are absolutely up against it in this way, the people who we rely on to get us all through it are not very highly paid people who worry about whether their bonuses and their dividends will be safe during the crisis. We rely on the people who collect our bins, who look after our elderly people, who are the brave people who do the jobs in health and social care, and the many others that Caroline Jones mentioned in her introduction. I don't want to go back to a world in which those people just return to the obscurity of our priorities and other people just pick up from where they left off. There are real lessons for us all to learn from this experience. It's never too early, I think, to begin to be thinking about that.

Llywydd, hoffwn ddiolch i Mick am y ddau gwestiwn yna. O ran gorfodaeth, mae'n llygad ei le, mae gan yr Awdurdod Gweithredol Iechyd a Diogelwch gyfrifoldebau pwysig iawn, ond degawd ers dechrau cyni mae ei allu i gyflawni'r cyfrifoldebau hynny wedi'i danseilio mewn gwirionedd. Nid oes ganddo'r adnoddau i wneud y gwaith y gofynnir iddo ei wneud. Gobeithiwn y bydd yn gwneud ei gyfraniad yng Nghymru.

Yn gyffredinol, rwy'n gobeithio na fydd y rheol 2m yn dibynnu yn y pen draw ar orfodaeth. Gobeithio y bydd yn fater o hunan-blismona. Gobeithio y bydd yn cyfleu'r neges honno i gyflogwyr am y pwysigrwydd y mae'n rhaid iddyn nhw ei roi i iechyd a lles eu gweithwyr. Y bobl yn y gweithle fydd yn plismona hynny orau. Nhw fydd llygaid a chlustiau'r trefniant hwn. Ceir rheolau gorfodi yn y rheoliadau. Gall pobl gael dirwy ac yn y blaen. Cyfarfûm â chyngor cyffredinol y TUC yng Nghymru yn gynharach yr wythnos hon—yn rhithwir, fel yr ydym ni'n cyfarfod nawr—ac rwy'n gwybod mai undebau llafur fydd llygaid a chlustiau'r gweithlu yn y gweithle. Gobeithio na fydd angen gorfodi, gobeithio y bydd pobl yn cydnabod y rhwymedigaeth y mae'r rhan fwyaf o gyflogwyr eraill eisoes wedi'i chydnabod i roi iechyd a lles eu gweithwyr ar frig y rhestr, ac mae ein rheoliadau'n atgyfnerthu hynny.

Rwy'n gwingo wrth glywed yr ymadrodd yr wyf yn ei glywed ac yn ei ddarllen yn achlysurol, 'pan fydd popeth yn ôl i drefn', oherwydd credaf fod yr argyfwng yn dweud wrthym ni nad oes arnom ni eisiau dychwelyd i'r hyn a oedd yn arferol o'r blaen. Heb os nac oni bai, rydym ni'n cydnabod mai'r unig ffordd y down ni drwy'r holl brofiad hwn gyda'n gilydd yw drwy gyd-ymdrech a chydweithredu yn hytrach na chystadlu yn erbyn ein gilydd.

Credaf fod hyn hefyd yn dweud wrthym ni, pan fyddwn mewn cyfyng gyngor mawr fel hyn, y bobl yr ydym yn dibynnu arnyn nhw i'n cario ni i gyd drwy'r cyfan yw nid y bobl â chyflogau breision iawn sy'n poeni a fydd eu bonysau a'u difidendau'n ddiogel yn ystod yr argyfwng. Dibynnwn ar y bobl sy'n casglu ein biniau, sy'n gofalu am ein henoed, y bobl ddewr sy'n gweithio yn y maes iechyd a gofal cymdeithasol, a'r llu o rai eraill y soniodd Caroline Jones amdanyn nhw yn ei chyflwyniad. Dydw i ddim eisiau dychwelyd i fyd lle mae'r bobl hynny'n dychwelyd at aneglurder ein blaenoriaethau a phobl eraill yn ail-ddechrau lle gadwon nhw bethau. Mae gwersi gwirioneddol i ni i gyd eu dysgu o'r profiad hwn. Nid yw hi byth yn rhy gynnar, rwy'n credu, i ddechrau meddwl am hynny.

14:50

Diolch i'r Prif Weinidog. Ymddiheuriadau i'r naw Aelod na fues i'n ffodus i fedru cael yr amser i'w galw nhw. 

I thank the First Minister. Apologies to the nine Members whom I was unfortunately unable to call. 

3. Datganiad gan Weinidog yr Amgylchedd, Ynni a Materion Gwledig: Ymateb i'r Coronafeirws (COVID-19)
3. Statement by the Minister for Environment, Energy and Rural Affairs: Response to Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Yr eitem nesaf, felly, yw'r datganiad gan Weinidog yr Amgylchedd, Ynni a Materion Gwledig ar yr ymateb i coronafeirws. Rwy'n galw ar y Gweinidog i wneud ei datganiad—Lesley Griffiths.

The next item is a statement by the Minister for Environment, Energy and Rural Affairs on the response to coronavirus. I call on the Minister to make the statement—Lesley Griffiths.

Diolch, Llywydd. We are facing a global pandemic, the like of which we have not seen before. This is an extremely worrying time for all families across Wales, including those in our rural, coastal and farming communities. My thoughts go out to all who are affected.

Before and since my planned oral statement of 24 March, which was postponed by agreement of the Business Committee, my officials and I have been working hard to engage with and support those working in our food sectors, on safeguarding our environment, and on ensuring critical infrastructure and infection control continue to operate for the people of Wales.

On 16 March, I hosted a round-table meeting bringing together the views of Wales's farmers, fishers, foresters and food and drink producers. This proved crucial for planning and tackling the immediate challenges across my portfolio. Since then, I've been working to ensure continuity of food supplies, working closely with the UK Government, the UK retailer forum, the food contingency emergency liaison group and the Food and Drink Wales Industry Board, amongst others.

In addition, I have been working with the agricultural resilience group—I met them last week and there is another round-table discussion next week. My officials are in daily contact with stakeholders. The intelligence and outputs from the ARG are feeding into Welsh Government thinking on how best to deal with the impact of the escalating measures to manage the COVID-19 outbreak.

I can assure Members that retailers and supply chains are meeting the challenge. Our food stores are being restocked irrespective of their location. I want to sincerely thank the retail workforce for their hard work.

More than 85,000 people in Wales have been sent a letter by the Chief Medical Officer for Wales because they have a specific pre-existing, long-term health condition, which means they are at a very high risk of severe illness from coronavirus due to a serious underlying health issue. They've been asked to undertake a series of shielding measures, including staying at home for 12 weeks.

On 3 April, I joined the Minister for Housing and Local Government in announcing the delivery of the first food boxes to the doorsteps of eligible people who cannot rely on family or friends to help them. The Welsh Government has made £15 million available for the direct delivery food scheme. The food boxes, which people request from their local authority, provide essential foods in packages and tins for one person who is shielding for one week. In addition, we have now agreed with supermarkets that they will prioritise online home delivery orders for people who are shielding in Wales.

Farmers are, of course, at the very heart of our food chains and our environmental resilience, even more so during this global pandemic, and it's vital they have our support. On 1 April, I announced farmers now have an extra month to submit their single application form, with the deadline extended to 15 June. In response to concerns about crop diversification requirements following the recent flooding and the added pressure of the coronavirus situation, I also confirmed that Welsh Government is removing the requirements completely for BPS 2020. Furthermore, an additional £5.5 million has been allocated to the BPS and Glastir 2019 support scheme, which reopened on 1 April to support those 800 contracts or claimants who've not received a payment. Farmers will be able to apply for support through the scheme to alleviate potential cash-flow problems.

Tackling agricultural pollution is a priority, and I will be publishing draft regulations on the Welsh Government website, which I am minded to introduce once the crisis comes to an end. As we recover from the current crisis, we must do all we can to prevent damage being done to our fragile ecosystems and to help nature flourish.

We also need to remember that, throughout this difficult time, our critical workers are working incredibly hard around the clock in challenging circumstances to keep us and our animals safe. This includes staff in Natural Resources Wales, Animal and Plant Health Agency, local authorities, water companies, as well as timber, oil, gas and electricity workers maintaining power to our hospitals, homes and industries. Our vets are crucial in ensuring animal health and welfare and dealing with reports of suspected animal diseases.

Controlling the spread of TB remains important, but testing will only continue if it can be done safely. Cattle movement restrictions will be applied for overdue TB tests, but keepers will no longer be referred for cross-compliance penalties. Where a pre-movement test is required, animals may only be traded if they have all been tested by a vet and shown to be negative. The result of all tests must be reported to APHA and guidance on TB testing is being reviewed and updated daily.

Fishers are a vital part of our food chains and our coastal communities, and it is vital they too have our support during these difficult times. As a result of the coronavirus crisis, the shellfish trade to Europe, which is more than 90 per cent of Welsh seafood exports, has collapsed and trade within the UK has practically stopped. We are, therefore, working hard to finalise a hardship grant for eligible Welsh licence vessel owners to support the viability of the Welsh seafood sector.

Finally, Llywydd, Members will be aware COP26 has had to be postponed. However, our response to the climate emergency will continue. This Government remains committed to achieving our emissions reduction targets and producing our next low carbon delivery plan as scheduled.

So, as my colleague Ken Skates said last week, we must work together with compassion, with urgency and with care to get through the significant challenges we face and to come out the other side. Diolch.

Diolch, Llywydd. Rydym ni'n wynebu pandemig byd-eang, nad ydym ni wedi gweld ei debyg o'r blaen. Mae hwn yn gyfnod pryderus iawn i bob teulu ledled Cymru, gan gynnwys y rheini yn ein cymunedau gwledig, arfordirol ac amaethyddol. Rwy'n cydymdeimlo â phawb y mae hwn wedi effeithio arnyn nhw.

Cyn ac ers fy natganiad llafar arfaethedig ar 24 Mawrth, a ohiriwyd drwy gytundeb y Pwyllgor Busnes, mae fy swyddogion a minnau wedi bod yn gweithio'n galed i gefnogi ac ymgysylltu â'r rheini sy'n gweithio yn ein sectorau bwyd ynghylch diogelu ein hamgylchedd ac i sicrhau bod seilwaith hanfodol ar waith ac y parheir i reoli heintiau er mwyn pobl Cymru.

Ar 16 Mawrth, cynhaliais gyfarfod bord gron a oedd yn dwyn ynghyd farn ffermwyr, pysgotwyr, coedwigwyr a chynhyrchwyr bwyd a diod Cymru. Bu hyn yn hollbwysig o ran cynllunio a mynd i'r afael â'r heriau uniongyrchol ar draws fy mhortffolio. Ers hynny, rwyf wedi bod yn gweithio i sicrhau parhad cyflenwadau bwyd, gan weithio'n agos gyda Llywodraeth y DU, fforwm manwerthwyr y DU, y grŵp cyswllt argyfyngau bwyd wrth gefn a Bwrdd Diwydiant Bwyd a Diod Cymru, ymhlith eraill.

Yn ogystal â hynny, rwyf wedi bod yn gweithio gyda'r grŵp cydnerthedd amaethyddol—fe wnes i gyfarfod â nhw yr wythnos diwethaf a bydd trafodaeth bord gron arall yr wythnos nesaf. Mae fy swyddogion mewn cysylltiad dyddiol â rhanddeiliaid. Mae'r wybodaeth a'r allbynnau o'r Grŵp Cydnerthedd Amaethyddol yn cyfrannu at feddylfryd Llywodraeth Cymru ynghylch y ffordd orau o ymdrin ag effaith y mesurau cynyddol i reoli haint COVID-19.

Gallaf sicrhau Aelodau bod manwerthwyr a chadwyni cyflenwi yn ateb yr her. Mae ein storfeydd bwyd yn cael eu cyflenwi waeth beth fo'u lleoliad. Hoffwn ddiolch o galon i'r gweithlu manwerthu am eu gwaith caled.

Mae dros 85,000 o bobl yng Nghymru wedi cael llythyr gan Brif Swyddog Meddygol Cymru am fod ganddyn nhw eisoes gyflwr iechyd tymor hir penodol, sy'n golygu eu bod mewn perygl mawr o fod yn ddifrifol wael o achos y coronafeirws oherwydd problem iechyd ddifrifol sy'n bodoli eisoes. Gofynnwyd iddyn nhw ymgymryd â chyfres o fesurau gwarchod, gan gynnwys aros gartref am 12 wythnos.

Ar 3 Ebrill, ar y cyd â'r Gweinidog Tai a Llywodraeth Leol, cyhoeddais fod y bocsys bwyd cyntaf yn cael eu dosbarthu i riniogydd pobl gymwys na allan nhw ddibynnu ar deulu na ffrindiau i'w helpu. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi sicrhau bod £15 miliwn ar gael ar gyfer y cynllun danfon bwyd uniongyrchol. Mae'r pecynnau bwyd, y mae pobl yn gofyn amdanyn nhw gan eu hawdurdod lleol, yn darparu gwerth wythnos o fwydydd hanfodol mewn pecynnau a thuniau ar gyfer un unigolyn a warchodir. Hefyd, rydym ni bellach wedi cytuno â'r archfarchnadoedd y byddant yn rhoi blaenoriaeth i archebion ar-lein y mae angen eu danfon i gartrefi pobl a warchodir yng Nghymru.

Wrth gwrs, mae ffermwyr wrth wraidd ein cadwyni bwyd a'n cydnerthedd amgylcheddol, yn fwy fyth yn ystod y pandemig byd-eang hwn, ac mae'n hanfodol ein bod yn eu cefnogi. Ar 1 Ebrill, cyhoeddais fod gan ffermwyr bellach fis ychwanegol i gyflwyno ffurflen y cais sengl, gyda'r dyddiad cau wedi'i ymestyn i 15 Mehefin. Mewn ymateb i bryderon ynghylch y gofynion arallgyfeirio o ran cnydau yn dilyn y llifogydd diweddar a'r pwysau ychwanegol oherwydd y sefyllfa gyda'r coronafeirws, cadarnheais hefyd fod Llywodraeth Cymru yn dileu'r gofynion yn gyfan gwbl ar gyfer Cynllun Taliad Sylfaenol 2020. At hynny, mae £5.5 miliwn ychwanegol wedi'i ddyrannu at Gynllun y Taliad Sylfaenol a chynllun cymorth Glastir 2019, a ailagorodd ar 1 Ebrill i gefnogi'r 800 o'r contractau neu'r hawlwyr hynny nad ydyn nhw wedi cael taliad. Bydd ffermwyr yn gallu gwneud cais am gymorth drwy'r cynllun er mwyn lliniaru problemau llif arian posibl.

Mae mynd i'r afael â llygredd amaethyddol yn flaenoriaeth, a byddaf yn cyhoeddi rheoliadau drafft ar wefan Llywodraeth Cymru, yr wyf yn bwriadu eu cyflwyno ar ôl i'r argyfwng ddod i ben. Wrth inni ddod at ein hunain ar ôl yr argyfwng presennol, rhaid inni wneud popeth a allwn ni i atal niweidio ein hecosystemau bregus a helpu natur i ffynnu.

Mae angen inni gofio hefyd, drwy gydol y cyfnod anodd hwn, fod ein gweithwyr hanfodol yn gweithio'n eithriadol o galed bob awr o'r dydd a'r nos dan amgylchiadau heriol i'n cadw ni a'n hanifeiliaid yn ddiogel. Mae hyn yn cynnwys staff Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru, yr Asiantaeth Iechyd Anifeiliaid a Phlanhigion, awdurdodau lleol, cwmnïau dŵr, yn ogystal â gweithwyr ym maes coed, olew, nwy a thrydan sy'n sicrhau bod ynni ar gael i'n hysbytai, ein cartrefi a'n diwydiannau. Mae ein milfeddygon yn hollbwysig o ran sicrhau iechyd a lles anifeiliaid ac wrth ymdrin ag achosion lle amheuir bod clefydau ar anifeiliaid.

Mae rheoli lledaeniad TB yn dal yn bwysig, ond dim ond os gellir gwneud hynny'n ddiogel y bydd profion yn parhau. Bydd cyfyngiadau symud gwartheg yn berthnasol ar gyfer profion TB hwyr, ond ni chaiff ceidwaid eu hatgyfeirio bellach am gosbau trawsgydymffurfio. Os oes angen cynnal prawf cyn symud, dim ond os yw'r milfeddyg wedi profi pob un o'r anifeiliaid ac wedi dangos eu bod yn negyddol y gellir eu gwerthu. Rhaid hysbysu APHA am ganlyniad pob prawf ac mae'r canllawiau ar brofion TB yn cael eu hadolygu a'u diweddaru bob dydd.

Mae pysgotwyr yn rhan hanfodol o'n cadwyni bwyd a'n cymunedau arfordirol, ac mae'n hanfodol ein bod yn eu cefnogi hwythau hefyd yn ystod y cyfnod anodd hwn. O ganlyniad i argyfwng y coronafeirws, mae'r fasnach pysgod cregyn i Ewrop, sy'n fwy na 90 y cant o allforion bwyd môr Cymru, wedi dymchwel ac mae masnach o fewn y DU wedi dod i ben i bob pwrpas. Felly, rydym yn gweithio'n galed ar fanylion terfynol grant caledi ar gyfer perchnogion cychod trwydded cymwys yng Nghymru er mwyn cefnogi hyfywedd y sector bwyd môr yng Nghymru.

Yn olaf, Llywydd, bydd yr Aelodau'n ymwybodol y bu'n rhaid gohirio COP26. Fodd bynnag, bydd ein hymateb i'r argyfwng hinsawdd yn parhau. Mae'r Llywodraeth hon yn parhau i roi pwys mawr ar gyflawni ein targedau lleihau allyriadau a chynhyrchu ein cynllun cyflawni carbon isel nesaf fel y trefnwyd.

Felly, fel y dywedodd fy nghyd-Aelod, Ken Skates, yr wythnos diwethaf, mae'n rhaid inni gydweithio gyda thosturi, a hynny ar fyrder a chyda gofal, i wynebu'r heriau sylweddol sy'n ein hwynebu ni a goresgyn hyn. Diolch.

14:55

Thank you, Minister, for your statement this afternoon. I am a little disappointed it's taken this long to bring a statement forward from you—8 April—considering the length of time that we’ve been dealing with this crisis.

I join you in supporting the front-line workers who work either at the supermarket shelves, on the supermarket floor, or right the way through the processing sector back to the primary producers in the farms across Wales, and also the enforcement agencies, such as NRW, who do so much to protect our environment in these difficult circumstances.

Can you confirm, Minister, whether farmers will be able to access money attached to the economic resilience fund? There is some doubt about that at the moment, and I think some clarity on that would be greatly appreciated. Because, to date, no money has been able to be sourced by farmers who have faced market fluctuations—massively impacted by, obviously, the closure of the serving sector in particular.

The dairy sector: at least 25 per cent of the dairy sector is vulnerable at the moment in Wales. We've seen 15 per cent cuts in meat prices. Also, when you look across at the lamb prices—54p a kilo loss there of income. So, some assurance that they will be able to access the resilience funding would be greatly appreciated.

Could you also confirm that it would be your intention to bring forward the basic payment window to October for payment? I understand that's in your gift and, obviously, cash into businesses is a vital consideration, and the earlier that money can be brought forward, the better.

Could you also confirm that the loan payment scheme that you've enacted over the last two years—to make those payments where payments are unable to be made because of inspections et cetera—would be available this year and that the modulation, the 15 per cent modulation that you moved from pillar 1 into pillar 2, will be ring fenced for the agricultural sector under the rural development plan?

You've touched in your statement around the support for the fisheries sector, and you rightly identify the collapse in the marketing opportunities, especially in the shellfish market. You highlighted that a support package is being put together; could you give us an indication of when we might see that support package—what sort of timeline you're working to?

When it comes to supermarkets, we've had reports over the weekend that, obviously, Polish meat has been on the shelves in many supermarkets, in particular Asda and Sainsbury's. I've had confirmation today of Sainsbury's saying that that was very much a one-off because of market conditions. Can you confirm, from your discussions with supermarkets, that they are committed to purchasing and buying local produce, because it seems an anomaly to me that the taxpayer is supporting many supermarkets through various initiatives, and yet, they're undermining market conditions by importing such products onto the domestic market?

Could you also confirm that all supermarkets—. I think I heard correctly the First Minister confirm this, but I just want confirmation that all shielded persons—it's not vulnerable persons, but shielded persons—who appear on the Government list, have now been passed to the supermarkets that operate in Wales and these slots will be available to those individuals if they wish to enact them? There was a little bit of confusion over who is the lead Minister in this particular area, because I understand the local government Minister this morning was saying that she has had extensive discussions with supermarkets in this particular area. Could you confirm whether it is yourself or the local government Minister who is the lead Minister for this particular area?

And when it comes to rights of way, at the moment, there is discretion, as I understand it, as to which rights of way are being shut in the countryside, and this is causing considerable concern to some areas. What discussions is your department having with local authorities to understand that there's a uniform approach across Wales, so as to alleviate any confrontation that might happen where some people might think a right of way is open and others think it is closed because of the coronavirus regulations?

Could you also confirm how inspections have been undertaken on farms across Wales? And, do force majeure rules apply to such inspections because of the unique circumstances we find ourselves in?

My final point: you have highlighted about NVZs and your desire to publish those regulations on the website. Do you not think, with the market collapsing through produce coming off farms, the uncertainty that is currently existing within the environment across Wales, that now is not the time to heap more regulations onto an industry that is in turmoil? We all accept that one pollution incident is one too many, but to actually now proceed to publish these regulations when they cannot be fully debated and discussed and support measures understood, if, indeed, support measures were to come forward, is a completely wrong action on behalf of you and your department? I'd implore you to wait until normal conditions are in place so that these regulations could be tested and debated in the Senedd rather than published on a website that the Welsh Government promotes. Thank you.

Diolch, Weinidog, am eich datganiad y prynhawn yma. Rwy'n siomedig braidd ei bod wedi cymryd cyhyd i chi gyflwyno datganiad—8 Ebrill—o ystyried faint o amser y buom yn ymdrin â'r argyfwng hwn.

Rwy'n ategu eich geiriau o gefnogaeth i'r gweithwyr rheng flaen sy'n gweithio naill ai yn llenwi silffoedd yr archfarchnadoedd, ar lawr yr archfarchnad, neu gyda'r holl sector prosesu yn ôl i'r cynhyrchwyr cynradd ar draws Cymru, a hefyd yr asiantaethau gorfodi, megis Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru, sy'n gwneud cymaint i ddiogelu ein hamgylchedd yn yr amgylchiadau anodd hyn.

A allwch chi gadarnhau, Weinidog, a fydd ffermwyr yn gallu cael arian sydd ynghlwm wrth y gronfa cydnerthedd economaidd? Mae rhywfaint o amheuaeth am hynny ar hyn o bryd, ac rwy'n credu y câi rhywfaint o eglurder ynghylch hynny ei werthfawrogi'n fawr. Oherwydd, hyd yma, nid fu unrhyw arian ar gael i ffermwyr sydd wedi wynebu amrywiadau yn y farchnad—y mae cau'r sector gwasanaethu yn benodol wedi effeithio'n aruthrol arni.

Y sector llaeth: mae o leiaf 25 y cant o'r sector llaeth mewn sefyllfa fregus ar hyn o bryd yng Nghymru. Rydym ni wedi gweld toriadau o 15 y cant mewn prisiau cig. Hefyd, pan edrychwch chi ar brisiau cig oen—mae colled incwm o 54c y cilogram. Felly, byddai rhywfaint o sicrwydd y bydd y cyllid cydnerthedd ar gael iddyn nhw yn cael ei werthfawrogi'n fawr.

A wnewch chi hefyd gadarnhau mai eich bwriad fyddai dod â chyfnod y taliad sylfaenol ymlaen i fis Hydref o ran talu? Rwy'n deall mai gweithred o ewyllys da gennych chi fyddai hynny ac, yn amlwg, mae arian i fusnesau yn ystyriaeth hanfodol, a gorau po cyntaf y gellir cyflwyno'r arian hwnnw.

A wnewch chi hefyd gadarnhau bod y cynllun talu benthyciadau yr ydych chi wedi'i weithredu dros y ddwy flynedd diwethaf—i wneud y taliadau hynny lle na ellir talu oherwydd arolygiadau ac ati—ar gael eleni ac y caiff y modiwleiddio, y modiwleiddio o 15 y cant a symudwyd gennych chi o golofn 1 i golofn 2, ei glustnodi ar gyfer y sector amaethyddol o dan y cynllun datblygu gwledig?

Rydych chi wedi cyfeirio yn eich datganiad at y gefnogaeth i'r sector pysgodfeydd, ac rydych chi'n cyfeirio'n gywir at y cwymp yn y cyfleoedd marchnata, yn enwedig yn y farchnad pysgod cregyn. Roeddech chi'n tynnu sylw at y ffaith bod pecyn cymorth yn cael ei lunio; a allech chi roi syniad inni pryd y gallem ni weld y pecyn cymorth hwnnw—pa fath o amserlen ydych chi'n gweithio iddi?

O ran archfarchnadoedd, rydym ni wedi clywed dros y penwythnos y bu, yn amlwg, cig o Wlad Pwyl ar y silffoedd mewn llawer o archfarchnadoedd, yn enwedig Asda a Sainsbury's. Rwyf wedi cael cadarnhad heddiw gan Sainsbury's a ddywedodd mai achos unigryw iawn oedd hynny oherwydd amodau'r farchnad. A allwch chi gadarnhau, o'ch trafodaethau ag archfarchnadoedd, eu bod wedi ymrwymo i gaffael a phrynu cynnyrch lleol, oherwydd mae'n ymddangos yn anghyson i mi fod y trethdalwr yn cefnogi llawer o archfarchnadoedd drwy wahanol fentrau, ac eto, maen nhw'n tanseilio amodau'r farchnad drwy fewnforio cynnyrch o'r fath i'r farchnad ddomestig?

A wnewch chi hefyd gadarnhau bod pob archfarchnad—. Credaf imi glywed yn gywir y Prif Weinidog yn cadarnhau hyn, ond rwyf ond eisiau cadarnhad bod enw pob unigolyn a warchodir—nid pobl sy'n agored i niwed ydyn nhw, ond pobl a warchodir—sy'n ymddangos ar restr y Llywodraeth, bellach wedi'u trosglwyddo i'r archfarchnadoedd sy'n gweithredu yng Nghymru ac y bydd yr amseroedd hyn ar gael iddyn nhw os ydyn nhw eisiau manteisio arnyn nhw. Roedd peth dryswch ynghylch pwy yw'r Gweinidog arweiniol yn y maes penodol hwn, oherwydd rwy'n deall bod y Gweinidog llywodraeth leol y bore yma'n dweud ei bod wedi cael trafodaethau helaeth gydag archfarchnadoedd yn y maes penodol hwn. A wnewch chi gadarnhau ai chi ynteu'r Gweinidog llywodraeth leol yw'r Gweinidog arweiniol yn y maes penodol hwn?

Ac o ran hawliau tramwy, ar hyn o bryd, mae disgresiwn, yn ôl a ddeallaf, o ran pa hawliau tramwy a gânt eu cau yng nghefn gwlad, ac mae hyn yn peri pryder sylweddol i rai ardaloedd. Pa drafodaethau y mae eich adran yn eu cael gydag awdurdodau lleol i ddeall bod cysondeb ledled Cymru o ran gweithredu, er mwyn lliniaru unrhyw wrthdaro a allai ddigwydd lle y byddai rhai pobl yn meddwl bod hawl tramwy ar agor ac eraill yn meddwl ei fod ar gau oherwydd y rheoliadau coronafeirws?

A wnewch chi hefyd gadarnhau sut y cynhaliwyd arolygiadau ar ffermydd ledled Cymru? A yw rheolau force majeure yn berthnasol i arolygiadau o'r fath oherwydd yr amgylchiadau unigryw yr ydym ni ynddynt?

Fy sylw olaf: rydych chi wedi tynnu sylw at y parthau perygl nitradau a'ch awydd i gyhoeddi'r rheoliadau hynny ar y wefan. Onid ydych chi'n credu, gyda'r farchnad yn dymchwel yn sgil cynnyrch yn dod oddi ar ffermydd, yr ansicrwydd sy'n bodoli ar hyn o bryd yn yr amgylchedd ledled Cymru, nad nawr yw'r amser i bentyrru mwy o reoliadau ar ddiwydiant sydd mewn helbul? Rydym ni i gyd yn derbyn bod un achos o lygredd yn un yn ormod, ond mae mynd ati nawr i gyhoeddi'r rheoliadau hyn pan na ellir eu gwyntyllu a'u trafod yn llawn a sicrhau y gellir deall mesurau cymorth, os, yn wir, y caiff mesurau cymorth eu cyflwyno, yn weithred gwbl anghywir ar eich rhan chi a'ch adran? Byddwn yn erfyn arnoch chi i aros nes bod yr amodau arferol yn bodoli er mwyn trafod y rheoliadau hyn a rhoi prawf arnyn nhw yn y Senedd yn hytrach na'u cyhoeddi ar wefan y mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei hyrwyddo. Diolch.

15:00

Thank you, Andrew, for the list of questions. So, there's been a huge amount of work done from right across my portfolio, and whilst this is the first opportunity to be able to make a statement in the Senedd, I hope that—. I've been inundated with written Assembly questions and correspondence, and my department has sought to answer as quickly as possible.

You ask, firstly, around whether farmers can access funding from the economic resilience fund. I suppose there are two areas here: I think if farmers have diversified, so, for instance, if they've got a glamping business within, they certainly can. However, around normal agriculture activity, I think we need to look at a bespoke package in relation to that. So, that is an ongoing piece of work at the moment, to see if we need to look at what's on offer within the resilience fund, or whether we do need a bespoke package. Normally, we would look at a bespoke package.

Dairy is clearly a major issue, and, again, there’s significant work being done around that. Recently, I think it was on Monday, I wrote to the Secretary of State for the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs in the UK Government, George Eustice, emphasising the need for us all to collaborate as Governments to use the powers available that we have at the moment to protect the agri-food supply chain. So, we’ve been working very closely around dairy. I have at least one or two discussions a week with the Secretary of State, and, clearly, the impact of the realignment of the supply chain is having, particularly on dairy, is significant. I think it was probably one of the first things to impact when the food service sector also collapsed very early.

Diolch, Andrew, am y rhestr o gwestiynau. Felly, mae llawer iawn o waith wedi'i wneud ym mhob un o'r meysydd rwy'n gyfrifol amdanyn nhw, ac er mai dyma'r cyfle cyntaf i gael gwneud datganiad yn y Senedd, rwy'n gobeithio—. Rwyf wedi bod yn ymdrin â chwestiynau a gohebiaeth ysgrifenedig di-ri yn ymwneud â materion y Cynulliad, ac mae fy adran wedi ceisio ateb cyn gynted â phosib.

Rydych chi'n gofyn, yn gyntaf, ynghylch a all ffermwyr gael arian o'r gronfa cadernid economaidd. Mae'n debyg bod dau faes yn y fan yma: rwy'n credu os yw ffermwyr wedi arallgyfeirio, felly, er enghraifft, os oes ganddyn nhw fusnes glampio, fe allan nhw yn sicr wneud hynny. Fodd bynnag, o ran gweithgarwch amaethyddol arferol, credaf fod angen inni edrych ar becyn pwrpasol ar gyfer hynny. Felly, mae hynny'n rhywbeth sydd ar y gweill ar hyn o bryd, i weld a oes angen inni edrych ar yr hyn a gynigir o fewn y gronfa gadernid, neu a oes angen pecyn pwrpasol arnom ni. Fel arfer, byddem yn ystyried pecyn pwrpasol.

Mae llaeth yn amlwg yn fater allweddol, ac, unwaith eto, mae gwaith sylweddol yn cael ei wneud ynghylch hynny. Yn ddiweddar, ddydd Llun rwy'n credu, ysgrifennais at yr Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros Adran yr Amgylchedd, Bwyd a Materion Gwledig yn Llywodraeth y DU, George Eustice, yn pwysleisio'r angen i bob un ohonom ni gydweithio fel llywodraethau i ddefnyddio'r pwerau sydd ar gael ar hyn o bryd i ddiogelu'r gadwyn gyflenwi bwyd-amaeth. Felly, rydym ni wedi bod yn gweithio'n agos iawn ynghylch y diwydiant llaeth. Rwyf yn cael o leiaf un neu ddwy drafodaeth yr wythnos gyda'r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol, ac, yn amlwg, mae effaith adlinio'r gadwyn gyflenwi, yn enwedig o ran cynnyrch llaeth, yn sylweddol. Rwy'n credu mai dyma oedd un o'r pethau cyntaf yr effeithiwyd arno pan chwalodd y sector gwasanaethau bwyd yn gynnar iawn hefyd.

Around BPS, that is something I will monitor—whether we need to do it in October, whether we need to do the loan scheme again. As you said, we’ve done it for two years now. I still haven’t had a commitment from the UK Government around the 15 per cent modulation; we’re still awaiting that.

The timescale for fisheries, I hope this week—. Certainly, last week, I had a discussion with the Welsh Fishermen's Association, with Jim Evans, and, again, we’re working to the timescale of this week.

You raised the issue around Polish beef, and that was raised with me by the NFU last week and at my regular weekly meeting with DEFRA and the Scottish and Northern Ireland Government with the retailers—it was raised there also. You are right: both Asda and Sainsbury’s have said that it is a one-off, because they had such a demand for mince particularly at the start of the pandemic when I think people were panic buying much more than they are—well, I don’t think panic buying is happening now in the way that we saw initially.

The need for them to support our producers is something I’ve spoken about with every major supermarket myself. One of the concerns that were raised with me very early on was that perhaps some supermarkets were looking at rationalising their products, and it could be the small Welsh producer that’s affected. I heard of one example of that. I took it up directly with the supermarket and it was reversed, for which I’m grateful. So, I think all supermarkets recognise that we need to promote and support Welsh food producers where we can.

In relation to the supermarkets and the shielded list, I lead on this area; however, I do work very closely with Julie James, the Minister for local government and also with Vaughan Gething, and the three of us meet twice a week and have continued to do that around supermarkets. So, you did hear the First Minister right. It’s been a significant piece of work to do this with the supermarkets, because data protection is very important, and I wasn’t prepared to just release data without going through all the hoops that we had to do. So, my understanding is that data contracts with all eight major supermarkets will have been completed by today, and those slots will be protected for the shielded group. You make a very good point that I want to reiterate: that it’s not the vulnerable group, it’s the shielded group. So, as you heard me saying in my statement, about 85,000 letters have gone out; those are the shielded group, and so, for those people, those priority online slots will be made available. Both Sainsbury’s and Tesco told me on Monday that they have about 100,000 of those slots right across the UK.

There has been quite a lot of noise, I think, around vulnerable people, and I absolutely appreciate that, but if you look, we think, across the UK, there are about 15 million people who would be classed as vulnerable in the way that we’re talking about, so the supermarkets just could not cope, obviously, with that number of online shopping slots. So, it was most important to ensure that we have those online priority slots for the shielded people, and that’s what we’ve done.

You ask about rights of way, that’s obviously an area that Hannah Blythyn leads on, and as you rightly point out, it is local authorities that have the powers to close those footpaths and I know that the Deputy Minister is working with local authorities in that area.

I think it’s really important to clarify that, all I have done today is say that we will put the draft regulations on the Welsh Government website. They are not being introduced. As you say, we cannot accept agriculture pollution at the level we’ve seen. We've had a spike recently—you may have seen the press release that came from Natural Resources Wales—we've seen a spike over the last few weeks. Agricultural pollution is not something that most farmers would ever allow on their farms, so those following good practice will not see any major change as a result of those regulations. The information in those regulations has been seen by many people and I felt it important to share that information. You'll be aware of the UKCCC report, and I had to publish, I would say, by the autumn. I did commit to publishing and introducing the regulations by Easter; I am not doing that, all I'm doing is publishing the draft regulations, and there will be plenty of time to debate those in the Senedd.

O ran cynllun y taliad sylfaenol, mae hynny'n rhywbeth y byddaf yn cadw golwg arno—a oes angen y cynllun benthyca arnom ni ym mis Hydref. Fel y dywedoch chi, rydym ni wedi gwneud hynny ers dwy flynedd bellach. Nid wyf wedi cael ymrwymiad gan Lywodraeth y DU o hyd ynglŷn â'r modiwleiddio 15 y cant; rydym ni'n dal i aros am hynny.

Yr amserlen ar gyfer pysgodfeydd, gobeithio yr wythnos hon—. Yn sicr, yr wythnos diwethaf, cefais drafodaeth gyda Chymdeithas Pysgotwyr Cymru, gyda Jim Evans, ac unwaith eto, rydym yn gweithio yn unol â'r amserlen yr wythnos hon.

Fe wnaethoch chi grybwyll y mater ynghylch cig eidion o Wlad Pwyl, a dygwyd hynny at fy sylw gan Undeb Cenedlaethol yr Amaethwyr yr wythnos diwethaf ac yn fy nghyfarfod wythnosol rheolaidd gyda DEFRA a Llywodraeth yr Alban a Gogledd Iwerddon gyda'r manwerthwyr—fe'i crybwyllwyd yn y fan honno hefyd. Rydych chi'n gywir: mae Asda a Sainsbury's wedi dweud mai achos unigryw yw hyn, gan fod ganddyn nhw gymaint o alw am friwgig, yn enwedig ar ddechrau'r pandemig pan oedd pobl rwy'n credu yn prynu mewn panig llawer mwy nag y maen nhw—wel, nid wyf yn credu bod pobl yn prynu mewn panig nawr yn y ffordd a welsom ni ar y dechrau.

Mae'r angen i gefnogi ein cynhyrchwyr yn rhywbeth yr wyf wedi sôn amdano gyda phob archfarchnad fawr fy hun. Un o'r pryderon a ddygwyd i fy sylw yn gynnar iawn oedd bod rhai archfarchnadoedd o bosib yn ystyried ad-drefnu eu cynnyrch, ac y gallai hynny effeithio ar gynhyrchwr bach Cymru. Clywais am un enghraifft o hynny. Es i'r afael â hynny yn uniongyrchol gyda'r archfarchnad ac fe roddwyd y gorau i hynny, ac rwy'n ddiolchgar am hynny. Felly, credaf fod pob archfarchnad yn cydnabod bod angen inni hyrwyddo a chefnogi cynhyrchwyr bwyd Cymru pan allwn ni.

O ran yr archfarchnadoedd a'r rhestr o bobl a warchodir, rwy'n arwain ar y maes hwn; fodd bynnag, rwyf yn gweithio'n agos iawn gyda Julie James, y Gweinidog Llywodraeth Leol a hefyd gyda Vaughan Gething, ac mae'r tri ohonom ni'n cwrdd ddwywaith yr wythnos ac wedi parhau i wneud hynny ynghylch archfarchnadoedd. Felly, fe wnaethoch chi glywed y Prif Weinidog yn iawn. Roedd gwneud hyn gyda'r archfarchnadoedd yn waith sylweddol, oherwydd mae diogelu data yn bwysig iawn, a doeddwn i ddim yn barod i ryddhau data heb wneud popeth priodol yr oedd yn rhaid i ni ei wneud. Felly, yn ôl a ddeallaf, bydd contractau data gyda phob un o'r wyth archfarchnad fawr wedi'u cwblhau erbyn heddiw, ac fe gaiff yr amseroedd hynny eu neilltuo ar gyfer y bobl hynny a warchodir. Rydych chi'n gwneud pwynt da iawn yr hoffwn i ei ailadrodd: nad pobl sy'n agored i niwed ydyn nhw, maen nhw'n bobl a warchodir. Felly, fel y clywsoch fi'n dweud yn fy natganiad, mae tua 85,000 o lythyrau wedi eu hanfon; y rheini yw'r bobl a warchodir, ac felly, i'r bobl hynny, bydd yr amseroedd ar-lein hynny sydd wedi eu blaenoriaethu ar gael. Dywedodd Sainsbury's a Tesco wrthyf ddydd Llun fod ganddyn nhw tua 100,000 o'r amseroedd hynny ledled y DU.

Bu cryn dipyn o drafod, rwy'n credu, ynghylch pobl sy'n agored i niwed, ac rwy'n gwerthfawrogi hynny'n llwyr, ond os ydych chi'n edrych, rydym ni'n credu, ledled y DU, bod tua 15 miliwn o bobl y byddid yn eu cyfrif yn bobl agored i niwed yn y ffordd yr ydym ni'n ystyried hynny, felly ni allai'r archfarchnadoedd ymdopi, wrth gwrs, â'r nifer hwnnw o amseroedd danfon ar gyfer siopa ar-lein. Felly, roedd hi'n bwysig iawn sicrhau bod gennym ni'r amseroedd blaenoriaeth ar-lein hynny ar gyfer y bobl a warchodir, a dyna beth yr ydym ni wedi'i wneud.

Rydych chi'n holi am hawliau tramwy, sy'n amlwg yn faes y mae Hannah Blythyn yn arwain arno, ac fel y dywedwch chi yn gwbl gywir, awdurdodau lleol sydd â'r pwerau i gau'r llwybrau troed hynny, a gwn fod y Dirprwy Weinidog yn gweithio gydag awdurdodau lleol yn y maes hwnnw.

Rwy'n credu ei bod hi'n bwysig iawn egluro, y cyfan yr wyf wedi'i wneud heddiw yw dweud y byddwn yn rhoi'r rheoliadau drafft ar wefan Llywodraeth Cymru. Nid ydyn nhw yn cael eu cyflwyno. Fel y dywedwch chi, ni allwn ni dderbyn llygredd amaethyddol i'r graddau yr ydym ni wedi'i weld. Bu cynnydd sydyn yn ddiweddar—efallai eich bod wedi gweld y datganiad i'r wasg a ddaeth oddi wrth Cyfoeth Naturiol Cymru—rydym ni wedi gweld cynnydd sydyn dros yr ychydig wythnosau diwethaf. Nid yw llygredd amaethyddol yn rhywbeth y byddai'r rhan fwyaf o ffermwyr yn ei ganiatáu ar eu ffermydd ar unrhyw adeg, felly ni fydd y rhai sy'n dilyn arfer da yn gweld unrhyw newid mawr o ganlyniad i'r rheoliadau hynny. Mae llawer o bobl wedi gweld yr wybodaeth yn y rheoliadau hynny a theimlais ei bod hi'n bwysig rhannu'r wybodaeth honno. Byddwch yn ymwybodol o adroddiad Pwyllgor y DU ar Newid Hinsawdd, a bu'n rhaid i mi gyhoeddi erbyn yr Hydref, byddwn i'n dweud. Fe wnes i ymrwymo i gyhoeddi a chyflwyno'r rheoliadau erbyn y Pasg; nid wyf yn gwneud hynny, y cyfan rwy'n ei wneud yw cyhoeddi'r rheoliadau drafft, a bydd digon o amser i drafod y rheini yn y Senedd.

15:10

Diolch am y datganiad. Dwi hefyd eisiau talu teyrnged i'r rheini oll sy'n gweithio o fewn y sector bwyd i sicrhau bod bwyd yn ein cyrraedd ni, o'r fferm i'r fforc, fel maen nhw'n ei ddweud. Rŷm ni'n gwerthfawrogi eu hymdrechion nhw, wrth gwrs. Ond mae'n rhaid i fi, Weinidog, os caf i, fynegi siom ynglŷn â'r datganiad, achos dŷn ni prin wedi cael unrhyw beth newydd yn y datganiad yna. Yr hyn rŷm ni wedi'i gael, i bob pwrpas, yw ailadrodd cyhoeddiadau rŷch chi wedi'u gwneud yn flaenorol.

Yr unig beth newydd rŷch chi wedi'i gyhoeddi, i bob pwrpas, yw'r cyhoeddiad rŷch chi wedi'i wneud ynglŷn â drafft rheoliadau NVZ. Wrth gwrs, rŷch chi'n ymwybodol bod hwn yn un o'r pynciau mwyaf dadleuol rŷch chi wedi bod yn ymrafael ag ef ers blwyddyn a mwy, ac mae'n destun gofid a phryder mawr i'r sector. Felly, pam eich bod chi wedi dewis nawr ar gyfer gwneud cyhoeddiad o'r fath? Mae yna rannau helaeth o'r sector ar eu gliniau, fel rŷm ni wedi clywed, ac dwi'n ofni y byddai'n cael ei weld fel rhywbeth antagonistic, fel rhywbeth calon galed, fel rhywbeth creulon. Dwi dal ddim yn deall y rhesymeg ynglŷn â pham nawr. Dwi'n deall mai drafft yw e; dwi'n deall ei fod e ddim yn dod i rym, ond mi fydd y canfyddiad allan yn y wlad yn un, dwi'n meddwl, bydd yn gadael pobl yn crafu pennau ar adeg pan ddylem ni i gyd fod yn ffocysu ar y gwaith sydd angen ei wneud. Oherwydd, mae pwysau aruthrol, fel rŷch chi'n gwybod, ar y sector yn y cyd-destun sydd ohoni.

Dŷch chi ddim wedi dweud dim byd ynglŷn â chefnogaeth fusnes yn eich datganiad. Rŷch chi wedi ymhelaethu ychydig eiliad yn ôl, ond does yna ddim eglurder wedi bod ers wythnosau lawer ynglŷn ag a ydy ffermwyr yn mynd i allu cael mynediad i ryw fath o gymorth busnes. Mae yna ddryswch wedi bod ynglŷn ag a ydy pobl yn gymwys ar gyfer yr hyn sydd wedi'i gyhoeddi. Rŷm ni heddiw, am y tro cyntaf, wedi clywed awgrym efallai eich bod chi yn ystyried rhyw gynllun bespoke. Dwi'n meddwl y byddwn i wedi gwerthfawrogi clywed rhywbeth tebyg i hynny cyn heddiw.

Fel rŷm ni wedi clywed, mae galwadau wedi bod am sicrhau neu ring-fence-io 15 y cant o'r [Anhyglyw.] ar gyfer rhyw fath o top-up i BPS. Mae yna alwadau hefyd, yng nghyd-destun llaeth, wrth gwrs, wedi bod i chi ystyried talu ffi safonol y litr i ffermwyr sy'n gorfod gwaredu eu llaeth. Dwi hefyd wedi clywed nifer o leisiau yn galw am gymryd y gor-gynhyrchiad o laeth allan o'r farchnad trwy, er enghraifft, annog a chynorthwyo proseswyr llaeth i gynhyrchu mwy o gaws, ac i roi ychydig o'r caws yna i mewn i storfeydd. Mae yna nifer o opsiynau posibl, ond dwi'n clywed dim oddi wrthych chi ynglŷn â pha rai o'r rhain ŷch chi yn eu hystyried, os ydych chi o gwbl. Byddwn i wedi gobeithio y byddwn ni wedi cael peth o'r wybodaeth yna heddiw.

Dwi'n nodi eich bod chi'n dweud ychydig am brofion TB yn eich datganiad chi. Wrth gwrs, y realiti yw mi fydd mwy a mwy o ffermwyr yn gorfod hunan-ynysu, mi fydd llai a llai o filfeddygon ar gael i fynd i wneud y profion yma, ac felly, fel y bydd amser yn mynd yn ei flaen, bydd mwy a mwy o ffermydd yn gorfod cael eu cloi i lawr. Felly, pa ystyriaeth ŷch chi'n rhoi i ryw fath o gonsesiwn sy'n seiliedig ar risg? Yn amlwg, dŷn ni ddim eisiau lledaenu TB, ond dŷn ni ddim chwaith eisiau lledaenu COVID-19 trwy orfodi pobl neu i gael pobl i ddod i brofi ar eu ffermydd. Felly, dwi ddim yn clywed oddi wrthych chi sut ŷch chi'n mynd i geisio taro'r cydbwysedd yna.

Rŷch chi'n iawn pan ŷch chi'n dweud bod y sector pysgodfeydd angen cymorth. Yn sicr, maen nhw wedi bod yn aros i glywed oddi wrthych chi. Dŷn ni'n gwybod, er enghraifft, bod pysgotwyr yn Iwerddon erbyn hyn yn cael €350 yr wythnos gan y Llywodraeth, ac yn Ffrainc, €300 yr wythnos. Mae pysgotwyr yn yr Alban yn mynd i dderbyn 50 y cant o'u henillion blynyddol cyfartalog am o leiaf y tri mis nesaf. Allwch chi esbonio pa fath o gynllun rŷch chi'n sôn amdano fe? Ydy e ar hyd y llinellau hynny? Jest inni gael rhyw well syniad na'r hyn rŷm ni wedi clywed hyd yn hyn.

Dwi'n ymwybodol mai'r Dirprwy Weinidog llywodraeth leol sy'n gyfrifol am lwybrau cyhoeddus, ond mae hwn yn rhywbeth, wrth gwrs, sydd yn pwyso ar feddyliau nifer o deuluoedd amaethyddol. Fyddwn i ddim, wrth gwrs, yn dadlau y dylid cau pob llwybr cyhoeddus, ond mae yna rai etholwyr, enghraifft, wedi cysylltu â fi sydd â phobl fregus yn byw yn eu cartrefi nhw—pobl sydd â'r risg fwyaf pe bai nhw yn cael COVID-19—mae yna lwybrau cyhoeddus yn pasio heibio eu tai nhw, heibio neu ar draws buarth y fferm, yn agos i'r tŷ. Oni allwch chi sicrhau bod yna elfen yn cael ei chyflwyno lle mae yna achosion tebyg yn medru cael eu delio â nhw mewn ffordd fwy cyson ar draws Cymru, yn hytrach nag, fel rŷn ni wedi clywed, ar ffurf digon random ac ad hoc fel y mae hi ar hyn o bryd? Diolch. 

I thank the Minister for her statement. I would also wish to pay tribute to all of those working within the food sector to ensure that the food does reach us, from farm to fork, as they say, and we appreciate their efforts, of course. But Minister, I have to express some disappointment about your statement, because we've heard virtually nothing new. What we've had, to all intents and purposes, is a rehash of previous announcements you've made.

The only new thing you've announced, to all intents and purposes, is the announcement that you made on the draft NVZ regulations. You will be aware that this is one of the most contentious issues that you have been grappling with for 12 months and more, and it's a cause of great concern and anxiety to the sector. So why did you choose now to make such an announcement, with large parts of the sector on their knees, as we've heard? I fear it will be seen as being antagonistic, hard-hearted and cruel. I still don't understand the rationale as to why now. I understand that it's a draft, and it won't come into force, but the perception out there will leave people scratching their heads at a time when we should all be focused on the work that needs to be done. Because there is huge pressure, as you know, on the sector in the current climate. 

You've said nothing about business support in your statement. You did expand upon it in response to a question, but there has been no clarity over many weeks as to whether farmers would be able to access some sort of business aid package. There has been confusion as to whether people qualify for what has already been announced, and today for the first time, we heard a suggestion that you are considering some bespoke scheme. I would have appreciated hearing reference to something akin to that before today. 

As we've heard, there have been calls to ensure that we can ring-fence 15 per cent of the [Inaudible.] as a top-up of BPS. There have also been calls in terms of dairy, for you to consider paying a standard per-litre price to farmers who have to dispose of their milk. I also hear a number of voices calling for the over-production of milk to be taken out of the market, if possible by encouraging and supporting milk processors to produce more cheese and to put some of that into storage. So, there are a number of possible options, but I've heard nothing from you as to which of these you are considering. If you are considering any of them, I would have hoped that we would have received some of that information today. 

I do note that you said a few words about TB testing in your statement. Of course, the reality is that more and more farmers will have to self-isolate. There will be fewer and fewer vets available to carry out these tests, and therefore as time progresses, there will be more and more farms that will have to be locked down. So, what consideration are you giving to some sort of concession based on risk? Clearly, we don't want to spread TB, but neither do we want to spread COVID-19 by forcing people to have people coming in to carry out tests on their farms. I'm not hearing from you how you're going to strike the right balance there. 

You are right in saying that the fisheries sector needs support. Yes, they have been waiting to hear from you. We know, for example, that fishers in Ireland now receive €350 per week from the Government. In France it's €300 a week, and fishers in Scotland will receive 50 per cent of their annual average earnings for at least the next three months. So can you explain what kind of plan you are putting in place? Is it along those lines? Just so we can have a better idea than what we have heard to date. 

I am aware that the Deputy Minister for local government is responsible for public footpaths and rights of way, but this is something that is of course a concern for many agricultural families and farming families. Of course, I wouldn't argue that every public footpath should be closed, but there are some constituents who have contacted me and they have vulnerable people living in their homes—people who are at the highest risk if they were to be infected by COVID-19—and there are public footpaths passing their homes or crossing their land close to their homes. So, couldn't you ensure that there is an element introduced where there are similar cases that could be dealt with in a more consistent way across Wales, rather than the way that we've heard, which is quite random and ad hoc at the moment? Thank you.

15:15

Diolch, Llyr, for those questions. You started with the draft regulations, and you will appreciate it's not been antagonistic at all; I had committed to publishing those regulations before the Easter recess. I don't know where we are going to be in relation to COVID-19 as the year progresses, and as I said in my answer to Andrew R.T. Davies, you'll be aware of the UKCCC report, the land-use report, and what referred to the need for us to do—. We would have been the only country in the UK that hadn't done that. And I know that Llyr always wants to associate himself with action that we take on climate change, and this is a really tough decision—I appreciate that—but I am not doing anything at the moment to be antagonistic, and I can absolutely assure you we are all focused on the work at hand in my department.

However, that information that I will publish in draft regulations has been in the hands of many people already. For the sake of transparency, I believe it's right that that information is out there. There's been lots of misinformation, I think, and I think it's only right that the regulations are published in draft and that everyone, not just a few people, have access to that. 

Around business support, as you said, I mentioned to Andrew R.T. Davies about what farmers would be able to apply for within the current scheme—the work around looking at what we can pull out of that scheme, if you like, and whether there needs to be a bespoke package. And certainly, my discussions with the farming unions—I think they've always had a bespoke scheme, so that was the reason for looking at that. But that work is ongoing and obviously needs to done with pace. 

In relation to dairy, it is important that we work across all Government, and I mentioned that I have written to George Eustice—I have not received a response yet—but dairy is obviously discussed with stakeholders. I mentioned in my statement that I attended—remotely, of course—the agricultural resilience group. There's also the dairy focus group. So, I'm not excluding any options, and you did come up with some suggestions, and I'm very happy to look at any options going forward to help the dairy sector. 

In relation to TB, I think everyone accepts that we need to continue to do TB testing at the current time. However, it can only be done if vets think it can be done safely in accordance with the current COVID-19 public health advice. So, until further advice, keepers will not be referred to the relevant paying agency for overdue TB tests if they or the vet advise that the test could not be completed. And you're quite right, we may see farmers self-isolating and they wouldn't want people to come onto their farm, and we absolutely accept that, and that is the reason why. But we do, I think, at the moment have to continue where possible to do TB testing. Certainly, officials have participated in numerous meetings with the other UK administrations to determine an agreed position on the current advice with regard to TB testing. I reiterate: it should only continue providing all involved can maintain adequate self-isolating and social distancing requirements. 

In relation to fisheries, as I say, we're working up a hardship scheme that I hope—. It's Wednesday now; I hope to be able to publish what we're going to come forward with for the fishers. It's incredibly important that we support them because, as I mentioned in my statement, we've seen a complete collapse of their market.

I think that was all the questions. Thank you. 

Diolch am y cwestiynau hynny. Fe wnaethoch chi ddechrau gyda'r rheoliadau drafft, a byddwch yn sylweddoli na fu unrhyw beth gelyniaethus ynghylch hynny o gwbl; roeddwn wedi ymrwymo i gyhoeddi'r rheoliadau hynny cyn toriad y Pasg. Nid wyf yn gwybod beth fydd y sefyllfa o ran COVID-19 wrth i'r flwyddyn fynd yn ei blaen, ac fel y dywedais yn fy ateb i Andrew R.T. Davies, byddwch yn ymwybodol o adroddiad yr UKCCC, yr adroddiad defnydd tir, a'r hyn a gyfeiriodd at yr angen i ni ei wneud—. Nyni fyddai'r unig wlad yn y DU na fyddai wedi gwneud hynny. Ac rwy'n gwybod fod ar Llyr wastad eisiau arddel yr hyn yn yr ydym ni'n ei wneud o ran y newid yn yr hinsawdd, ac mae hwn yn benderfyniad anodd iawn—rwy'n sylweddoli hynny—ond nid wyf yn gwneud unrhyw beth ar hyn o bryd i fod yn elyniaethus, a gallaf eich sicrhau yn llwyr ein bod ni i gyd yn canolbwyntio ar y gwaith sydd wrth law yn fy adran.

Fodd bynnag, mae'r wybodaeth honno y byddaf yn ei chyhoeddi mewn rheoliadau drafft wedi bod yn nwylo llawer o bobl eisoes. Er mwyn bod yn dryloyw, credaf ei bod hi'n briodol bod yr wybodaeth honno ar gael. Cafwyd llawer o wybodaeth anghywir, rwy'n credu, ac rwy'n credu nad yw hi ond yn briodol y caiff y rheoliadau eu cyhoeddi ar ffurf ddrafft a'u bod ar gael i bawb, nid i ychydig o bobl yn unig.

O ran cymorth i fusnesau, fel y dywedoch chi, soniais wrth Andrew R.T. Davies am yr hyn y byddai ffermwyr yn gallu gwneud cais amdano o fewn y cynllun presennol—y gwaith sy'n ymwneud ag edrych ar yr hyn y gallwn ni ei dynnu o'r cynllun hwnnw, os mynnwch chi, ac a oes angen pecyn pwrpasol. Ac yn sicr, fy nhrafodaethau gydag undebau'r ffermwyr—rwy'n credu y bu ganddyn nhw gynllun pwrpasol erioed, felly dyna oedd y rheswm dros edrych ar hynny. Ond mae'r gwaith hwnnw'n mynd rhagddo ac yn amlwg mae angen gwneud hynny ar frys.

O ran llaeth, mae'n bwysig ein bod yn gweithio gyda'r Llywodraeth yn ei chyfanrwydd, a soniais fy mod wedi ysgrifennu at George Eustice—nid wyf wedi cael ymateb eto—ond mae'n amlwg bod llaeth yn cael ei drafod gyda rhanddeiliaid. Soniais yn fy natganiad fy mod yn bresennol—o bell, wrth gwrs—yng nghyfarfod y grŵp cydnerthedd amaethyddol. Mae grŵp ffocws llaeth hefyd. Felly, nid wyf yn eithrio unrhyw bosibiliadau, ac fe wnaethoch chi gynnig rhai awgrymiadau, ac rwy'n fodlon iawn i ystyried unrhyw bosibiliadau yn y dyfodol i helpu'r sector llaeth. 

O ran TB, credaf fod pawb yn derbyn bod angen inni barhau i gynnal profion TB ar hyn o bryd. Fodd bynnag, dim ond os yw milfeddygon o'r farn y gellir gwneud hynny'n ddiogel yn unol â'r cyngor iechyd cyhoeddus cyfredol ynghylch COVID-19 y gellir gwneud hynny. Felly, hyd nes y ceir cyngor pellach, ni chaiff ceidwaid eu cyfeirio at yr asiantaeth dalu berthnasol am brofion TB hwyr os ydyn nhw neu'r milfeddyg yn dweud na ellir cwblhau'r prawf. Ac rydych chi'n llygad eich lle, efallai y byddwn ni'n gweld ffermwyr yn hunanynysu ac na fydden nhw eisiau i bobl ddod ar eu fferm, ac rydym ni'n derbyn hynny'n llwyr, a dyna'r rheswm. Ond mae'n rhaid i ni, rwy'n credu, ar hyn o bryd barhau lle bo'n bosib cynnal profion TB. Yn sicr, mae swyddogion wedi bod mewn cyfarfodydd lu gyda gweinyddiaethau eraill y DU i benderfynu ar y safbwynt ar y cyd ynghylch y cyngor presennol o ran profion TB. Rwy'n pwysleisio: ni ddylai hynny ond parhau ar yr amod y gall pawb sy'n gysylltiedig gadw at y gofynion priodol o ran hunanynysu a chadw pellter cymdeithasol.

O ran pysgodfeydd, fel y dywedais, rydym ni'n gweithio ar gynllun caledi yr wyf yn gobeithio—. Mae'n ddydd Mercher bellach; rwy'n gobeithio cyhoeddi'r hyn yr ydym ni'n mynd i'w gynnig i bysgotwyr. Mae'n hynod o bwysig ein bod yn eu cefnogi oherwydd, fel y soniais yn fy natganiad, rydym ni wedi gweld cwymp llwyr yn eu marchnad.

Credaf mai dyna'r holl gwestiynau. Diolch.  

15:20

Good afternoon, Minister. Thank you for your statement. Obviously you'll know that the farming community is particularly worried about the impact of disruption to the supply chains. This can have a significant impact on the ability of farmers to get their products to the marketplace, which, of course, impacts on the farmers' overall income. Farmers representatives are thus asking for the economic resilience fund, announced in December of last year—and here I echo a little bit of Andrew R.T.'s comments—to be ring-fenced for distribution to farm businesses. Could the Minister inform us as to whether this measure is or will be implemented? I'm sure you'll agree with me, Minister, that British farmers are amongst the most innovative and effective and efficient in the world, but they need the funds to carry on delivering in the magnificent way they have so far. 

Secondly, Minister, one of the great concerns of the farming community is the increase in the number of people using public footpaths, as referred to by Llyr earlier, some of which come close to their homesteads, which, in turn, increases their exposure to coronavirus. Whilst we, in the Brexit Party, would not support the closure of footpaths, which some farmers are asking for, we would ask the Welsh Government to initiate a campaign highlighting the countryside code, which is often being flaunted by some of those accessing farmland. This is particularly evident with people not keeping dogs under control and this aspect is obviously extremely worrying for farmers, given that the lambing season is in full swing. So, again, will the Government commit to a campaign outlining the key aspects of the countryside code? 

Prynhawn da, Weinidog. Diolch am eich datganiad. Yn amlwg, byddwch yn gwybod bod y gymuned ffermio yn poeni'n arbennig am effaith amharu ar y cadwyni cyflenwi. Gall hyn effeithio'n sylweddol ar allu ffermwyr i gael eu cynnyrch i'r farchnad, sydd, wrth gwrs, yn effeithio ar incwm cyffredinol y ffermwyr. Felly, mae cynrychiolwyr ffermwyr yn gofyn am neilltuo'r gronfa cadernid economaidd, a gyhoeddwyd ym mis Rhagfyr y llynedd—ac yn y fan yma rwy'n adleisio ychydig o sylwadau Andrew R.T.—i'w dosbarthu i fusnesau fferm. A wnaiff y Gweinidog roi gwybod inni a yw neu a fydd y mesur hwn yn cael ei weithredu? Rwy'n siŵr y byddwch yn cytuno â mi, Gweinidog, bod ffermwyr Prydain ymhlith y rhai mwyaf arloesol ac effeithiol ac effeithlon yn y byd, ond mae angen yr arian arnyn nhw i barhau i gyflawni yn y ffordd wych y buon nhw'n gwneud hyd yma.

Yn ail, Gweinidog, un o bryderon mawr y gymuned ffermio yw'r cynnydd yn nifer y bobl sy'n defnyddio llwybrau cyhoeddus, y cyfeiriodd Llyr ato yn gynharach, y mae rhai ohonyn nhw yn dod yn agos at eu ffermdai, sydd, yn ei dro, yn cynyddu'r tebygolrwydd y dônt i gysylltiad â'r coronafeirws. Er na fyddem ni, yn y Blaid Brexit, yn cefnogi cau llwybrau troed, y mae rhai ffermwyr yn gofyn amdano, byddem yn gofyn i Lywodraeth Cymru gychwyn ymgyrch yn tynnu sylw at y cod cefn gwlad, y mae rhai o'r bobl hynny sy'n mynd ar diroedd fferm yn aml yn ei ddiystyru. Mae hyn yn arbennig o amlwg pan nad yw pobl yn cadw cŵn dan reolaeth ac mae'r agwedd hon yn amlwg yn peri pryder mawr i ffermwyr, o gofio bod y tymor wyna ar ei anterth. Felly, unwaith eto, a wnaiff y Llywodraeth ymrwymo i ymgyrch yn amlinellu'r prif agweddau ar y cod cefn gwlad?

Thank you, David Rowlands, for those two questions. I'm not quite sure if you were talking of the 15 per cent modulation. If you were, as I said to Andrew R.T. Davies, we still haven't had assurance from the UK Treasury that we will be receiving that money, and I think I answered the questions around the economic resilience fund to both Andrew and Llyr. I absolutely agree with you that Welsh farmers are innovative and they certainly do need our support and we will be working on what we can do to help, having looked at the economic resilience fund and also a bespoke package. 

In relation to your second point, I'm certainly very happy to promote anything that protects the countryside in the way that you referred. Hannah Blythyn is the lead Minister on public footpaths and I know she has been doing a great deal of work with local authorities. Specifically about public footpaths on farmland, I think the public rights of network—as you say, we wouldn't want to see them closed. They're very important, particularly at this time when we are encouraging people to go out once a day to exercise et cetera. But I think we need to make sure that farmers are happy with the access on their lands. Certainly, again, I did discuss this with one of the farming unions last week, and they were at pains to tell me, really, that most public footpaths on farmland don't go close to their houses and have the infrastructure—so, if you think of stiles, for instance, or kissing gates—that farmers don't use. But, clearly, I'm very happy to look at things on a case-by-case basis. Llyr has actually spoken to me before about a particular incident, which he's just raised again. But at the current time there are certainly no plans to close footpaths across farmland, but, as I say, Hannah Blythyn is the lead Minister in relation to footpaths. 

Diolch, David Rowlands, am y ddau gwestiwn yna. Nid wyf yn hollol siŵr a oeddech chi'n sôn am y modiwleiddio 15 y cant. Os oeddech chi, fel y dywedais wrth Andrew R.T. Davies, nid ydym ni wedi cael sicrwydd o hyd gan Drysorlys y DU y byddwn yn cael yr arian hwnnw, ac rwy'n credu fy mod wedi ateb y cwestiynau ynghylch y gronfa cadernid economaidd i Andrew a Llyr. Cytunaf yn llwyr â chi fod ffermwyr Cymru yn flaengar ac yn sicr mae arnyn nhw angen ein cefnogaeth a byddwn yn gweithio ar yr hyn y gallwn ni ei wneud i helpu, ar ôl edrych ar y gronfa cadernid economaidd a phecyn pwrpasol hefyd.

O ran eich ail sylw, rwy'n sicr yn fodlon iawn i hyrwyddo unrhyw beth sy'n diogelu cefn gwlad yn y ffordd y gwnaethoch chi gyfeirio ato. Hannah Blythyn yw'r Gweinidog sy'n arwain ar faes llwybrau cyhoeddus ac rwy'n gwybod ei bod hi wedi gwneud llawer o waith gydag awdurdodau lleol. Yn benodol ynghylch llwybrau cyhoeddus ar diroedd fferm, rwy'n credu y byddai hawliau cyhoeddus y rhwydwaith—fel y dywedwch chi, ni fyddem ni eisiau eu gweld yn cau. Maen nhw'n bwysig iawn, yn enwedig ar yr adeg hon pan ydym ni'n annog pobl i fynd allan unwaith y dydd i wneud ymarfer corff ac ati. Ond rwy'n credu bod angen i ni wneud yn siŵr bod ffermwyr yn hapus gyda'r mynediad ar eu tiroedd. Yn sicr, unwaith eto, fe wnes i drafod hyn gydag un o'r undebau ffermio yr wythnos diwethaf, ac roedden nhw'n awyddus iawn i ddweud wrthyf, mewn gwirionedd, nad yw'r rhan fwyaf o lwybrau cyhoeddus ar diroedd fferm yn mynd yn agos at eu tai a bod ganddyn nhw'r seilwaith—felly, os meddyliwch chi am gamfeydd, er enghraifft, neu gatiau mochyn—nad yw ffermwyr yn eu defnyddio. Ond, yn amlwg, rwy'n hapus iawn i ystyried pethau ar sail achosion unigol. Mae Llyr wedi siarad â mi o'r blaen mewn gwirionedd am ddigwyddiad arbennig, y mae newydd ei grybwyll eto. Ond ar hyn o bryd, yn sicr nid oes cynlluniau i gau llwybrau troed ar draws tiroedd fferm, ond fel y dywedais, Hannah Blythyn yw'r Gweinidog arweiniol o ran llwybrau troed.  

Thank you very much, Minister, for your statement. I note that you say that you have had assurances from the supermarkets that they will prioritise online home delivery orders to those who are shielded. I have today had two e-mails from shielded families who are not getting that service from the supermarkets and are being told that they're still waiting for a list of those who are shielded before they will do that. It seems to be their response is inadequate already. If somebody is telling them they are shielded they should be prioritising deliveries to those people, pending being able to double-check that that is the case. So, I'd like a bit more detail, really, on how we are ensuring that supermarkets are stepping up to the plate on this important issue, because otherwise, clearly, we've got to ensure other arrangements are available to keep them safe if they don't have family or trusted neighbours locally to do it for them.

Secondly, there's already been a very significant spike in the wholesale prices of vegetables and fruit. So, several things arise from that. One is, it seems to me that it is the role of Government to mobilise a land army of people to enable horticultural production to be massively ramped up, as it is inevitable that supplies are going to be interrupted from abroad, because this pandemic is a global one.

I and a group of other Members wrote to you separately earlier this week about the role that garden centres could play in both enabling people to grow their own vegetables and fruit, but also to improve their well-being, both physically and mentally, whilst they are confined to their homes, and those people who have the privilege of having a garden ought to have a bit more time to enable them to do that. So, is there any information you can give on how we can, at the very least, ensure that the plants currently not being sold in garden centres that have closed can be made available, possibly through schools, so that they can be planted, as we simply can't lose that produce?

And thirdly, I would make a plea on behalf of those children who have no access to outdoor play at home: it is absolutely vital for them that our public parks are kept open, otherwise there will be very serious consequences, both for their well-being, but also in particular if they are living in very overcrowded conditions—the parks are a place where they can go to to escape the tensions that are no doubt occurring at home.

Diolch yn fawr iawn, Weinidog, am eich datganiad. Sylwaf y dywedwch chi eich bod wedi cael sicrwydd gan yr archfarchnadoedd y byddant yn blaenoriaethu archebion ar-lein ar gyfer danfon nwyddau i gartrefi'r bobl hynny a warchodir. Heddiw, rwyf wedi cael dau e-bost gan deuluoedd a warchodir, nad ydyn nhw'n cael y gwasanaeth hwnnw gan yr archfarchnadoedd, ac y dywedir wrthyn nhw eu bod yn dal i aros am restr o'r bobl hynny a warchodir cyn iddyn nhw wneud hynny. Mae'n ymddangos bod eu hymateb yn annigonol yn barod. Os bydd rhywun yn dweud wrthyn nhw eu bod dan warchodaeth, dylen nhw roi blaenoriaeth i ddanfon nwyddau i gartrefi'r bobl hynny, hyd nes y gallan nhw wirio hynny'n iawn. Felly, hoffwn gael ychydig mwy o fanylion, mewn gwirionedd, ynglŷn â sut yr ydym ni'n sicrhau bod archfarchnadoedd yn gweithredu fel y dylen nhw ar y mater pwysig hwn, oherwydd fel arall, yn amlwg, mae'n rhaid i ni sicrhau bod trefniadau eraill ar gael i'w cadw'n ddiogel os nad oes ganddyn nhw deulu neu gymdogion lleol y gellir ymddiried ynddyn nhw i wneud hynny ar eu rhan.

Yn ail, bu cynnydd sydyn iawn eisoes ym mhrisiau cyfanwerthu llysiau a ffrwythau. Felly, mae sawl peth yn deillio o hynny. Un yw, mae'n ymddangos i mi mai swyddogaeth y Llywodraeth yw cynnull byddin o bobl i alluogi llawer mwy o gynhyrchu garddwriaethol, gan ei bod hi'n anorfod y bydd tarfu ar gyflenwadau o dramor, oherwydd bod y pandemig hwn yn un byd-eang.

Ysgrifennais i a grŵp o Aelodau eraill atoch chi yn unigol yn gynharach yr wythnos hon ynghylch yr hyn y gallai canolfannau garddio ei wneud o ran galluogi pobl i dyfu eu llysiau a'u ffrwythau eu hunain, ond hefyd i wella eu lles, yn gorfforol ac yn feddyliol, pan fônt wedi'u cyfyngu i'w cartrefi, a dylai'r bobl hynny sydd â'r fraint o fod â gardd gael ychydig mwy o amser i'w galluogi i wneud hynny. Felly, a oes unrhyw wybodaeth y gallwch chi ei rhoi ynghylch sut y gallwn ni, o leiaf, sicrhau y gellir darparu'r planhigion nad ydyn nhw'n cael eu gwerthu ar hyn o bryd mewn canolfannau garddio sydd wedi cau, drwy ysgolion o bosib, fel y gellir eu plannu, gan na allwn ni golli'r cynnyrch hwnnw?

Ac yn drydydd, hoffwn ofyn ar ran y plant hynny nad ydynt yn gallu chwarae yn yr awyr agored yn eu cartrefi: mae'n gwbl hanfodol iddyn nhw y cedwir ein parciau cyhoeddus ar agor, neu fel arall bydd canlyniadau difrifol iawn, o ran eu lles, ond hefyd yn enwedig os ydyn nhw'n byw mewn cartrefi gorlawn—mae'r parciau'n fannau lle y gallan nhw ddianc rhag y tensiynau sy'n siŵr o fodoli gartref.

15:25

I thank Jenny Rathbone for those questions. So, in relation to the shielded list of people and supermarkets, you will have heard me say in an earlier answer that the data contracts have been signed this week. This has been a significant piece of work, and I have to say, I've been very impressed with the way the supermarkets have wanted to engage with us on this issue. I think some supermarkets have looked at their own data available. So, I suppose if you've got a loyalty card, you know the profile of your shoppers. So, some supermarkets have been a little bit more proactive in doing that. But, clearly, they've also been restricted in the number of shopping slots they've got. I think online shopping amounts to a small-ish percentage of the way people usually shop. So, to ramp it up in the way they have I think has been pretty impressive.

So, by the close of play today, all eight major supermarkets will have had that data list. As I say, I wanted to be absolutely sure that we weren't sharing data that we shouldn't be sharing. Maybe other countries are being a bit more lenient, but I have been really keen that we have to have all the i's dotted and the t's crossed in relation to sharing that data. So, anybody who's now on that shielded list who wants online shopping to be delivered to their home should be able to access that.

In relation to garden centres, obviously they have to remain closed. I know that that will be kept under review, but at the current time they have to remain closed. But I know a lot of them have diversified to online. I've got a seed company—it's a social enterprise one—in my own constituency that is doing incredible work online and has had to take on more employees because they have been inundated. So, I think we can see that people are much more keen now to grow their own fruit and vegetables, and that's to be welcomed.

Around the workers who normally come to pick fruit and veg—obviously, in Wales, horticulture is a very small part of the agricultural sector. It's about 1 per cent. But, again, in my weekly meetings with the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary of State and my counterparts in Scotland and Northern Ireland, this is something that we're having to look at, because, clearly, there is going to be an impact on the number of people who we normally have coming to Wales to help us.

And it's not just around food and drink; we normally have sheep shearers that come over from Australia and New Zealand, so there's a whole issue around agricultural workers and the—. We're going to see a significant drop in numbers and we need to look at other ways of encouraging people to do those jobs this year.

I absolutely agree with you around public parks. I think the First Minister alluded to the tensions and the difficulties that people will be getting from having to socially distance, and I can think of nothing worse than not being able to take your children out into open space every day. So, again, public parks aren't in my portfolio, but I'll certainly ensure that right across Government that message goes ahead.

Diolch i Jenny Rathbone am y cwestiynau yna. Felly, o ran y rhestr o bobl a warchodir ac archfarchnadoedd, byddwch wedi fy nghlywed yn dweud mewn ateb cynharach fod y contractau data wedi'u llofnodi yr wythnos hon. Bu hyn yn ddarn sylweddol o waith, ac mae'n rhaid i mi ddweud, mae'r ffordd y bu'r archfarchnadoedd yn awyddus i weithio gyda ni ar y mater hwn wedi creu argraff fawr arnaf. Rwy'n credu bod rhai archfarchnadoedd wedi edrych ar eu data eu hunain. Felly, mae'n debyg os oes gennych chi gerdyn teyrngarwch, eich bod yn gwybod beth yw proffil eich siopwyr. Felly, mae rhai archfarchnadoedd wedi bod fymryn yn fwy rhagweithiol wrth wneud hynny. Ond, yn amlwg, dim ond hyn a hyn o amseroedd danfon siopa sydd ganddyn nhw. Rwy'n credu bod siopa ar-lein yn cyfateb i ganran gymharol fach o'r ffordd y mae pobl yn siopa fel arfer. Felly, mae cynyddu hynny yn y ffordd y maen nhw wedi gwneud, rwy'n credu, wedi bod yn eithaf trawiadol.

Felly, erbyn diwedd y diwrnod gwaith heddiw, bydd pob un o'r wyth archfarchnad fawr wedi cael y rhestr ddata honno. Fel y dywedais, roeddwn i eisiau bod yn hollol siŵr nad oeddem ni'n rhannu data na ddylem ni fod yn ei rannu. Efallai fod gwledydd eraill ychydig yn fwy hyblyg, ond rwyf wedi bod yn awyddus iawn ein bod yn drylwyr iawn o ran rhannu'r data hwnnw. Felly, dylai unrhyw un sydd nawr ar y rhestr honno o bobl a warchodir sydd eisiau siopa ar-lein a chael y nwyddau wedi eu danfon i'w cartref allu gwneud hynny.

O ran canolfannau garddio, mae'n amlwg bod yn rhaid iddyn nhw aros ar gau. Rwy'n gwybod y caiff hynny ei adolygu'n barhaus, ond ar hyn o bryd mae'n rhaid iddyn nhw aros ar gau. Ond rwy'n gwybod bod llawer ohonyn nhw wedi arallgyfeirio i werthu ar-lein. Mae gennyf i gwmni hadau—menter gymdeithasol—yn fy etholaeth i sy'n gwneud gwaith anhygoel ar-lein ac maen nhw wedi gorfod cyflogi mwy o weithwyr oherwydd eu bod wedi cael cymaint o archebion. Felly, rwy'n credu y gallwn ni weld bod pobl yn llawer mwy awyddus nawr i dyfu eu ffrwythau a'u llysiau eu hunain, ac mae hynny i'w groesawu.

Ynghylch y gweithwyr sydd fel arfer yn dod i gasglu ffrwythau a llysiau—yn amlwg, yng Nghymru, mae garddwriaeth yn rhan fach iawn o'r sector amaethyddol. Mae oddeutu 1 y cant. Ond, unwaith eto, yn fy nghyfarfodydd wythnosol gyda'r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros Adran yr Amgylchedd, Bwyd a Materion Gwledig a'm cymheiriaid yn yr Alban a Gogledd Iwerddon, mae hyn yn rhywbeth y mae'n rhaid inni ei ystyried, oherwydd, yn amlwg, bydd effaith ar nifer y bobl sydd fel arfer yn dod i Gymru i'n helpu ni.

Ac nid yw'n ymwneud â bwyd a diod yn unig; fel arfer mae gennym ni gneifwyr defaid sy'n dod o Awstralia a Seland Newydd, felly mae yna broblem fawr yn ymwneud â gweithwyr amaethyddol a'r—. Byddwn yn gweld gostyngiad sylweddol yn y niferoedd ac mae angen i ni ystyried ffyrdd eraill o annog pobl i wneud y swyddi hyn eleni.

Cytunaf yn llwyr â chi ynglŷn â pharciau cyhoeddus. Credaf fod y Prif Weinidog wedi cyfeirio at y tensiynau a'r anawsterau y bydd pobl yn eu profi o orfod cadw pellter cymdeithasol, ac ni allaf feddwl am ddim byd gwaeth na methu â mynd â'ch plant allan i fannau agored bob dydd. Felly, unwaith eto, nid yw parciau cyhoeddus yn fy mhortffolio, ond byddaf yn sicr yn gwneud yn siŵr y cyfleir y neges honno i bob rhan o'r Llywodraeth.

15:30

Thank you, Minister, for your statement. As you know, I have been inundated with enquiries from constituents who have been struggling to access online shopping. Those are shielded constituents and constituents who are vulnerable as well. There's been a very widespread perception that shoppers in Wales have been disadvantaged as opposed to those in England. So, I think my first question is whether you would acknowledge that there's been a communication issue here that Welsh Government needs to urgently address with shoppers in Wales.

I hear what you're saying about the supermarkets having the shielded data now. I spoke to the head of public affairs at Sainsbury's myself yesterday, and they told me that they had indeed received the shielded data now, but my constituents today are still getting e-mails off Sainsbury's telling them that this is still a work in progress and that they can't register, and that is just not acceptable and needs to be resolved as a matter of urgency so that the people who must shield can shield. Food parcels are all well and good, but most people want to get their own shopping in and see to themselves, and we need to resolve that urgently. 

You referred to the group that you're in with Julie James and Vaughan Gething. I'm also concerned because I'm still getting constituents who are on the shielded list but haven't received a shielded letter, and not all GPs are taking the same approach to shielded patients, so there's an issue there about people being able to actually unlock that support in the first place. So, I'd like to ask you to raise that with Julie James and with Vaughan Gething so that we have got a consistent approach to the shielded across Wales.

And then my final point relates to vulnerable people more generally, because that is actually a huge group that is outside the shielded group. I've been contacted by people with sight problems and other vulnerable people who've always shopped online and now can't get an online shopping slot. So, I'd like to ask you what you think the solution is for those people, because I don't think it's realistic for local government to be able to take food to all these people—or volunteers—and I would like to see the Welsh Government really working proactively with supermarkets to really boost that online capacity. I know it's a challenge, but, if we can boost online capacity, that will also help the social distancing, with fewer people going shopping in the first place. So, I'd like to ask you what your plans are, going forward, to work proactively as a Government with the supermarkets to really boost that online capacity so that it can meet the needs not just of the shielded but of the vulnerable in Wales, which is a much bigger group. Thank you.

Diolch, Weinidog, am eich datganiad. Fel y gwyddoch, rwyf wedi cael llif o ymholiadau gan etholwyr sydd wedi bod yn cael trafferth wrth geisio siopa ar-lein. Mae'r rheini'n etholwyr a warchodir ac yn etholwyr sy'n agored i niwed hefyd. Bu dirnadaeth eang iawn y bu siopwyr yng Nghymru o dan anfantais o'u cymharu â'r rhai yn Lloegr. Felly, rwy'n credu mai fy nghwestiwn cyntaf yw a fyddech yn cydnabod y bu problem gyfathrebu y mae angen i Lywodraeth Cymru fynd i'r afael â hi ar frys gyda siopwyr yng Nghymru.

Rwy'n deall yr hyn yr ydych yn ei ddweud am yr archfarchnadoedd yn cael y data ynghylch unigolion a warchodir nawr. Siaradais â phennaeth materion cyhoeddus Sainsbury's fy hun ddoe, ac fe ddywedodd wrthyf eu bod wedi derbyn y data erbyn hyn, ond mae fy etholwyr heddiw yn dal i gael negeseuon e-bost oddi wrth Sainsbury's yn dweud bod y gwaith yn dal ar droed ac na allant gofrestru, ac nid yw hynny'n dderbyniol ac mae angen ei ddatrys ar frys er mwyn i'r bobl sydd i fod i gael eu gwarchod, gael eu gwarchod. Mae'r parseli bwyd yn bethau da a chlodwiw, ond mae'r rhan fwyaf o bobl eisiau cael eu siopa eu hunain a gofalu am eu hunain, ac mae angen inni ddatrys hynny ar frys.

Fe wnaethoch chi gyfeirio at y grŵp yr ydych chi ynddo gyda Julie James a Vaughan Gething. Rwyf hefyd yn bryderus gan fy mod yn dal i glywed gan etholwyr sydd ar y rhestr o unigolion a warchodir ond nad ydynt wedi derbyn y llythyr sydd ar eu cyfer, ac nid yw pob meddyg teulu â'r un ymagwedd tuag at gleifion a warchodir, felly mae yna broblem ynglŷn â phobl yn gallu cael y gefnogaeth honno yn y lle cyntaf. Felly, hoffwn ofyn i chi godi hynny gyda Julie James a gyda Vaughan Gething er mwyn i ni gael ymagwedd gyson tuag at y rhai a warchodir ledled Cymru.

Ac yna mae fy mhwynt olaf yn ymwneud â phobl sy'n agored i niwed yn fwy cyffredinol, gan fod hwnnw mewn gwirionedd yn grŵp enfawr sydd y tu allan i'r grŵp o unigolion a warchodir. Mae pobl sydd â phroblemau golwg a phobl eraill sy'n agored i niwed sydd wedi siopa ar-lein erioed wedi cysylltu â mi i ddweud nad ydyn nhw mwyach yn gallu cael blwch amser siopa ar-lein. Felly, hoffwn ofyn i chi beth yn eich barn chi yw'r ateb i'r bobl hynny, oherwydd nid wyf yn credu ei bod hi'n realistig i lywodraeth leol fynd â bwyd at yr holl bobl hyn—neu wirfoddolwyr—a hoffwn weld Llywodraeth Cymru yn gweithio'n rhagweithiol gydag archfarchnadoedd i roi hwb gwirioneddol i'r capasiti ar-lein hwnnw. Rwy'n gwybod ei fod yn her, ond, os gallwn gynyddu capasiti ar-lein, bydd hynny hefyd yn helpu i ymbellhau'n gymdeithasol, gyda llai o bobl yn mynd i siopa yn y lle cyntaf. Felly, fe hoffwn i ofyn i chi beth yw eich cynlluniau, yn y dyfodol, i weithio'n rhagweithiol fel Llywodraeth gyda'r archfarchnadoedd i roi hwb gwirioneddol i'r capasiti ar-lein fel y gall hynny ddiwallu anghenion nid yn unig y rhai a warchodir ond y rhai sy'n agored i niwed yng Nghymru, sy'n grŵp mwy o lawer. Diolch.

Thank you, Lynne, for those questions. I should start by saying that people in Wales have not been disadvantaged. My understanding is there was only—. On Monday, there was only one supermarket that had got the data from England. So, it was one supermarket on Monday. We had three supermarkets on Monday who had our data. We'd signed the data contracts on Monday. So, as far as I'm aware, we were actually ahead, not behind. So, certainly, they haven't been disadvantaged.

You mentioned that some people on the shielded list—and I, too, am getting a lot of constituency casework around this—they haven't received the letters. It's from people who think they should be on the shielded list. I will certainly take the point up with Vaughan Gething, but my understanding is, if people can contact their GP, they should be able to find out then if they are on the list and when they will get their letter, but, again, I would think that, by today, everyone on that shielded list should have had their letter, but I will certainly raise it at my next meeting with Vaughan and Julie James.

You mentioned also, in the first question, around some of your constituents still getting e-mails saying it was work in progress. I agree that's not acceptable. As you yourself said, Sainsbury's informed you that they have now had the data, so I think they need to make sure that their websites are up to date and I will go off from this statement and I will make sure that officials contact all eight supermarkets to make sure that information is there, because there's nothing more frustrating than going on a website and you haven't got the correct information.

Your question around vulnerable people is a really important one, and I sort of alluded to it a bit earlier—that we think, across the UK, there are probably about 15 million vulnerable people; the people that you referred to, people with sight difficulties, for instance. But, equally, whilst I have worked very proactively with the supermarkets, they are not able to boost their online slots in the way that I think some people are expecting them to do. They're also coping with—. Some of the supermarkets have got 20 per cent of their staff self-isolating. They can't just buy a fleet of vans. A lot of them have managed to increase their online slots, some of them significantly. There's one supermarket—that's Morrisons—they have a huge amount of online shopping activity and they've managed to boost their slots in a way that the others haven't been able to. However, both Tesco and Sainsbury's have now got 100,000 slots that they are keeping for that priority group, for that shielded group.

I think you're right about the food parcels. They are there for people who are on the shielded list that have absolutely nobody to bring food to them. I'm really pleased and I'd really like to pay tribute to my officials in the food division who have done an incredible job to get those food parcels out so quickly. And all 22 local authorities: I thank them very much, because they're our partner in this. There's now a very robust system in place, very quickly, to get those food parcels out. But it's not for everybody, and some people won't be eligible for them. Some people won't want them, and they will want to continue that online shopping, but I think, realistically, the supermarkets are doing all they can, and are continuing to do all they can. When I dialled into the retailer meeting on Monday that DEFRA organised—again, I think most of the supermarkets have taken extra staff on to be able to cope with the ones that are self-isolating and are unwell, but I am very happy to continue to work very proactively with the supermarkets to try and do all I can.

Diolch, Lynne, am y cwestiynau yna. Dylwn ddechrau drwy ddweud nad yw pobl yng Nghymru wedi bod dan anfantais. Fy nealltwriaeth i yw nad oedd ond—. Ddydd Llun, dim ond un archfarchnad oedd wedi cael y data o Loegr. Felly, un archfarchnad oedd hi ddydd Llun. Roedd gennym ni dair archfarchnad ddydd Llun a oedd â'n data ni. Roeddem wedi llofnodi'r contractau data ddydd Llun. Felly, cyn belled ag y gwn i, roeddem ni ar y blaen, nid ar ei hôl hi. Felly, yn sicr, dydyn nhw ddim wedi bod dan anfantais.

Fe wnaethoch chi sôn fod rhai pobl ar y rhestr warchod—ac rwyf innau hefyd yn cael llawer o waith achos etholaethol ynghylch hyn—dydyn nhw heb gael y llythyrau. Daw oddi wrth bobl sy'n credu y dylen nhw fod ar y rhestr warchod. Byddaf yn sicr dwyn hynny i sylw Vaughan Gething, ond fy nealltwriaeth i yw, os wnaiff pobl gysylltu â'u meddyg teulu, dylen nhw gael gwybod wedyn os ydyn nhw ar y rhestr a phryd y cânt eu llythyr, ond, eto, rwy'n credu, erbyn heddiw, y dylai pawb ar y rhestr warchod fod wedi cael eu llythyr, ond byddaf yn sicr yn crybwyll hyn yn fy nghyfarfod nesaf gyda Vaughan a Julie James.

Fe wnaethoch chi sôn hefyd, yn y cwestiwn cyntaf, fod rhai o'ch etholwyr yn dal i gael negeseuon e-bost yn dweud ei fod yn waith sydd ar droed. Rwy'n cytuno nad yw hynny'n dderbyniol. Fel y dywedsoch chi eich hun, mae Sainsbury's wedi eich hysbysu eu bod bellach wedi cael y data, felly rwy'n credu bod angen iddyn nhw wneud yn siŵr bod eu gwefannau yn gyfredol a byddaf yn gadael y datganiad hwn ac yn gwneud yn siŵr bod swyddogion yn cysylltu â phob un o'r wyth archfarchnad i sicrhau bod gwybodaeth ar gael, oherwydd does dim byd mwy rhwystredig na mynd ar wefan pan nad yw'r wybodaeth gywir yno ichi.

Mae eich cwestiwn ynglŷn â phobl sy'n agored i niwed yn un gwirioneddol bwysig, ac rwyf wedi cyfeirio ato ychydig yn gynharach—ac rydym yn credu, ledled y DU, fod tua 15 miliwn o bobl sy'n agored i niwed yn ôl pob tebyg; y bobl y gwnaethoch chi gyfeirio atyn nhw, pobl sydd â phroblemau golwg, er enghraifft. Ond, yn yr un modd, er fy mod wedi gweithio'n rhagweithiol iawn gyda'r archfarchnadoedd, nid ydyn nhw'n gallu rhoi hwb i'w slotiau ar-lein yn y ffordd y credaf y mae rhai pobl yn disgwyl iddyn nhw ei wneud. Maen nhw hefyd yn ymdopi â—. Mae 20 y cant o staff rhai o'r archfarchnadoedd wedi ynysu eu hunain. Ni allan nhw brynu fflyd o faniau ar amrantiad. Mae llawer ohonyn nhw wedi llwyddo i gynyddu eu slotiau ar-lein, rhai ohonyn nhw yn sylweddol. Mae un archfarchnad—sef Morrisons—mae ganddyn nhw lawer iawn yn siopa ar-lein ac maen nhw wedi llwyddo i roi hwb i'w slotiau mewn ffordd nad yw'r lleill wedi llwyddo i'w wneud. Fodd bynnag, mae gan Tesco a Sainsbury's bellach 100,000 o slotiau y maen nhw'n eu cadw ar gyfer y grŵp blaenoriaeth hwnnw, ar gyfer y grŵp hwnnw a warchodir.

Rwy'n credu eich bod yn iawn ynghylch y parseli bwyd. Maen nhw yno i bobl sydd ar y rhestr o rai a warchodir sydd â neb o gwbl i ddod â bwyd iddyn nhw. Rwy'n falch iawn a hoffwn dalu teyrnged i'm swyddogion yn yr is-adran fwyd sydd wedi gwneud gwaith anhygoel i gael y parseli bwyd hyn mor gyflym. A phob un o'r 22 o awdurdodau lleol: rwy'n ddiolchgar iawn iddyn nhw, oherwydd eu bod nhw'n bartner yn hyn. Mae system gadarn iawn yn ei lle erbyn hyn, yn gyflym iawn, i ddosbarthu'r parseli bwyd hynny. Ond nid yw'n addas i bawb, ac ni fydd rhai pobl yn gymwys ar eu cyfer. Ni fydd ar rai pobl eu heisiau nhw, a byddant yn parhau i siopa ar-lein, ond rwy'n credu, yn realistig, bod yr archfarchnadoedd yn gwneud popeth yn eu gallu, a'u bod yn parhau i wneud popeth yn eu gallu. Pan ymunais â chyfarfod y manwerthwyr ddydd Llun yr oedd DEFRA wedi ei drefnu—unwaith eto, rwy'n credu bod y rhan fwyaf o'r archfarchnadoedd wedi sicrhau staff ychwanegol i ymdopi â'r rhai sy'n hunanynysu ac sy'n sâl, ond rwy'n fodlon iawn parhau i weithio'n rhagweithiol iawn gyda'r archfarchnadoedd i geisio gwneud popeth a allaf.

15:35

Good afternoon, Minister. If I can just, on today's statement—the mention of the 85,000 slots for the shielded list, and it really is to endorse the comments by Lynne Neagle AM. This, of course, is based on advice from the CMO in Wales, where he did state that everyone would have received their letters by Monday, 6 April. Well, certainly in Aberconwy, I'm still being contacted very regularly as regards people who not only believe they should be shielded, they actually have quite serious medical complaints. One example is somebody with severe respiratory problems, whereby they are just currently on the urgent waiting list for a double lung transplant. Now, when they've gone back to their GP, the GP has made it quite clear and said they've had no guidance, they don't know anything about this portal that apparently exists to GPs, and they've been told, 'Oh, come back another day, or contact us another day, and speak to a receptionist, but I don't know anything about it.' And I've had a number of constituents who have medically recorded serious complaints and would ordinarily, because of the medical records they hold, be considered as shielded. So, if you could speak to the health secretary to ensure that you can then add them, because, clearly, we'll pursue them on behalf of our constituents, but I hope there is some scope there for you to add them to your shielded list.

Now, clearly, Aberconwy has a fantastic food and drink sector, and, like all businesses, because of COVID-19, it is struggling. Some of them are having to dispose of food—it's been touched on by our dairy farmers having to dispose of milk. So, I'd like to know what quick action you can put in place to support our dairy farmers.

Also, another question I have: in light of the new Health Protection (Coronavirus Restrictions) (Wales) (Amendment) Regulations 2020, which came into force yesterday, will you clarify, Minister, what the Welsh Government regards as reasonable measures to be undertaken by those such as butchers, those who are now providing a very vital role in delivering food, food producers and delivery companies? What are those reasonable measures to be undertaken by those businesses attempting to meet the need to ensure that a distance of 2m is maintained between persons on their premises? Because some companies have said to me, 'We're going to have to halve the number of people if we strictly adhere to those rules. Can we have some guidance whereby, if we're not necessarily meeting the 2m rule, some preventative guidance can be put in place?' Because it's just not feasible, currently, for them to downsize their staff capacity—then they won't be able to fulfil that obligation to deliver or, indeed, to process food.

Another question I have: as you may be aware, vineyards in Wales are classified as farming activities, therefore not liable for business rates, so they don't have a rateable value. What support would be in place for them? Will they be able to tap into the economic resilience fund?

Question three: our farmers play a crucial role in feeding our nation, but some may be negatively—well, I think they all are now—affected by the dramatic falls in farm-gate prices as a consequence of changes to consumer buying patterns and the closure of some food service sector outlets. Will they be able to have some financial support and when?

My final question, Minister: concerns have been raised with me regarding the food boxes that are being distributed. I'm aware of where people are discarding some of this food, because it's not to their liking, sadly, but, more importantly, people have dietary requirements and, indeed, food allergies. So, what considerations have been put in place in the making-up of these boxes to take into account those with specific dietary requirements and, indeed, food allergies? Thank you.

Prynhawn da, Weinidog. Os gallaf, ar ddatganiad heddiw—y sôn am yr 85,000 o slotiau ar gyfer y rhestr o'r rhai a warchodir, ac i wir gymeradwyo'r sylwadau gan Lynne Neagle AC. Mae hyn, wrth gwrs, yn seiliedig ar gyngor gan y prif swyddog meddygol yng Nghymru, pan ddywedodd y byddai pawb wedi cael eu llythyrau erbyn dydd Llun, 6 Ebrill. Wel, yn sicr yn Aberconwy, mae pobl sydd nid yn unig yn credu y dylen nhw gael eu gwarchod, ond sydd mewn gwirionedd ag anhwylderau meddygol eithaf difrifol yn cysylltu â mi'n rheolaidd. Un enghraifft yw rhywun sydd â phroblemau anadlu difrifol, ac maen nhw ar y rhestr aros frys am drawsblaniad ysgyfaint dwbl ar hyn o bryd. Nawr, pan ânt yn ôl at eu meddyg teulu, mae'r meddyg teulu yn ei gwneud yn gwbl glir ac yn dweud nad ydyn nhw wedi cael unrhyw arweiniad, dydyn nhw ddim yn gwybod unrhyw beth am y porth hwn sy'n bodoli i feddygon teulu mae'n debyg, a dywedir wrthyn nhw, 'O, dewch yn ôl ddiwrnod arall, neu cysylltwch â ni rywbryd eto, a siaradwch â'r derbynnydd, ond nid wyf yn gwybod dim amdano'. Ac mae gen i nifer o etholwyr sydd ag anhwylderau difrifol y mae cofnod meddygol ohonynt ac a fyddai fel arfer, oherwydd y cofnodion meddygol sydd ganddyn nhw, yn cael eu hystyried fel rhai a warchodir. Felly, os wnewch chi siarad â'r ysgrifennydd iechyd i sicrhau y gallwch chi eu hychwanegu nhw, oherwydd yn amlwg, byddwn ni'n mynd ar eu holau ar ran ein hetholwyr, ond rwy'n gobeithio y bydd rhywfaint o gyfle i chi eu hychwanegu at eich rhestr o'r rhai a warchodir.

Nawr, yn amlwg, mae gan Aberconwy sector bwyd a diod gwych, ac, fel pob busnes, oherwydd COVID-19, mae'r sector yn ei chael hi'n anodd. Mae rhai busnesau'n gorfod cael gwared ar fwyd—mae wedi cael ei grybwyll gan ein ffermwyr llaeth sy'n gorfod gwaredu llaeth. Felly, hoffwn wybod pa gamau cyflym y gallwch eu rhoi ar waith i gefnogi ein ffermwyr llaeth.

Hefyd, cwestiwn arall sydd gennyf i: yn sgil y Rheoliadau Diogelu Iechyd (Cyfyngiadau Coronafeirws) (Cymru) (Diwygio) 2020, a ddaeth i rym ddoe, a wnewch chi egluro, Gweinidog, beth mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn ei ystyried yn fesurau rhesymol i'w cymryd gan rai fel cigyddion, y rhai sydd bellach yn chwarae rhan hanfodol wrth gyflenwi bwyd, cynhyrchwyr bwyd a chwmnïau cyflenwi? Beth yw'r mesurau rhesymol hynny y mae'n rhaid i'r busnesau hynny eu cymryd i gydymffurfio â'r angen i sicrhau bod pobl ar eu safle yn cadw 2m o'i gilydd? Gan fod rhai cwmnïau wedi dweud wrthyf i, 'Bydd yn rhaid inni haneru nifer y bobl os ydym ni am lynu'n gaeth wrth y rheolau hynny. A gawn ni arweiniad pryd, os nad ydym o anghenraid yn bodloni'r rheol 2m, y gellir rhoi canllawiau ataliol ar waith? Oherwydd nid yw'n ymarferol, ar hyn o bryd, iddyn nhw leihau nifer eu staff—gan na fyddan nhw wedyn yn gallu cyflawni'r rhwymedigaeth honno i gyflenwi neu, yn wir, i brosesu bwyd.

Cwestiwn arall sydd gen i: fel y gwyddoch chi efallai, mae gwinllannoedd yng Nghymru yn cael eu hystyried yn weithgareddau ffermio, ac felly nid ydyn nhw'n talu ardrethi busnes, felly nid oes ganddyn nhw werth ardrethol. Pa gymorth fyddai ar gael iddyn nhw? A fyddan nhw'n gallu manteisio ar y gronfa cadernid economaidd?

Cwestiwn tri: mae ein ffermwyr yn chwarae rhan hollbwysig o ran bwydo ein cenedl, ond gallai rhai—wel, rwy'n credu eu bod i gyd erbyn hyn—yn dioddef effeithiau negyddol yn sgil y gostyngiad sylweddol mewn prisiau wrth gât y fferm o ganlyniad i newidiadau i batrymau prynu defnyddwyr a chau rhai allfeydd yn y sector gwasanaethau bwyd. A fyddant yn cael rhywfaint o gymorth ariannol a phryd?

Fy nghwestiwn olaf, Gweinidog: codwyd pryderon gyda mi ynglŷn â'r blychau bwyd sy'n cael eu dosbarthu. Rwy'n ymwybodol bod pobl yn cael gwared ar rywfaint o'r bwyd hwn, oherwydd nid ydyn nhw yn ei hoffi, ysywaeth, ond, yn bwysicach, mae gan bobl ofynion deietegol ac, yn wir, alergeddau bwyd. Felly, pa ystyriaethau sydd ynglwm â'r broses o lunio'r blychau hyn i ystyried y rhai sydd â gofynion deietegol penodol ac, yn wir, alergeddau bwyd? Diolch.

15:40

Thank you, Janet, for that list of questions. Around the shielded group of people, I think the majority of your questions were around people not getting the letters, and I'll certainly raise it with the health Minister. I have already raised it with the health Minister—I said in an earlier answer that I've had constituents contact me. But I think the nub of your question was around, 'Will we be able to then add people to the shielded list?', and, absolutely, we will be able to—I can give you that assurance.

Clearly, many of our food and drink producers have had a severe impact from COVID-19, like the economy, obviously, in general. Certainly, I've heard of many businesses that donated—particularly restaurants and around the food service sector—food in the beginning, when these measures came in. Vineyards—I haven't had anything specifically about vineyards. I am very aware of the one in your constituency. But, certainly, my understanding is they would be able to access the support from the economic crisis fund. 

You raise a very important point about food boxes, because, you can imagine, to get those food boxes out as quickly as possible we used the same two companies that DEFRA had used as well, because they were there and ready to go, and it was easier for us to get the procurement measures in relation to getting that food out. So, dietary requirements weren't considered, because, for those of you who don't know, a typical box has a range of items—it has long-life milk, it has tinned produce, it has pasta, it has toilet roll, breakfast cereal. The contents are very clearly labelled.

But one thing I was very keen—well, there were two things I was really keen to do. We've done this, initially, for 12 weeks, but, equally, I would like to see more fruit and veg, if at all possible, going in those boxes. So, that’s something that we’re looking at right now. The first food box went out last Thursday, so I'm not sure if we're still in week one or if we're now going into week two in relation to those food delivery boxes, but certainly by week three, I wanted to look at being able to put some fresh food, fresh fruit and vegetables, into those boxes. So, hopefully, within the next—obviously next week is deemed as recess, hopefully when we come back we will be able to do that. We also need to look at the dietary requirements, and particularly if people have got a health condition that they need to have that. So, it provides essential food for people, but I—. You know, it's great to see those boxes arriving on people's doorsteps. It's very hard to have a one-size-fits-all solution, but I'm sure the Member will appreciate that it was a very immediate need to get that food out.

Diolch, Janet, am y rhestr yna o gwestiynau. Ynghylch y grŵp o bobl a warchodir, rwy'n credu bod y rhan fwyaf o'ch cwestiynau yn ymwneud â phobl sydd heb gael y llythyrau, a byddaf yn sicr yn trafod hynny gyda'r Gweinidog iechyd. Rwyf eisoes wedi dwyn hynny at sylw'r Gweinidog iechyd—dywedais mewn ateb cynharach bod etholwyr wedi cysylltu â mi. Ond rwy'n credu bod hanfod eich cwestiwn ynghylch 'a allwn ni ychwanegu pobl at y rhestr warchod?', ac, yn sicr, gallwn—gallaf roi'r sicrwydd hwnnw i chi.

Yn amlwg, mae COVID-19 wedi cael effaith ddifrifol ar lawer o'n cynhyrchwyr bwyd a diod, fel yr economi, yn amlwg, yn gyffredinol. Yn sicr, rwyf wedi clywed am lawer o fusnesau—yn enwedig bwytai a'r sector gwasanaethau bwyd—a roddodd fwyd yn y dechrau, pan gyflwynwyd y mesurau hyn. Gwinllannoedd—nid wyf wedi cael dim yn benodol ynghylch gwinllannoedd. Rwyf yn ymwybodol iawn o'r un yn eich etholaeth chi. Ond, yn sicr, fy nealltwriaeth i yw y byddent yn gallu elwa ar y cymorth o'r gronfa argyfwng economaidd.

Rydych yn codi pwynt pwysig iawn am flychau bwyd, oherwydd, gallwch ddychmygu, er mwyn dosbarthu'r blychau bwyd hynny  mor gyflym â phosib, fe wnaethom ni ddefnyddio yr un ddau gwmni ag yr oedd DEFRA wedi'u defnyddio hefyd, am eu bod yno ac yn barod i weithredu, ac roedd yn haws inni gael y mesurau caffael mewn cysylltiad â dosbarthu'r bwyd hwnnw. Felly, nid ystyriwyd gofynion deietegol, oherwydd, i'r rhai ohonoch chi nad ydych yn gwybod, mae blwch arferol yn cynnwys amrywiaeth o eitemau—mae ganddo laeth oes hir, mae ganddo gynnyrch tun, mae ganddo basta, mae ganddo bapur tŷ bach, grawnfwyd brecwast. Mae'r cynnwys wedi'i labelu'n glir iawn.

Ond un peth yr oeddwn i'n awyddus iawn—wel, roedd dau beth yr oeddwn i'n awyddus iawn i'w gwneud. Rydym ni wedi gwneud hyn, i ddechrau, am 12 wythnos, ond, yn yr un modd, hoffwn weld mwy o ffrwythau a llysiau, os oes modd o gwbl, yn y blychau hynny. Felly, mae hynny'n rhywbeth yr ydym yn ei ystyried ar hyn o bryd. Aeth y blwch bwyd cyntaf allan ddydd Iau diwethaf, felly nid wyf yn siŵr os ydym yn dal yn wythnos un neu a ydym nawr yn mynd i wythnos dau o ran y blychau cyflenwi bwyd hynny, ond yn sicr erbyn wythnos tri, roeddwn i eisiau edrych ar y posibilrwydd o roi rhywfaint o fwyd ffres, ffrwythau a llysiau ffres, i mewn i'r blychau hynny. Felly, gobeithio, o fewn y—yn amlwg mae'r wythnos nesaf yn cael ei hystyried yn doriad, gobeithio pan ddown yn ôl y byddwn yn gallu gwneud hynny. Mae angen inni edrych hefyd ar y gofynion deietegol, ac yn enwedig os oes gan bobl gyflwr iechyd y mae angen i bobl gael y cynnyrch hwnnw. Felly, mae'n darparu bwyd hanfodol i bobl, ond rwyf—. Wyddoch chi, mae'n wych gweld y blychau hynny'n cyrraedd stepen drws pobl. Mae'n anodd iawn cael un ateb sy'n addas i bawb, ond rwy'n siŵr y bydd yr Aelod yn sylweddoli bod angen cael y bwyd hwnnw allan ar unwaith.

15:45

Three quick questions to finish this agenda item. Helen Mary Jones first.

Tri chwestiwn cyflym i orffen yr eitem hon ar yr agenda. Helen Mary Jones yn gyntaf.

Diolch, Llywydd. I'm grateful to the Minister for her statement, and I echo what everybody else has said about how important the work that everybody in our food sector is doing, from farms to our shops to the shop workers, and I know that's very stressful for some of them.

With regard to the supermarket provision, I'm very pleased to hear what the Minister's had to say now that all the lists should have been made available, and I was relieved to hear her say to Janet Finch-Saunders that we will be able to add people to those lists. It was mentioned, for example, in the First Minister's statement about people with motor neurone disease who seem to have been missed altogether. Can I ask the Minister what would be the best way for us to proceed, as Members, if we are receiving representations—as Lynne Neagle has, and I have, and many of us—from constituents who are still being told as customers of supermarkets that they can't use the slots or that they haven't got the right information? Would it be advisable for us to write to the Minister, or would she prefer us to take this matter up directly with the supermarkets, because, as so often—I'm sure the Minister will acknowledge—we can get things right nationally, but in terms of them actually working at a local level for people, the intelligence that comes to us as elected Members is very important?

With regard to the food box provision, I absolutely understand what the Minister says about just needing to get this out of the door quickly and I know that it's been an absolute lifeline for some of my constituents. The Minister referred to local authorities as a key partner in all of this. I wonder if, as the scheme goes on, she could envisage them paying a larger role in the procurement—with the resources coming with that, of course—because that might be an opportunity. She mentions having more fresh food in those boxes, it might also be an opportunity if we involve local authorities to be able to support local food supply chains. So, I wonder if she’d give that some further consideration as things move forward.

On a different matter, I'm sure the Minister will agree with me that animal sanctuaries play a really important role in animal welfare in Wales, and, of course, those sanctuaries are all run on a voluntary basis. I have had a number of representations from sanctuaries in my region who are pointing out that, of course, their fundraising all depends on social activities, on their shops—all things that have had to come to an end. I wonder if the Minister today can commit to, if she hasn't already, giving some consideration to what support might be able to be made available to them, because, of course, the food is still needed for the animals and there may be a need for veterinary care and to pay for that.

And, just finally, I've received representations suggesting to me that some of the current business support doesn't work very well for tourism businesses—many of which, of course, may be farm diversifications. So, for example, if you're a caravan park you won't be receiving any income, but you won't be able to furlough your staff necessarily because you'll still need them to be cutting the grass, doing the maintenance. I realise this is predominantly a matter for Ken Skates's portfolio, but I wonder if I can ask the Minister today to have some further discussions with Ken Skates with a view to ensuring that we have business support packages available that will actually work for these rural businesses, which, of course, I'm sure the Minister will agree are very important.

Diolch, Llywydd. Rwy'n ddiolchgar i'r Gweinidog am ei datganiad, ac ategaf yr hyn y mae pawb arall wedi'i ddweud ynglŷn â pha mor bwysig yw'r gwaith y mae pawb yn ein sector bwyd yn ei wneud, o ffermydd i'n siopau ac i'r gweithwyr siopau, a gwn fod hynny'n achosi cryn straen i rai ohonyn nhw.

O ran darpariaeth archfarchnadoedd, rwy'n falch iawn o glywed yr hyn a ddywedodd y Gweinidog nawr y dylid bod yr holl restrau wedi eu darparu, ac roeddwn yn falch o'i chlywed yn dweud wrth Janet Finch-Saunders y byddwn yn gallu ychwanegu pobl at y rhestrau hynny. Soniwyd, er enghraifft, yn natganiad y Prif Weinidog am bobl â chlefyd niwronau motor yr ymddengys eu bod wedi cael eu diystyru'n gyfan gwbl. A gaf i ofyn i'r Gweinidog beth fyddai'r ffordd orau i ni symud ymlaen, fel Aelodau, os ydym yn cael sylwadau—fel y mae Lynne Neagle, a minnau, a llawer ohonom—gan etholwyr sy'n dal i gael eu hysbysu, fel cwsmeriaid archfarchnadoedd na allant ddefnyddio'r slotiau neu nad oes ganddyn nhw'r wybodaeth gywir? A fyddai'n ddoeth i ni ysgrifennu at y Gweinidog, neu a fyddai'n well ganddi pe baem ni'n codi'r mater hwn yn uniongyrchol gyda'r archfarchnadoedd, oherwydd, yn aml—rwy'n siŵr y bydd y Gweinidog yn cydnabod—gallwn wneud pethau'n iawn yn genedlaethol, ond o ran eu bod yn gweithio ar lefel leol i bobl, mae'r wybodaeth sy'n dod i ni fel aelodau etholedig yn bwysig iawn?

Ynghylch darparu blychau bwyd, rwy'n deall yn llwyr yr hyn y mae'r Gweinidog yn ei ddweud am yr angen i sicrhau bod hyn ar waith yn gyflym a gwn y bu yn achubiaeth lwyr i rai o'm hetholwyr. Cyfeiriodd y Gweinidog at awdurdodau lleol fel partner allweddol yn hyn i gyd. Tybed wrth i'r cynllun fynd rhagddo, y gallai hi ragweld y bydden nhw'n chwarae fwy o ran yn y broses caffael—gyda'r adnoddau'n dod yn sgil hynny, wrth gwrs—oherwydd gallai hynny fod yn gyfle. Mae'n sôn am gael mwy o fwyd ffres yn y blychau hynny, gallai fod yn gyfle hefyd drwy gynnwys awdurdodau lleol i gefnogi cadwyni cyflenwi bwyd lleol. Felly, tybed a fyddai hi'n ystyried hynny eto wrth i bethau symud ymlaen.

Ynghylch mater gwahanol, rwy'n siŵr y bydd y Gweinidog yn cytuno â mi fod llochesi anifeiliaid yn chwarae rhan bwysig iawn o ran lles anifeiliaid yng Nghymru, ac, wrth gwrs, caiff y llochesi hynny i gyd eu rhedeg gan wirfoddolwyr. Rwyf wedi cael nifer o sylwadau gan lochesi yn fy rhanbarth sy'n tynnu sylw at y ffaith bod eu gwaith codi arian i gyd, wrth gwrs, yn dibynnu ar weithgareddau cymdeithasol, ar eu siopau—pob peth sydd wedi gorfod dod i ben. Tybed a all y Gweinidog heddiw ymrwymo i roi rhywfaint o ystyriaeth i ba gymorth a allai fod ar gael iddyn nhw, os nad yw eisoes wedi gwneud hynny, oherwydd, wrth gwrs, mae'r anifeiliaid yn dal angen bwyd ac efallai y bydd angen gofal milfeddygol a bydd angen talu am hwnnw.

Ac, yn olaf, rwyf wedi cael sylwadau sy'n awgrymu i mi nad yw rhai elfennau o'r cymorth busnes presennol yn gweithio'n dda iawn i fusnesau twristiaeth—gallai llawer ohonyn nhw wrth gwrs fod yn ffermydd wedi arallgyfeirio. Felly, er enghraifft, os ydych chi'n barc carafanau, ni fyddwch yn cael unrhyw incwm, ond ni fyddwch yn gallu rhoi seibiant i'ch staff o reidrwydd oherwydd y bydd eu hangen i dorri'r gwair, gwneud gwaith cynnal a chadw. Rwy'n sylweddoli mai mater i bortffolio Ken Skates yw hwn yn bennaf, ond tybed a gaf i ofyn i'r Gweinidog heddiw drafod ymhellach gyda Ken Skates gyda'r bwriad o sicrhau bod gennym ni becynnau cymorth busnes ar gael a fydd yn gweithio mewn gwirionedd i'r busnesau gwledig hyn, ac rwy'n siŵr y bydd y Gweinidog, wrth gwrs, yn cytuno eu bod yn bwysig iawn.

Thank you, Helen Mary, and certainly, picking up that last point, I will raise that with Ken Skates around the business support. Your other specific questions, then. I think you're right about our retail workforce; they have worked incredibly hard. We saw that huge rise in people stockpiling and that now has levelled off. Certainly, in my discussions I've had with the supermarkets, they've made that very clear that that initial peak has now passed and they are able to stock their shelves so that people—. Our very hard-working NHS staff, who were turning up at 5 o'clock in their local supermarket as usual to buy milk and bread and couldn't do that, that's now passed, and you should now be able to shop in a normal way. I'm very pleased that supermarkets have also had those protected slots for our NHS workers, who absolutely needed them, and also for the elderly in the beginning, but that now obviously has changed, and also the social care sector. I think many supermarkets have ensured they've had those protected slots for social care workers as well.

I do think there was an inconsistency, also, around—and this would have led, as well, to our retail workers finding it stressful—protection for themselves. So, for those of us that go to supermarkets, we will see now that most of the supermarkets have screens in place, and, again, all the supermarkets assured me that, by the end of last week, those screens would be in place.

Around the food boxes, I hear what Helen Mary says about local authorities, but I think we've asked a huge amount of our local authorities, and I'm really grateful for the work that they've done. As I say, we've got a very robust system in place. All 22 local authorities are signed up to the food box delivery scheme. Every day, I receive the latest numbers of how many food packages have gone out in each local authority every day. I think in Merthyr Tydfil it was over 400, up until yesterday. In some local authorities, it is not so much, but everybody is signed up to it now, which I think is really important.

Around the fresh fruit and vegetables, I mentioned in my earlier answer that we've committed to these boxes for 12 weeks, but throughout those 12 weeks, we can look at ensuring there are more fruit and vegetables in those boxes, for instance. At the end of 12 weeks, maybe we could look at using Welsh producers, because I'm really keen to be able to do that.

The point you raise about animal sanctuaries, and clearly for a lot of charities, they have seen, probably, an end to their fundraising and also their trading activity, if they run a shop, for instance. This sits within the portfolio of Jane Hutt, and I know she's been having discussions around support for charities. This morning, the First Minister invited Ruth Marks to update us about the work that the Wales Council for Voluntary Action and the local voluntary council sector partnerships have been doing about this. But, again, I'll raise this point with Jane Hutt.

Diolch, Helen Mary, ac yn sicr, o ran y pwynt olaf yna, fe wnaf godi hynny gyda Ken Skates ynghylch y cymorth i fusnesau. Eich cwestiynau penodol eraill, felly. Rwy'n credu eich bod yn iawn ynghylch ein gweithlu manwerthu; maen nhw wedi gweithio'n eithriadol o galed. Gwelsom y cynnydd enfawr hwnnw yn nifer y bobl a oedd yn pentyrru nwyddau ac mae hyn fwy neu lai wedi dod i ben. Yn sicr, yn y trafodaethau yr wyf wedi eu cael gyda'r archfarchnadoedd, maen nhw wedi gwneud hynny'n glir iawn sef bod y cyfnod prysuraf cychwynnol hwnnw wedi dod i ben bellach a'u bod nhw'n gallu llenwi eu silffoedd fel bod pobl—. Roedd ein staff yn y GIG sy'n gweithio'n galed iawn, yn cyrraedd eu harchfarchnad leol am 5 o'r gloch fel arfer i brynu llaeth a bara ac yn methu â gwneud hynny; nid yw hynny'n digwydd bellach, a dylech chi nawr allu siopa yn y ffordd arferol. Rwy'n falch iawn bod archfarchnadoedd hefyd wedi sicrhau'r amseroedd gwarchodedig hynny ar gyfer ein gweithwyr GIG, a oedd wir eu hangen, a hefyd ar gyfer yr henoed ar y dechrau, ond mae hynny'n amlwg wedi newid, a hefyd y sector gofal cymdeithasol. Rwy'n credu bod llawer o archfarchnadoedd wedi sicrhau bod ganddyn nhw'r amseroedd gwarchodedig hynny ar gyfer gweithwyr gofal cymdeithasol hefyd.

Rwy'n credu bod anghysondeb, hefyd, o ran—a byddai hyn wedi arwain, hefyd, at ein gweithwyr manwerthu yn ei chael hi'n anodd—amddiffyn eu hunain. Felly, i'r rheini ohonom ni sy'n mynd i archfarchnadoedd, gwelwn nawr fod gan y rhan fwyaf o'r archfarchnadoedd sgriniau, ac, unwaith eto, fe'm sicrhawyd gan yr holl archfarchnadoedd y byddai'r sgriniau hynny ar gael erbyn diwedd yr wythnos diwethaf.

Ynghylch y blychau bwyd, rwy'n deall yr hyn y mae Helen Mary yn ei ddweud am awdurdodau lleol, ond rwy'n credu ein bod wedi gofyn llawer gan ein hawdurdodau lleol, ac rwy'n ddiolchgar iawn am y gwaith y maen nhw wedi'i wneud. Fel rwy'n dweud, mae gennym ni system gadarn iawn ar waith. Mae pob un o'r 22 o awdurdodau lleol wedi cofrestru ar gyfer y cynllun cyflenwi bocsys bwyd. Bob dydd, rwy'n cael manylion am y nifer diweddaraf o becynnau bwyd sydd wedi eu dosbarthu ym mhob awdurdod lleol. Rwy'n credu bod y rhif ym Merthyr Tudful dros 400, hyd at ddoe. Mewn rhai awdurdodau lleol, nid yw gymaint â hynny, ond mae pawb wedi ymrwymo iddo nawr, a chredaf fod hynny'n bwysig iawn.

O ran y ffrwythau a'r llysiau ffres, soniais yn fy ateb cynharach ein bod wedi ymrwymo i'r blychau hyn am 12 wythnos, ond drwy gydol y 12 wythnos hynny, gallwn er enghraifft, sicrhau bod mwy o ffrwythau a llysiau yn y blychau hynny. Ar ddiwedd y 12 wythnos, efallai y gallem ni ystyried defnyddio cynhyrchwyr o Gymru, gan fy mod yn awyddus iawn i wneud hynny.

Y pwynt a godwch am lochesi anifeiliaid, ac yn amlwg i lawer o elusennau, maen nhw wedi gweld, mae'n debyg, ddiwedd ar eu gwaith codi arian a hefyd eu gweithgaredd masnachu, os ydynt yn rhedeg siop, er enghraifft. Mae hyn yn rhan o bortffolio Jane Hutt, a gwn ei bod wedi cynnal trafodaethau ynghylch cymorth i elusennau. Y bore yma, gwahoddodd y Prif Weinidog Ruth Marks i roi'r wybodaeth ddiweddaraf inni am y gwaith y mae Cyngor Gweithredu Gwirfoddol Cymru a phartneriaethau sector y cynghorau gwirfoddol lleol wedi bod yn ei wneud ynglŷn â hyn. Ond, unwaith eto, byddaf yn codi'r pwynt hwn gyda Jane Hutt.

15:50

I'm not going to repeat all those things that people have asked, except for on footpaths. When you set out the regulation, there was also a 28-day review period. So, I ask the Minister when she is going to make an announcement, having carried out that review, because in two weeks' time that will need to be the case.

I do want to ask about how we're going to manage getting the crops in the ground, and whether you've had ongoing discussions about the workers' availability, because it's very clear that people who might find themselves out of work might welcome the opportunity to help here. Any update that you might have on that would be more than welcome.

But I also want to ask a question that has been asked, and that's about garden centres and nurseries, and, coupled with that, I suppose all the other downturns in businesses. So, there's a wider question here about how, as a Government and a business support community more generally, we're helping people not to just diversify in what they do, but to diversify in how they sell what they're doing and how we support them going forward. I think there's a clear case here for investment in whatever means those are, whether it's training, whether it's technology, or whatever it is, to help businesses who have expanded, who are operating normally through the current set-up, but need to move online to just be self-sustaining in times like this situation now, and it's very much focused our minds, I suppose, to modernise the businesses. Thank you.

Dydw i ddim yn mynd i ailadrodd yr holl bethau hynny y mae pobl wedi eu gofyn, ac eithrio ynghylch llwybrau troed. Pan gyhoeddwyd y rheoliad, cafwyd cyfnod adolygu 28 diwrnod hefyd. Felly, gofynnaf i'r Gweinidog pryd fydd hi'n gwneud cyhoeddiad, ar ôl cynnal yr adolygiad hwnnw, oherwydd ymhen pythefnos bydd angen i hynny ddigwydd.

Rwyf eisiau holi sut yr ydym yn mynd i lwyddo i gael y cnydau yn y ddaear, ac a ydych chi wedi cael trafodaethau parhaus ynghylch cael gafael ar weithwyr, oherwydd mae'n amlwg iawn y gallai pobl sydd efallai heb waith, groesawu'r cyfle i helpu yn hyn o beth. Byddai unrhyw newyddion diweddar ynghylch hynny a allai fod gennych chi yn cael ei groesawu'n fawr.

Ond rwyf hefyd eisiau gofyn cwestiwn sydd wedi cael ei ofyn, a hynny am ganolfannau garddio a meithrinfeydd planhigion, ac, ynghyd â hynny, mae'n debyg busnesau eraill sy'n dioddef dirywiad. Felly, mae cwestiwn ehangach yma ynglŷn â sut y byddwn ni, fel Llywodraeth a chymuned sy'n cefnogi busnesau yn fwy cyffredinol, yn helpu pobl nid yn unig i arallgyfeirio o ran yr hyn y maen nhw'n ei wneud, ond i arallgyfeirio yn y ffordd y maen nhw'n gwerthu'r hyn y maen nhw'n ei wneud a sut yr ydym ni'n eu cefnogi wrth fwrw ymlaen. Rwy'n credu bod achos clir yma dros fuddsoddi yn y moddion hynny beth bynnag ydyn nhw, boed yn hyfforddiant, boed yn dechnoleg, neu beth bynnag ydyn nhw, i helpu busnesau sydd wedi ehangu, sydd yn gweithredu fel arfer yn y drefn bresennol, ond sydd angen mynd ar-lein er mwyn bod yn hunangynhaliol mewn cyfnod fel hwn nawr, ac mae wedi gwneud inni feddwl yn fwy i raddau helaeth, mae'n debyg am foderneiddio'r busnesau. Diolch.

15:55

Thank you, Joyce. In relation to the footpaths and the 28-day period, that will be for Hannah Blythyn to review, and I will ensure she's aware of your question.

I think the point you raise about crops in the ground is very important, and I referred before to the thousands of people who come—you know, seasonal agricultural workers—and clearly that's a very big issue. It's not just about the horticultural part of agriculture; it's the other people who come and help us in sheep shearing, for instance. That's another area that's been raised. So, I meet weekly with the Secretary of State for DEFRA and devolved administration counterparts, and agricultural workers also come up in a sort of cross-Government—I can't think what it's called now. I think it's the ministerial inter-governmental group. I've twice attended that UK Government group—that's a meeting chaired by Michael Gove—where the agricultural work sector and workforce has come up on the agenda. So it's clearly something that we're going to have to look at. As you said, there are people who may be furloughed at the moment, so one of the questions I've been asking is: if you have a furloughed worker who's currently getting paid and then wants to do additional work in agriculture, it's important that the funding they're receiving, will that change? Because clearly people would want to make sure that they protect their earnings.

In relation to garden centres, I mentioned that a few of them are now selling online. I'm not sure if they've had specific business support from Ken Skates's portfolio, but I'm sure there is advice there that we could share with them in order to be able to do that.

Before I move to the next question, Llywydd, I just realised that I didn't answer Janet Finch-Saunders around the 2m rule. Clearly, for food businesses—certainly, meat processors raised their concerns with me last week, which I made representations about. But I'm sure you will appreciate that all workplaces have a role in stopping the spread of coronavirus, and they are taking a proportionate approach. We would hope that all such places were taking a proportionate approach, and I know that many businesses have halved—not halved the number of workers, but made sure that the space is bigger. In some areas, you can't do it. So, for instance, a dentist could never be 2m away from a patient, and I think that's a very good example of a reasonable measure.

Diolch, Joyce. O ran y llwybrau troed a'r cyfnod o 28 diwrnod, bydd yn rhaid i Hannah Blythyn eu hadolygu, a byddaf yn sicrhau ei bod yn ymwybodol o'ch cwestiwn.

Rwy'n credu bod y pwynt yr ydych yn ei godi am gnydau yn y ddaear yn bwysig iawn, a chyfeiriais o'r blaen at y miloedd o bobl sy'n dod—wyddoch chi, gweithwyr amaethyddol tymhorol—ac yn amlwg mae hwnnw'n fater enfawr. Nid yw'n ymwneud â'r rhan arddwriaethol o amaethyddiaeth yn unig; y bobl eraill sy'n dod i'n helpu ni i gneifio defaid, er enghraifft. Mae hwnnw'n faes arall sydd wedi'i godi. Felly, rwyf yn cyfarfod yn wythnosol â'r Ysgrifennydd Gwladol dros DEFRA a chymheiriaid mewn gweinyddiaeth ddatganoledig, ac mae gweithwyr amaethyddol hefyd yn cael eu crybwyll mewn rhyw fath o—ni allaf gofio beth yw'r enw ar hyn o bryd. Rwy'n credu mai'r grŵp rhynglywodraethol gweinidogol ydyw. Rwyf wedi bod yn bresennol ddwywaith yn y grŵp hwnnw yn Llywodraeth y DU—mae hwnnw'n gyfarfod a gadeirir gan Michael Gove—lle mae'r sector gwaith a'r gweithlu amaethyddol wedi dod ar yr agenda. Felly mae'n amlwg yn rhywbeth y bydd yn rhaid i ni edrych arno. Fel y dywedsoch chi, mae yna bobl a all fod ar seibiant ar hyn o bryd, felly un o'r cwestiynau yr wyf i wedi bod yn ei ofyn yw: os oes gweithiwr ar seibiant sy'n cael cyflog ar hyn o bryd ac yn awyddus i wneud gwaith ychwanegol ym myd amaeth, o ran yr arian y mae'n ei gael, sy'n bwysig, a fydd hwn yn newid? Oherwydd yn amlwg byddai pobl eisiau sicrhau bod eu henillion yn ddiogel.

O ran canolfannau garddio, soniais fod rhai ohonyn nhw nawr yn gwerthu ar-lein. Dydw i ddim yn siŵr a ydyn nhw wedi cael cymorth busnes penodol gan bortffolio Ken Skates, ond rwy'n siŵr bod cyngor y gallem ni ei rannu gyda nhw er mwyn gallu gwneud hynny.

Cyn i mi symud at y cwestiwn nesaf, Llywydd, sylweddolais nad oeddwn wedi ateb Janet Finch-Saunders ynghylch y rheol 2m. Yn amlwg, i fusnesau bwyd—yn sicr, cododd proseswyr cig eu pryderon gyda mi yr wythnos diwethaf, a gwnes sylwadau amdanyn nhw. Ond rwy'n siŵr y byddwch yn gwerthfawrogi bod gan bob gweithle ran i'w chwarae wrth atal lledaeniad y coronafeirws, a'u bod nhw'n mynd ati mewn modd cymesur. Byddem yn gobeithio bod pob man o'r fath yn mynd ati mewn modd cymesur, a gwn fod nifer o fusnesau wedi haneru—nid haneru nifer y gweithwyr, ond gwneud yn siŵr bod y lle yn fwy. Mewn rhai meysydd, ni allwch chi wneud hynny. Felly, er enghraifft, ni allai deintydd fod 2m oddi wrth glaf, ac rwy'n credu bod honno'n enghraifft dda iawn o gam rhesymol.

The Minister will appreciate that for Mid and West Wales in particular seasonal businesses are vitally important to the economy, and this is particularly true in rural areas as well. Inevitably, the bulk of their season's income is now under threat, and it's very possible that some businesses will earn nothing during the spring or the summer. That poses very severe threats for what comes after this crisis is over, and we need to do some forward planning, therefore, about the cashflow situation that might arise in the autumn and in the winter. In this respect, although businesses have been getting a lot of help from Government, such as the job retention scheme, where 80 per cent of the costs of a furloughed employee are paid, nevertheless, businesses still have to pay that 20 per cent figure, and as Helen Mary Jones pointed out in relation to security costs and maintenance costs, they continue throughout this crisis even though there's no income coming in. So I wonder if the Minister can tell me what thought is being given to what follows in the immediate prospect after the summer to help these businesses get through the winter and back onto an even keel, because clearly it's going to take 12 months, 18 months, maybe two years to get over the problems that have been caused in the last few weeks.

Bydd y Gweinidog yn gwerthfawrogi bod busnesau tymhorol yn y gorllewin a'r canolbarth yn enwedig yn hanfodol bwysig i'r economi, ac mae hyn yn arbennig o wir mewn ardaloedd gwledig hefyd. Yn anorfod, mae'r rhan fwyaf o incwm eu tymor bellach o dan fygythiad, ac mae'n bosib iawn y bydd rhai busnesau yn ennill dim yn ystod y gwanwyn na'r haf. Mae hynny'n creu bygythiadau difrifol iawn o ran yr hyn a ddaw ar ôl i'r argyfwng hwn ddod i ben, ac mae angen inni flaengynllunio rhywfaint, felly, ar gyfer y sefyllfa o ran llif arian a allai godi yn yr hydref ac yn y gaeaf. Yn hyn o beth, er bod busnesau wedi bod yn cael llawer o help gan y Llywodraeth, megis y cynllun cadw swyddi, lle y telir 80 y cant o gostau gweithiwr ar seibiant, er hynny, mae'n rhaid i'r busnesau barhau i dalu'r ffigur hwnnw o 20 y cant, ac fel y nododd Helen Mary Jones yng nghyswllt costau diogelwch a chostau cynnal a chadw, maen nhw'n parhau drwy gydol yr argyfwng hwn, er nad oes incwm yn dod i mewn. Felly, tybed a wnaiff y Gweinidog ddweud wrthyf i pa ystyriaeth sy'n cael ei rhoi i'r hyn fydd yn dilyn yn syth ar ôl yr haf i helpu'r busnesau hyn i oroesi'r gaeaf a chodi eto, oherwydd mae'n amlwg y bydd yn cymryd 12 mis, 18 mis, efallai dwy flynedd i oresgyn y problemau sydd wedi'u hachosi yn ystod yr wythnosau diwethaf.

Thank you. I think you make a very important point, that this is not going to right itself very quickly. This is going to be an ongoing issue for so many businesses to work for. You are quite right: there's been significant support from Welsh Government for our businesses. I'm sure the Minister, Ken Skates, is looking at this and what else will be needed. So certainly for my own portfolio, I mentioned that I will be announcing support for fisheries, for instance. I don't know how long it's going to be before the market is back up and boats can go out to sea. So, clearly, as I'm looking at that scheme, I need to look at it not just in the here and now, but in the longer term too. But, I think we all have to accept that this is going to take a long time to get over. I thought the First Minister made a really important point about not wanting to go back to normal; I think we've seen a level of collaboration and co-operation that we haven't seen before. 

Diolch. Rwy'n credu eich bod yn gwneud pwynt pwysig iawn, sef nad yw'r sefyllfa hon yn mynd i wella ar ei phen ei hun yn gyflym iawn. Mae hon yn mynd i fod yn broblem barhaus i gynifer o fusnesau. Rydych yn llygad eich lle: mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi bod yn cefnogi ein busnesau yn sylweddol. Rwy'n siŵr fod y Gweinidog, Ken Skates, yn edrych ar hyn ac ar beth arall fydd ei angen. Felly yn sicr o ran fy mhortffolio i, soniais y byddaf yn cyhoeddi cefnogaeth i bysgodfeydd, er enghraifft. Dydw i ddim yn gwybod faint o amser y cymerith hi cyn bydd y farchnad yn ôl ar ei thraed ac y bydd cychod yn gallu mynd allan i'r môr. Felly, yn amlwg, wrth i mi edrych ar y cynllun hwnnw, mae angen imi edrych arno nid yn unig nawr ond yn y tymor hwy hefyd. Ond, rwy'n credu bod yn rhaid i ni i gyd dderbyn ei bod hi'n mynd i gymryd amser hir i adfer ar ôl hyn. Roeddwn yn credu bod y Prif Weinidog wedi gwneud pwynt pwysig iawn ynghylch peidio â bod eisiau mynd yn ôl i'r drefn arferol; rwy'n credu ein bod ni wedi gweld cydweithio a chydweithredu i'r graddau na welsom ni o'r blaen.

16:00

Thank you to the Minister.

In accordance with Standing Order 12.24 and 12.40, unless a Member objects, the motions for the general principles and the financial resolution of the Local Government and Elections (Wales) Bill will be grouped for debate and for voting. There are no objections. I see no objections. We will do that.

Before we move on to that debate, I will suspend proceedings now for 15 minutes.

Diolch yn fawr i'r Gweinidog.

Yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 12.24 a 12.40, oni bai y bydd Aelod yn gwrthwynebu, caiff y cynigion ar gyfer egwyddorion cyffredinol a phenderfyniad ariannol y Bil Llywodraeth Leol ac Etholiadau (Cymru) eu rhoi gyda'i gilydd i'w trafod ac i bleidleisio yn eu cylch. Nid oes gwrthwynebiad. Ni welaf unrhyw wrthwynebiad. Fe wnawn ni hynny.

Cyn inni symud ymlaen at y drafodaeth honno, rwy'n atal trafodion nawr am 15 munud.

Ataliwyd y Cyfarfod Llawn am 16:01.

Ailymgynullodd y Cynulliad am 16:15, gyda'r Llywydd yn y Gadair.

Plenary was suspended at 16:01.

The Assembly reconvened at 16:15, with the Llywydd in the Chair.

16:15
4. & 5. Dadl: Egwyddorion Cyffredinol y Bil Llywodraeth Leol ac Etholiadau (Cymru) a chynnig i gymeradwyo'r penderfyniad ariannol ynghylch y Bil Llywodraeth Leol ac Etholiadau (Cymru)
4. & 5. Debate: The General Principles of the Local Government and Elections (Wales) Bill and motion to agree the financial resolution in respect of the Local Government and Elections (Wales) Bill

The next item, therefore, is the debate on the general principles and the financial resolution of the Local Government and Elections (Wales) Bill, and I call on the Minister for Housing and Local Government to move the motion—Julie James.

Yr eitem nesaf, felly, yw'r ddadl ar egwyddorion cyffredinol a phenderfyniad ariannol y Bil Llywodraeth Leol ac Etholiadau (Cymru), a galwaf ar y Gweinidog Tai a Llywodraeth Leol i gynnig y cynnig—Julie James.

Cynnig NDM7307—Julie James

Cynnig bod Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru, yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 26.11:

Yn cytuno i egwyddorion cyffredinol y Bil Llywodraeth Leol ac Etholiadau (Cymru).

Motion NDM7307—Julie James

To propose that the National Assembly for Wales in accordance with Standing Order 26.11:

Agrees to the general principles of the Local Government and Elections (Wales) Bill.

Cynnig NDM7308—Rebecca Evans

Cynnig bod Cynulliad Cenedlaethol Cymru, at ddibenion unrhyw ddarpariaethau sy’n deillio o’r Bil Llywodraeth Leol ac Etholiadau (Cymru), yn cytuno i unrhyw gynnydd mewn gwariant o’r math y cyfeiriwyd ato yn Rheol Sefydlog 26.69, sy’n codi o ganlyniad i’r Bil.

Motion NDM7308—Rebecca Evans

To propose that the National Assembly for Wales, for the purposes of any provisions resulting from the Local Government and Elections (Wales) Bill, agrees to any increase in expenditure of a kind referred to in Standing Order 26.69, arising in consequence of the Bill.

Cynigiwyd y cynigion.

Motions moved.

Diolch, Llywydd. I'm very pleased to open this debate on the general principles and financial resolution of the Local Government and Elections (Wales) Bill, which I introduced in November. It is most definitely true that this debate is taking place in unprecedented times, and I am grateful to Members for recognising that, whilst there are significant challenges at the moment, we must always have an eye to the future. 

I am grateful to John Griffiths, Llyr Gruffydd, Mick Antoniw and the members of their respective committees for their thorough and constructive approach to scrutiny of the Bill and their subsequent reports and recommendations. I wrote to all three committees on 23 March setting out my thoughts in response to their comments and recommendations. I will not, therefore, attempt to address each of the almost 60 recommendations in the time we have this afternoon, but I will reflect on Members' comments if and when we move towards Stage 2. 

When introducing the Bill, I said the provisions had been subject to extensive consultation. This is acknowledged by the committees. I am very grateful to all the stakeholders who have contributed and worked with us over the years on developing the proposals in the Bill. This includes the members of the working group on local government and the subsequent sub-group of the partnership council who have shaped the Bill and are helping to co-produce the guidance and regulatory arrangements created by the Bill. I am also grateful to the organisations and individuals who provided oral and written evidence during this scrutiny stage.  

The Bill contains provisions to enable electoral reform and establishes a new governance framework for local government. I am pleased that stakeholders are generally supportive of the Bill's provisions, as are the committees. I am, therefore, delighted that the Equality, Local Government and Communities Committee recommended that the Senedd agrees the general principles of the Bill. 

Turning then to the detail of the Bill, I am pleased the majority of the Equality, Local Government and Communities Committee's members supported the extension of the franchise to 16 and 17-year-olds and foreign citizens legally resident in Wales. I am also pleased the committee supports our view that each principal council is best placed to decide for themselves which voting system better suits the needs of their local people and communities.

I note all the committee's views on the proposed Stage 2 amendments that would allow prisoners and young people in custody from Wales serving sentences of less than four years to vote in local government elections in Wales. I will not repeat the reasons for introducing provisions on prisoner voting at Stage 2, but rest assured I have carefully considered all the points made by the committees on these provisions. Unfortunately, Llywydd, I've had to take the decision, as part of the Welsh Government's wider consideration of its legislative programme at the start of our planning for coping with the grave circumstances we are in, not to commit any future official resource to this proposed Stage 2 amendment. 

Llywydd, Members, I am sure, will be aware that today's debate will, if the motion is passed, allow us to continue to include future work on the Bill in our planning for matters that we will want to be ready to progress once the crisis that we now face has passed. I know many Members support the Bill and its policy objectives, and passing this motion today will allow us to plan future resources to work on those shared policy objectives. 

Turning then to the non-election parts of the Bill, local government have been calling for a general power of competence for many years. The Welsh Government will continue to work closely with local government and stakeholders to identify where additional powers or flexibilities have been helpful to them in achieving their objectives. 

I accept the Equality, Local Government and Communities Committee's recommendations regarding the duty to encourage participation in decision making in connected bodies. I therefore intend to bring forward an amendment removing the concept of connected authorities at Stage 2.

I acknowledge the Finance Committee's concerns, based on those of local government, around the cost and practicalities of the broadcasting provisions. I think we share a common interest in making the provisions work in the most sensible and pragmatic way. A working group has been established with the WLGA to consider these issues and to identify how best the regulation-making power these provisions contains can be used to exclude certain council meetings from the requirement to broadcast. 

I accept the committee's recommendation 19 in relation to the poor performance management of chief executives, and the Welsh Government is working with Solace and ALACE on a revised approach.

The committee makes a number of recommendations in relation to job sharing. I am committed to enabling flexible arrangements where possible within a principal council, and we are continuing to work with partners to consider the implications of expansion in this area and what action and guidance might be required.

Corporate joint committees will provide local authorities in Wales with a consistent mechanism established in statute for regional collaboration. I welcome the committee's comments on our proposals. As highlighted in the Finance Committee's report, I am happy to commit to providing full and robust regulatory impact assessments for each piece of subordinate legislation made as a result of this Bill. This is the best place to assess their specific costs and benefits.

I welcome the degree of consensus amongst those giving evidence on the need for and appropriateness of the provisions in the Bill that will introduce a new system for improving performance and governance based on self-assessment and peer review. As recommended by the Equality, Local Government and Communities Committee, I intend to bring forward an amendment to include a provision in the Bill that clarifies the timing of a self-assessment report.

I'm also pleased to announce today that I have published guidance: a prospectus for the voluntary merger of principal councils in Wales. The guidance was prepared by the working group on local government. It provides practical advice on the core issues that will need to be addressed as part of developing any proposal for a voluntary merger.

We have been working closely with the Welsh Local Government Association, local authorities and advice services to improve all aspects of council tax collection and the management of arrears. This work, which is focused on prevention, will continue.

The Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee have made a number of recommendations about the proposed procedures for the exercise of subordinate legislative and other delegated powers in the Bill. It has not been possible for me to accept all of the committee's recommendations in full, and I set out my reason in my written response to the committee's report.

I note and accept in principle the Equality, Local Government and Communities Committee's recommendation 32. I have committed to using the guidance on performance and governance in the Bill to highlight the importance of housing considerations in the discharge of local authority functions as an example of where councils should be striving to do better and not just meeting minimum requirements. This will ensure the provision of housing is considered alongside the range of powers and duties that councils have as part of a wider corporate assessment of the overall performance of the council, rather than in isolation.

In conclusion, this Bill provides the powers and tools local government have been asking for. It will enable them to deliver modern, accessible, high-quality public services for and with the communities that they serve. I do urge Members to agree the general principles and the financial resolution of the Bill today. Diolch, Llywydd.

Diolch, Llywydd. Rwy'n falch iawn o agor y ddadl hon ar egwyddorion cyffredinol a phenderfyniad ariannol y Bil Llywodraeth Leol ac Etholiadau (Cymru), a gyflwynais ym mis Tachwedd. Mae'n sicr yn wir fod y ddadl hon yn digwydd mewn cyfnod digynsail, ac rwy'n ddiolchgar i'r Aelodau am gydnabod, er bod heriau sylweddol ar hyn o bryd, bod yn rhaid inni bob amser edrych i'r dyfodol.

Rwy'n ddiolchgar i John Griffiths, Llyr Gruffydd, Mick Antoniw ac aelodau eu pwyllgorau am eu dull trwyadl ac adeiladol o graffu ar y Bil a'u hadroddiadau a'u hargymhellion dilynol. Ysgrifennais at y tri phwyllgor ar 23 Mawrth yn nodi fy syniadau mewn ymateb i'w sylwadau a'u hargymhellion. Felly, ni cheisiaf fynd i'r afael â phob un o bron i 60 o argymhellion yn yr amser sydd gennym y prynhawn yma, ond byddaf yn myfyrio ar sylwadau'r Aelodau os a phan symudwn tuag at Gyfnod 2.

Wrth gyflwyno'r Bil, dywedais fod y darpariaethau wedi bod yn destun ymgynghori helaeth. Caiff hyn ei gydnabod gan y pwyllgorau. Rwy'n ddiolchgar iawn i'r holl randdeiliaid sydd wedi cyfrannu ac wedi gweithio gyda ni dros y blynyddoedd ar ddatblygu'r cynigion yn y Bil. Mae hyn yn cynnwys aelodau'r gweithgor ar lywodraeth leol ac is-grŵp dilynol y cyngor partneriaeth sydd wedi llunio'r Bil ac sy'n helpu i gyd-gynhyrchu'r canllawiau a'r trefniadau rheoleiddio a grëir gan y Bil. Rwyf hefyd yn ddiolchgar i'r sefydliadau a'r unigolion a ddarparodd dystiolaeth lafar ac ysgrifenedig yn ystod y cyfnod craffu hwn.

Mae'r Bil yn cynnwys darpariaethau i alluogi diwygio etholiadol ac yn sefydlu fframwaith llywodraethu newydd ar gyfer llywodraeth leol. Rwy'n falch bod rhanddeiliaid, yn gyffredinol, yn cefnogi darpariaethau'r Bil, fel y mae'r pwyllgorau. Felly, rwy'n falch iawn fod y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau wedi argymell bod y Senedd yn cytuno ar egwyddorion cyffredinol y Bil.

Gan droi wedyn at fanylion y Bil, rwy'n falch bod y rhan fwyaf o Aelodau'r Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau wedi cefnogi ymestyn yr etholfraint i bobl ifanc 16 ac 17 oed a dinasyddion tramor sy'n preswylio'n gyfreithlon yng Nghymru. Rwyf hefyd yn falch bod y pwyllgor yn cefnogi ein barn mai'r prif gynghorau sydd yn y sefyllfa orau i benderfynu drostynt eu hunain pa system bleidleisio sy'n gweddu'n well i anghenion eu pobl a'u cymunedau lleol.

Rwy'n cydnabod holl safbwyntiau'r pwyllgor ar y gwelliannau arfaethedig ar gyfer Cyfnod 2 a fyddai'n caniatáu i garcharorion a phobl ifanc yn y ddalfa o Gymru sydd â dedfrydau o lai na phedair blynedd i bleidleisio mewn etholiadau llywodraeth leol yng Nghymru. Nid ailadroddaf y rhesymau dros gyflwyno darpariaethau yng Nghyfnod 2 o ran rhoi'r bleidlais i garcharorion, ond gallaf eich sicrhau fy mod wedi ystyried yn ofalus yr holl bwyntiau a wnaed gan y pwyllgorau ar y darpariaethau hyn. Yn anffodus, Llywydd, rwyf wedi gorfod gwneud y penderfyniad, fel rhan o ystyriaeth ehangach Llywodraeth Cymru o'i rhaglen ddeddfwriaethol ar ddechrau ein gwaith cynllunio ar gyfer ymdopi â'r amgylchiadau difrifol yr ydym ynddynt, i beidio ag ymrwymo unrhyw adnodd swyddogol yn y dyfodol i'r gwelliant arfaethedig hwn yng Nghyfnod 2.

Llywydd, bydd yr Aelodau, rwy'n siŵr, yn ymwybodol y bydd y ddadl heddiw, os caiff y cynnig ei basio, yn caniatáu inni barhau i gynnwys gwaith yn y dyfodol ar y Bil yn ein cynlluniau ar gyfer materion y byddwn eisiau iddynt fod yn barod i'w datblygu unwaith y bydd yr argyfwng a wynebwn nawr wedi mynd heibio. Gwn fod llawer o Aelodau'n cefnogi'r Bil ac amcanion ei bolisi, a bydd pasio'r cynnig hwn heddiw yn caniatáu inni gynllunio adnoddau ar gyfer y dyfodol i weithio ar amcanion y polisi hynny yr ydym ni'n gytûn yn eu cylch.

Gan droi wedyn at rannau o'r Bil nad ydynt yn ymwneud ag etholiadau, mae llywodraeth leol wedi bod yn galw am bŵer cymhwysedd cyffredinol am flynyddoedd lawer. Bydd Llywodraeth Cymru yn parhau i weithio'n agos gyda llywodraeth leol a rhanddeiliaid i ddynodi lle mae pwerau neu hyblygrwydd ychwanegol wedi bod o gymorth iddyn nhw gyflawni eu hamcanion.

Rwy'n derbyn argymhellion y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau ynghylch y ddyletswydd i annog pobl i gymryd rhan yn y broses o wneud penderfyniadau mewn cyrff cysylltiedig. Rwyf felly'n bwriadu cyflwyno gwelliant yn dileu'r cysyniad o awdurdodau cysylltiedig yng Nghyfnod 2.

Rwy'n cydnabod pryderon y Pwyllgor Cyllid, ar sail rhai llywodraeth leol, ynghylch cost ac ymarferoldeb y darpariaethau darlledu. Rwy'n credu bod gennym ni ddiddordeb cyffredin mewn sicrhau bod y darpariaethau'n gweithio yn y ffordd fwyaf synhwyrol ac ymarferol. Sefydlwyd gweithgor gyda CLlLC i ystyried y materion hyn ac i bwyso a mesur beth fyddai'r ffordd orau o ddefnyddio'r pŵer i wneud rheoliadau y mae'r darpariaethau hyn yn ei gynnwys i eithrio cyfarfodydd cyngor penodol o'r gofyniad i ddarlledu.

Rwy'n derbyn argymhelliad 19 y pwyllgor mewn cysylltiad â rheoli perfformiad gwael gan brif weithredwyr, ac mae Llywodraeth Cymru yn gweithio gyda Chymdeithas Prif Weithredwyr ac Uwch-reolwyr Awdurdodau Lleol Cymru a Chymdeithas Prif Weithredwyr ac Uwch-reolwyr Awdurdodau Lleol ar ddull gweithredu diwygiedig.

Mae'r pwyllgor yn gwneud nifer o argymhellion mewn cysylltiad â rhannu swyddi. Rwyf wedi ymrwymo i alluogi trefniadau hyblyg pan fo'n bosib o fewn prif gyngor, ac rydym yn parhau i weithio gyda phartneriaid i ystyried goblygiadau ehangu yn y maes hwn a pha gamau a chanllawiau y gallai fod eu hangen.

Bydd cyd-bwyllgorau corfforaethol yn darparu dull cyson i awdurdodau lleol yng Nghymru, wedi'i sefydlu mewn statud ar gyfer cydweithredu rhanbarthol. Rwy'n croesawu sylwadau'r pwyllgor ar ein cynigion. Fel y pwysleisiwyd yn adroddiad y Pwyllgor Cyllid, rwy'n fodlon ymrwymo i ddarparu asesiadau effaith rheoleiddiol llawn a chadarn ar gyfer pob darn o is-ddeddfwriaeth a wneir o ganlyniad i'r Bil hwn. Dyma'r lle gorau i asesu eu costau a'u manteision penodol.

Rwy'n croesawu'r graddau o gonsensws ymysg y rhai sy'n rhoi tystiolaeth ar yr angen am y darpariaethau yn y Bil, a'u priodoldeb, a fydd yn cyflwyno system newydd ar gyfer gwella perfformiad a llywodraethu yn seiliedig ar hunanasesu ac adolygu gan gymheiriaid. Yn unol ag argymhelliad y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau, bwriadaf gyflwyno gwelliant a fyddai'n cynnwys darpariaeth yn y Bil sy'n egluro amseriad adroddiad hunanasesu.

Rwyf hefyd yn falch o gyhoeddi heddiw fy mod wedi cyhoeddi canllawiau: prosbectws ar gyfer uno'r prif gynghorau yng Nghymru yn wirfoddol. Paratowyd y canllawiau gan y gweithgor ar lywodraeth leol. Mae'n rhoi cyngor ymarferol ar y materion craidd y bydd angen mynd i'r afael â nhw yn rhan o'r bwriad i ddatblygu unrhyw gynnig i uno'n wirfoddol.

Rydym wedi bod yn gweithio'n agos gyda Chymdeithas Llywodraeth Leol Cymru, awdurdodau lleol a gwasanaethau cynghori i wella pob agwedd ar gasglu'r dreth gyngor a rheoli ôl-ddyledion. Bydd y gwaith hwn, sy'n canolbwyntio ar atal, yn parhau.

Mae'r Pwyllgor Deddfwriaeth, Cyfiawnder a'r Cyfansoddiad wedi gwneud nifer o argymhellion ynghylch y gweithdrefnau arfaethedig ar gyfer arfer pwerau is-ddeddfwriaethol a phwerau dirprwyedig eraill yn y Bil. Ni fu'n bosibl imi dderbyn holl argymhellion y Pwyllgor yn llawn, a rhoddais fy rheswm yn fy ymateb ysgrifenedig i adroddiad y pwyllgor.

Rwy'n cydnabod ac yn derbyn mewn egwyddor argymhelliad 32 y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau. Rwyf wedi ymrwymo i ddefnyddio'r canllawiau ar berfformiad a llywodraethu yn y Bil i dynnu sylw at bwysigrwydd ystyriaethau tai wrth gyflawni swyddogaethau awdurdodau lleol fel enghraifft o ble dylai cynghorau fod yn ymdrechu i wneud yn well ac nid dim ond bodloni gofynion sylfaenol. Bydd hyn yn sicrhau bod y ddarpariaeth o ran tai yn cael ei hystyried ar y cyd â'r ystod o bwerau a dyletswyddau sydd gan gynghorau fel rhan o asesiad corfforaethol ehangach o berfformiad cyffredinol y cyngor, yn hytrach nag ar ei phen ei hun.

I gloi, mae'r Bil hwn yn darparu'r pwerau a'r offer y mae llywodraeth leol wedi bod yn gofyn amdanynt. Bydd yn eu galluogi i ddarparu gwasanaethau cyhoeddus modern, hygyrch, o safon uchel ar gyfer a chyda'r cymunedau y maen nhw'n eu gwasanaethu. Rwy'n annog yr Aelodau i gytuno ar egwyddorion cyffredinol a phenderfyniad ariannol y Bil heddiw. Diolch, Llywydd.

16:20

Diolch. Before I call the next speaker, can I say that I am aware that Neil McEvoy was live broadcasting on Facebook during the proceedings? I have my phone to hand, and I was able to watch it, although not hear it. That is in direct contravention to my instruction at the start, and in contravention to our Standing Orders. I have asked for you to be removed from this meeting of the Assembly, and you will not be called during this debate.

Mark Isherwood—I'm sorry, I need to call the Chair of the Equality, Local Government and Communities Committee first, John Griffiths. 

Diolch. Cyn i mi alw'r siaradwr nesaf, a gaf i ddweud fy mod yn ymwybodol bod Neil McEvoy yn darlledu'n fyw ar Facebook yn ystod y trafodion? Mae gen i fy ffôn wrth law, ac roeddwn i'n gallu ei wylio, er nad oeddwn i'n ei glywed. Mae hynny'n gwbl groes i'm cyfarwyddyd i ar y dechrau, ac yn groes i'n Rheolau Sefydlog. Rwyf wedi gofyn i chi gael eich symud o'r cyfarfod hwn o'r Cynulliad, ac ni chewch eich galw yn ystod y ddadl hon.

Mark Isherwood—mae'n ddrwg gennyf, mae angen imi alw ar Gadeirydd y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau yn gyntaf, John Griffiths.

Diolch, Llywydd. I'm very pleased to be able to contribute to today's debate as Chair of the Equality, Local Government and Communities Committee, and I'd like to thank all those who gave evidence to us to help inform our work. I note that the tight timescale for undertaking our scrutiny caused difficulties for some stakeholders, so we're even more grateful for their input.

Much reference has been made to the fact that this Bill has been in preparation for many years. It is substantial in content and encompasses a wide range of provisions relating to local government functions. Clearly, since the Bill was introduced, circumstances have changed very considerably, but it remains a significant piece of legislation, and its scrutiny should not be lost.

Having considered the evidence presented by stakeholders, we recommended the general principles of the Bill be agreed by the Assembly. However, we believe that the Bill can be strengthened in some areas, and our report contains 32 recommendations in total, outlining the improvements we would like to see during the amending Stages.

It is disappointing that only seven of our recommendations were accepted in full by the Minister, although I realise that several others were accepted in principle. Our recommendations were based on evidence from expert stakeholders, so I would encourage the Minister to reconsider her response to some of these.

On the provisions relating to extending the franchise to include 16 and 17-year-olds, we believe that effective awareness raising will be required to ensure that new groups of voters are aware of their rights and make use of their vote. We therefore recommend that the Bill should include specific provision to roll out an adequate level of education on politics and democracy across all our schools in Wales. We think this should be accompanied by clear lesson plans to empower teachers to deliver these lessons. Welsh Government has cited the extension of the franchise to include 16 and 17-year-olds as one of the main reasons for proceeding with this Bill at this time. It is, therefore, imperative that young people develop their understanding and awareness of their right to vote, otherwise these provisions will be rendered less effective than we would all like. 

Despite the reservations expressed at the approach in the Bill of allowing individual councils to choose their own voting systems, we recognise the potential benefits of proportional electoral systems, such as STV, particularly as a means of increasing diversity among candidates. We'd like to see Welsh Government work with councils to explore reforms to voting arrangements, including the positive impact STV could have on increasing diversity. There are a number of other provisions in the Bill aimed at increasing diversity, notably enabling job sharing and new responsibilities around councillor conduct. Whilst we welcome these, we believe the Bill could go further, as reflected in our recommendations. 

In conclusion, although we have recommended that the general principles be approved by the Assembly, we believe there is scope to strengthen the Bill in the ways I have outlined today and outlined in greater detail in our report. Diolch, Llywydd. 

Diolch, Llywydd. Rwy'n falch iawn o gael cyfrannu at y ddadl heddiw fel Cadeirydd y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau, a hoffwn ddiolch i bawb a roddodd dystiolaeth i ni i helpu i lywio ein gwaith. Sylwaf fod yr amserlen dynn ar gyfer cyflawni ein gwaith craffu wedi achosi anawsterau i rai rhanddeiliaid, felly rydym yn fwy diolchgar byth am eu cyfraniad.

Cyfeiriwyd llawer at y ffaith y buwyd wrthi'n paratoi'r Bil hwn ers blynyddoedd lawer. Mae'n sylweddol o ran ei gynnwys ac yn cwmpasu ystod eang o ddarpariaethau sy'n ymwneud â swyddogaethau llywodraeth leol. Yn amlwg, ers cyflwyno'r Bil, mae'r amgylchiadau wedi newid yn sylweddol iawn, ond mae'n dal yn ddarn arwyddocaol o ddeddfwriaeth, ac ni ddylid peidio â chraffu arno.

Ar ôl ystyried y dystiolaeth a gyflwynwyd gan randdeiliaid, gwnaethom argymell y dylai'r Cynulliad gytuno ar egwyddorion cyffredinol y Bil. Fodd bynnag, credwn y gellir cryfhau'r Bil mewn rhai meysydd, ac mae ein hadroddiad yn cynnwys cyfanswm o 32 o argymhellion, sy'n amlinellu'r gwelliannau yr hoffem eu gweld yn ystod y cyfnodau diwygio.

Mae'n siomedig mai dim ond saith o'n hargymhellion a dderbyniwyd yn llawn gan y Gweinidog, er fy mod yn sylweddoli bod nifer o rai eraill wedi'u derbyn mewn egwyddor. Roedd ein hargymhellion yn seiliedig ar dystiolaeth gan randdeiliaid arbenigol, felly byddwn yn annog y Gweinidog i ailystyried ei hymateb i rai o'r rhain.

O ran y darpariaethau sy'n ymwneud ag ymestyn yr etholfraint i gynnwys pobl ifanc 16 ac 17 oed, credwn y bydd angen codi ymwybyddiaeth yn effeithiol er mwyn sicrhau bod grwpiau newydd o bleidleiswyr yn ymwybodol o'u hawliau ac yn gwneud defnydd o'u pleidlais. Felly, rydym yn argymell y dylai'r Bil gynnwys darpariaeth benodol i gyflwyno lefel ddigonol o addysg ar wleidyddiaeth a democratiaeth yn ein holl ysgolion yng Nghymru. Rydym yn credu y dylai hyn gael ei ategu gan gynlluniau gwersi clir i rymuso athrawon i ddarparu'r gwersi hyn. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru wedi cyfeirio at ymestyn yr etholfraint i gynnwys pobl ifanc 16 ac 17 oed fel un o'r prif resymau dros fwrw ymlaen â'r Bil hwn ar hyn o bryd. Felly, mae'n hanfodol bod pobl ifanc yn datblygu eu dealltwriaeth a'u hymwybyddiaeth o'u hawl i bleidleisio, neu fel arall bydd y darpariaethau hyn yn llai effeithiol nag y byddem ni i gyd yn ei hoffi.

Er gwaethaf yr amheuon a fynegwyd ynglŷn â'r dull yn y Bil o ganiatáu i gynghorau unigol ddewis eu systemau pleidleisio eu hunain, rydym yn cydnabod manteision posibl systemau etholiadol cyfrannol, megis Pleidlais Sengl Drosglwyddadwy, yn enwedig fel ffordd o gynyddu amrywiaeth ymhlith ymgeiswyr. Hoffem weld Llywodraeth Cymru yn gweithio gyda chynghorau i archwilio diwygiadau i drefniadau pleidleisio, gan gynnwys yr effaith gadarnhaol y gallai Pleidlais Sengl Drosglwyddadwy ei chael ar gynyddu amrywiaeth. Mae nifer o ddarpariaethau eraill yn y Bil sydd â'r nod o gynyddu amrywiaeth, yn arbennig galluogi rhannu swyddi a chyfrifoldebau newydd yn ymwneud ag ymddygiad cynghorwyr. Er ein bod yn croesawu'r rhain, credwn y gallai'r Bil fynd ymhellach, fel yr adlewyrchir yn ein hargymhellion.

I gloi, er ein bod wedi argymell i'r Cynulliad gymeradwyo'r egwyddorion cyffredinol, rydym yn credu bod lle i gryfhau'r Bil yn y ffyrdd a amlinellais heddiw ac a amlinellir yn fanylach yn ein hadroddiad. Diolch, Llywydd.  

16:25

Galwaf ar Gadeirydd y Pwyllgor Cyllid, Llyr Gruffydd. 

I call on the Chair of the Finance Committee, Llyr Gruffydd. 

Diolch yn fawr iawn, Llywydd. Rydw i'n falch iawn o allu cyfrannu at y ddadl yma. Mae'r Pwyllgor Cyllid wedi gwneud 19 argymhelliad, ac rydw i'n diolch i'r Gweinidog am ei llythyr, dyddiedig 23 Mawrth, yn nodi ymateb i'r argymhellion hynny, ac, o ystyried faint o amser, wrth gwrs, sydd ar gael ar gyfer y ddadl yma heddiw, mi fyddaf i'n canolbwyntio ar ein prif bryderon ni'n unig. Rydym ni fel pwyllgor yn cydnabod bod hwn yn ddarn sylweddol o ddeddfwriaeth, ond mae yna ddau faes y mae gan y pwyllgor bryderon penodol yn eu cylch nhw.

Yn gyntaf, pan gyflwynodd y Gweinidog y Bil, mi gyhoeddodd ei bwriad i gyflwyno gwelliannau i estyn yr etholfraint i garcharorion a phobl ifanc yn y ddalfa. Roeddem ni'n feirniadol o ddull tebyg a gafodd ei ddefnyddio wrth i ni graffu ar y Bil Senedd ac Etholiadau (Cymru), pan gyhoeddwyd yn ystod Cyfnod 1 y byddai gwelliannau sylweddol yn cael eu cyflwyno mewn perthynas â threfniadau ariannol y Comisiwn Etholiadol bryd hynny. Mae'r pwyllgor yn ailadrodd, felly, ei farn bod mewnosod darpariaethau newydd drwy welliannau yng Nghyfnod 2 yn amharu ar allu'r pwyllgor i ystyried costau cyffredinol y ddeddfwriaeth arfaethedig, yn enwedig gan fod y cyfle i gynnal gwaith craffu ariannol ar y newidiadau hyn yn gyfyngedig. Heddiw, mi ofynnir i'r Cynulliad, wrth gwrs, i gymeradwyo penderfyniad ariannol, ond, eto, os bydd newidiadau sylweddol yn cael eu gwneud yn ystod Cyfnod 2, bydd y Cynulliad wedyn wedi pleidleisio dros ymrwymo adnoddau heb gael gwybod beth yw costau llawn y Bil. Mae'r pwyllgor o'r farn ei bod hi'n hanfodol bod gan y Cynulliad y wybodaeth ariannol berthnasol i sicrhau ei fod yn gallu gwneud penderfyniad ar sail gwybodaeth pan ofynnir iddo ymrwymo adnoddau.

Yn ail, mae'r Bil yn cynnwys nifer sylweddol o bwerau galluogi i Weinidogion Cymru a dyw'r pwerau hyn, wrth gwrs, ddim wedi cael eu costio. Mae hwn hefyd yn fater rydym ni wedi'i godi ar sawl achlysur, sef y dylai'r Aelod sy'n gyfrifol gynnwys yr amcangyfrif gorau o'r costau sy'n gysylltiedig ag is-ddeddfwriaeth ochr yn ochr â'r ddeddfwriaeth sylfaenol berthnasol. Serch hynny, rydw i'n falch bod y Gweinidog wedi cytuno mewn egwyddor i argymhellion 1, 5, 15 ac 17, sy'n ymwneud â Llywodraeth Cymru yn darparu asesiadau effaith rheoleiddiol llawn a chadarn ar gyfer unrhyw is-ddeddfwriaeth berthnasol sy'n cael ei gwneud o ganlyniad i'r Bil hwn.

Mae'r pwyllgor yn pryderu bod rhai costau yn yr asesiad rheoleiddiol yn ymwneud â phleidleisio, etholiadau a chodi ymwybyddiaeth yn gostau ar gyfartaledd ar draws prif gynghorau ac nad ydyn nhw'n ystyried y gwahaniaethau rhwng ardaloedd awdurdodau lleol. Rŷn ni o'r farn bod rhai costau yn debygol o daro rhai ardaloedd yn drymach na'i gilydd. Yn argymhelliad 2, rŷn ni'n gofyn i Lywodraeth Cymru wneud rhagor o waith i nodi dosbarthiad yr etholwyr ledled Cymru, ac egluro'r dull mae'n bwriadu'i ddefnyddio ar gyfer unrhyw gyllid a ddyrennir i gefnogi'r darpariaethau yn y Bil sy'n ymwneud ag etholiadau a phleidleisio. Rŷn ni'n falch bod y Gweinidog wedi derbyn yr argymhelliad hwn a'i bod hi'n gweithio gydag awdurdodau lleol a rhanddeiliaid eraill i ystyried y ffordd orau y gall Llywodraeth Cymru reoli'r effeithiau gwahaniaethol posib ar awdurdodau lleol unigol. Edrychwn ymlaen at gael y wybodaeth ddiweddaraf maes o law.

Mewn perthynas ag etholiadau a phleidleisio, mae'r pwyllgor o'r farn bod nifer o feysydd lle gellid bod wedi darparu rhagor o wybodaeth. Mae'n siom bod argymhelliad 6, sy'n gofyn am ragor o wybodaeth am y mathau o gynlluniau y bydd Llywodraeth Cymru efallai am eu treialu, a'r adnoddau posib sy'n ofynnol ar gyfer gweithgaredd o'r fath, wedi cael ei wrthod. Rŷn ni'n nodi nad yw'r Gweinidog yn bwriadu treialu'r un peilot etholiadol cyn yr etholiadau lleol yn 2022 nac ar gyfer yr etholiadau hynny, ond mae'r Gweinidog, er hynny, wedi nodi ei bod yn debygol y bydd goblygiadau o ran cost oherwydd newidiadau i feddalwedd rheoli etholiadol, staffio, hyfforddiant, ac ati. Mae'r pwyllgor o'r farn y dylai'r asesiad effaith rheoleiddiol fod wedi cynnwys amcangyfrif o'r adnoddau y mae'n bosib y bydd eu hangen ar gyfer gweithgaredd o'r fath.

Mae'r Bil yn ei gwneud hi'n ofynnol i awdurdodau lleol wneud trefniadau i ddarlledu cyfarfodydd, a hynny er budd tryloywder yn y broses o wneud penderfyniadau. Mae'r asesiad effaith rheoleiddiol yn amcangyfrif y byddai'r contract darlledu ar gyfer Cymru yn costio oddeutu £12,000 y flwyddyn i brif gyngor ar gyfartaledd. Fe glywsom ni dystiolaeth bod y ffigwr hwn wedi cael ei amcangyfrif yn rhy isel o lawer, ac rŷn ni'n falch felly bod y Gweinidog wedi derbyn argymhelliad 10, i ystyried a yw contract darlledu Cymru gyfan yn ymarferol, ac ai hwn fyddai'r ateb mwyaf cost-effeithiol, ac yn falch y bydd ei swyddogion yn ystyried ymhellach y manteision a'r anfanteision o wneud hyn.

Mae'r pwyllgor yn nodi cefnogaeth gyffredinol Cymdeithas Llywodraeth Leol Cymru i'r cynnig ar gyfer cydbwyllgorau corfforedig fel cyfrwng ar gyfer cydweithredu. Fodd bynnag, rŷn ni o'r farn y gallai sefydlu pwyllgorau o'r fath arwain at gostau cychwynnol posib, yn ogystal, wrth gwrs, ag arbedion posib gydag amser. Mae'r pwyllgor yn falch bod y Gweinidog wedi derbyn argymhelliad 16, sef bod Llywodraeth Cymru yn rhannu dadansoddiad o gostau a buddion sefydlu cydbwyllgorau corfforedig pan fydd yr adolygiad yn dod i ben ac y bydd yn ystyried rhoi cyfrif am y wybodaeth hon yn yr asesiad effaith rheoleiddiol.

Rwy'n cydnabod y ffaith y bydd y Bil hwn yn symud ymlaen, wrth gwrs, mewn cyfnod unigryw a'r posibilrwydd y bydd yna newidiadau yn cael eu gwneud yn y cyfnodau diwygio, ac efallai y bydd rheini yn llai sylweddol na'r disgwyl. Fodd bynnag, dwi am ailadrodd fy sylwadau o ddechrau fy nghyfraniad, sef, wrth gwrs, y dylid sicrhau bod Biliau yn cael eu datblygu mor drylwyr a phosib cyn eu cyflwyno ac na ddylid defnyddio cyfnodau diwygio i gyflwyno cynigion newydd a helaeth nad ydyn nhw wedi bod yn destun craffu yng Nghyfnod 1. Diolch, Llywydd.

Thank you very much, Llywydd. I'm very pleased to contribute to this debate. The Finance Committee has made 19 recommendations, and I thank the Minister for her letter of 23 March, which sets out her response to those recommendations. Given the time available today for this debate, I will focus on our main concerns only. As a committee, we do acknowledge that this is a significant piece of legislation, but there are two areas where the committee has particular concerns.

First, when the Minister announced the Bill and introduced it, she said that she intended to bring forward amendments to extend the franchise to prisoners and to young people in custody. We were critical of a similar approach taken during scrutiny of the Senedd and Elections (Wales) Bill, when it was announced during Stage 1 that significant amendments would be brought forward in relation to the financial arrangements for the Electoral Commission at that point. So, the committee reiterates its view that inserting new provisions via amendment at Stage 2 reduces the committee's ability to consider the general costs of the proposed legislation, particularly as the opportunity for financial scrutiny of these changes is limited. Today, the Assembly will be asked to approve a financial resolution, but if there are substantial changes made during Stage 2, the Assembly will have voted to commit resources without being fully informed of the costs of the Bill. The committee believes that it's essential that the Assembly has the relevant financial information in order to ensure that it's able to make an informed decision when it's being asked to commit resources. 

Secondly, the Bill contains a significant number of enabling powers for Welsh Ministers, and these powers, of course, have not been costed. This is another issue that we have raised on a number of occasions, namely that the Member in charge should include the best estimate of the costs associated with subordinate legislation alongside the relevant primary legislation. Nevertheless, I am pleased that the Minister has agreed in principle to recommendations 1, 5, 15 and 17, which relate to the Welsh Government providing full and robust regulatory impact assessments for any relevant subordinate legislation made as a result of this Bill.

The committee is concerned that some costs in the RIA relating to voting, elections and awareness raising have been averaged across principal councils. They don’t take account of variances in local authority areas. We feel that some costs are likely to fall more heavily in certain areas. Our recommendation 2 asks the Welsh Government to undertake further work to identify the distribution of the electorate across Wales and to clarify the approach it intends to take to any funding allocated to support the provisions of the Bill relating to elections and voting. We are pleased the Minister has accepted this recommendation and is currently working with local authorities and stakeholders to consider how best the Welsh Government can manage the potential differential impacts on individual local authorities. We look forward to receiving an update in due course.

In relation to elections and voting, the committee is of the view that there are a number of areas where more information could have been provided. It is disappointing that recommendation 6, which asks for further information on the types of pilot schemes that the Welsh Government may wish to trial and the potential resources required for such activity, has been rejected. Whilst noting that the Minister does not intend to trial any electoral pilots at the 2022 local elections, the Minister has stated that there are likely to be cost implications because of changes to electoral management software, staffing, training, and so on. The committee believes that an estimate of potential resource required for such activity should have been included in the RIA.

The Bill requires local authorities to make arrangements to broadcast their meetings in the interests of transparency in the decision-making process. The RIA estimates that the broadcasting contract for Wales would cost a principal authority, on average, approximately £12,000 per annum. We heard evidence that this figure is significantly underestimated, and we are therefore pleased that the Minister has accepted recommendation 10, to consider whether an all-Wales broadcasting contract is feasible and whether this would be the most cost-effective solution. We are also pleased that her officials will be considering further the benefits and disbenefits of doing this.

The committee notes the general support of the WLGA for the proposal for corporate joint committees as a vehicle for collaboration. However, we consider that there could be potential start-up costs to establishing such committees as well as potential savings over time. The committee is pleased that the Minister has accepted recommendation 16, namely that the Welsh Government shares its analysis of the costs and benefits of establishing corporate joint committees when the review has concluded, and will consider accounting for this information in the RIA.

I recognise that this Bill will progress in unprecedented times and that we may see changes at the amending stages that may be less substantial than expected. However, I would reiterate my comments at the beginning of my contribution, namely that Bills should be as fully developed as possible on introduction and that amending stages should not be used to introduce new, extensive policy proposals that haven’t been subject to scrutiny at Stage 1. Thank you, Llywydd.

16:30

I call now on the Chair of the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee, Mick Antoniw.

Galwaf yn awr ar Gadeirydd y Pwyllgor Materion Cyfansoddiadol a Deddfwriaethol, Mick Antoniw.

Diolch, Llywydd. We reported on this Bill on 13 March and we made 12 recommendations, and, as the Minister has stated, she responded on 23 March. I welcome the acceptance by the Minister of recommendation 5 and the positive comments made in respect of our recommendations 4, 6, and 9.

I would like to make some general observations on the Bill, which has taken six years to prepare. It is a relatively complex Bill, and it includes 98 powers to make to make subordinate legislation. Now, many of the powers taken are justifiable, but we were concerned to hear the Minister say that many of them allow the Welsh Ministers to respond to future circumstances that could not yet be foreseen. So, we do not consider it appropriate for the Welsh Government to take powers to deliver policy that has not yet been fully developed or foreseen. We consider this to be a poor legislative practice. This approach provides too much power to the Government at the expense of the legislature.

Now, overall, the nature of many of the regulation-making powers taken in the Bill give the impression of it having been incomplete on introduction. This view is exacerbated by the clear intention of the Government to bring forward significant policy at Stage 2 of the legislative process in relation to prisoner voting, bypassing Stage 1. We note that the Minister has since provided draft amendments about prisoner voting in advance of the Stage 2 proceedings. However, this should not be seen as a substitute for Stage 1 scrutiny. The approach adopted circumvents the scrutiny and consultation with stakeholders that would have taken place at Stage 1. That the committee has to make such comments continually is disappointing, and we do so in order to ensure that legislation is properly and fairly scrutinised and good law is made.

I would now like to highlight three of the recommendations that the Minister has not accepted. The first, recommendation 2, relates to the need to introduce legislation that is fully formed on introduction. Section 18 concerns regulations to provide for a database of electoral registration. The Minister acknowledged the regulation-making powers were taken because of the lack of time to include information on the face of the Bill. We therefore recommended a superaffirmative procedure for these regulation-making powers in the first instance, followed by the affirmative procedure. The Minister rejected this recommendation, because it was not in line with the Welsh Government's legislation handbook on when to use a superaffirmative procedure. This, in our view, is not a strong or a persuasive argument, and I would ask the Minister to reconsider our recommendation. It would allow for more robust scrutiny of proposals that, by her own acknowledgement, would have been included on the face of the Bill if the Government's own timetable had permitted more time. Now, I recognise and welcome the Welsh Ministers' reference to guidance on good practice when putting forward their law proposals. However, our recommendation was based on our own analyses, which included the circumstances that gave rise to the provisions contained in section 18.

Recommendation 3 relates to section 26 of the Bill. Section 26 seeks to change existing provisions in the Representation of the People Act 2000. One of the key themes of the Bill is empowering local authorities and advocating decisions being taken at the lowest possible level. So, it is, therefore, surprising to see a provision in the Bill that permits the Welsh Ministers to direct a local authority to undertake a pilot electoral scheme against its wishes. It is even more surprising that a decision to issue an Order, as currently drafted in the Bill, would be subject to no scrutiny by the National Assembly.

The power in section 26 can be used to change electoral systems of a local authority, so this is not a minor or technical power. It could have a substantive effect on the political make-up of a local authority following an election, even if only for one set of elections. Any decision by the Welsh Ministers of any particular political party to use the power could, therefore, run the risk of being politically motivated and, therefore, contentious. Even if not politically motivated, this, certainly, could be the perception.

As we often highlight, it is important to distinguish how powers could be used by Welsh Ministers, rather than the intention of the Welsh Ministers currently in post when taking them. In the circumstances, we believe that the affirmative procedure should be applied to the making of an Order in question. The Minister's rejection of our recommendation on grounds that it is disproportionate is disappointing, given that the power is to be exercised without being initiated by a local authority, as is currently the case, and without scrutiny by the Assembly. In our view, this power does not sit comfortably in a Bill that seeks to empower local authorities.

Finally, I would reiterate our view that the regulation-making powers contained in section 109(2) of the Bill are too broad, and that, as we stated in recommendation 11, the word 'expedient' should, therefore, be removed from this provision. Diolch, Llywydd. 

Diolch, Llywydd. Fe wnaethom ni adrodd ar y mesur hwn ar 13 Mawrth a gwneud 12 argymhelliad, ac, fel y dywedodd y Gweinidog, fe ymatebodd hi ar 23 Mawrth. Croesawaf y ffaith fod y Gweinidog wedi derbyn argymhelliad 5 a'r sylwadau cadarnhaol a wnaed o ran argymhellion 4, 6, a 9 o'n heiddo.

Hoffwn wneud rhai sylwadau cyffredinol ar y Bil, sydd wedi cymryd chwe blynedd i'w baratoi. Mae'n Fil cymharol gymhleth, ac mae'n cynnwys 98 o bwerau i wneud is-ddeddfwriaeth. Nawr, mae modd cyfiawnhau llawer o'r pwerau a gymerir, ond roeddem yn bryderus o glywed y Gweinidog yn dweud bod llawer ohonyn nhw yn caniatáu i Weinidogion Cymru ymateb i amgylchiadau yn y dyfodol na ellid eu rhagweld eto. Felly, nid ydym ni o'r farn ei bod hi'n briodol i Lywodraeth Cymru gymryd pwerau i ymdrin â pholisïau nad ydyn nhw wedi eu datblygu nac eu rhagweld yn llawn eto. Credwn fod hwn yn arfer deddfwriaethol gwael. Mae'r dull hwn yn rhoi gormod o rym i'r Llywodraeth ar draul y ddeddfwrfa.

Nawr, yn gyffredinol, mae natur llawer o'r pwerau gwneud rheoliadau a gymerir yn y Bil yn rhoi'r argraff ei fod yn anghyflawn wrth ei gyflwyno. Mae'r farn negyddol hon yn cael ei chryfhau gan fwriad clir y Llywodraeth i gyflwyno polisi arwyddocaol yng Nghyfnod 2 y broses ddeddfwriaethol o ran rhoi'r bleidlais i garcharorion, gan osgoi Cyfnod 1. Rydym yn cydnabod bod y Gweinidog ers hynny wedi darparu gwelliannau drafft ynglŷn â rhoi'r bleidlais i garcharorion cyn trafodion Cyfnod 2. Fodd bynnag, ni ddylid ystyried bod hyn yn disodli proses graffu Cyfnod 1. Mae'r dull gweithredu a fabwysiadwyd yn osgoi'r gwaith craffu ac ymgynghori gyda rhanddeiliaid a fyddai wedi digwydd yng Nghyfnod 1. Mae'r ffaith bod yn rhaid i'r pwyllgor wneud sylwadau o'r fath yn barhaus yn siomedig, ac rydym yn gwneud hynny er mwyn sicrhau y creffir yn briodol ac yn deg ar ddeddfwriaeth ac y llunnir cyfreithiau da.

Fe hoffwn i dynnu sylw nawr at dri o'r argymhellion nad yw'r Gweinidog wedi eu derbyn. Mae a wnelo'r cyntaf, argymhelliad 2, â'r angen i gyflwyno deddfwriaeth sydd wedi ei ffurfio'n llawn pan gaiff ei chyflwyno. Mae adran 18 yn ymwneud â rheoliadau i ddarparu ar gyfer cronfa ddata ar gyfer y gofrestr etholiadol. Cydnabu'r Gweinidog fod y pwerau i wneud rheoliadau wedi eu cymryd oherwydd y diffyg amser i gynnwys gwybodaeth ar wyneb y Bil. Felly, fe wnaethom argymell gweithdrefn uwchgadarnhaol ar gyfer y pwerau hyn i wneud rheoliadau yn y lle cyntaf, ac yna'r weithdrefn gadarnhaol. Gwrthododd y Gweinidog yr argymhelliad hwn, gan nad oedd yn cyd-fynd â llawlyfr deddfwriaeth Llywodraeth Cymru ynglŷn â phryd i ddefnyddio'r weithdrefn uwchgadarnhaol. Nid yw hon, yn ein barn ni, yn ddadl gref nac yn darbwyllo, a byddwn yn gofyn i'r Gweinidog ailystyried ein hargymhelliad. Byddai'n caniatáu craffu mwy cadarn ar gynigion a fyddai, yn ôl ei chydnabyddiaeth ei hun, wedi cael eu cynnwys ar wyneb y Bil pe byddai amserlen y Llywodraeth ei hun wedi caniatáu mwy o amser. Nawr, rwy'n cydnabod ac yn croesawu cyfeiriad Gweinidogion Cymru at ganllawiau arfer da wrth gyflwyno eu cynigion cyfreithiol. Fodd bynnag, roedd ein hargymhelliad yn seiliedig ar ein dadansoddiadau ein hunain, a oedd yn cynnwys yr amgylchiadau a arweiniodd at y darpariaethau a gynhwysir yn adran 18.

Mae argymhelliad 3 yn ymwneud ag adran 26 y Bil. Mae adran 26 yn ceisio newid y darpariaethau presennol yn Neddf Cynrychiolaeth y Bobl 2000. Un o themâu allweddol y Bil yw grymuso awdurdodau lleol ac annog gwneud penderfyniadau ar y lefel lywodraethol isaf posibl. Felly, mae'n syndod, felly, gweld darpariaeth yn y Bil sy'n caniatáu i Weinidogion Cymru gyfarwyddo awdurdod lleol i gynnal cynllun etholiadol arbrofol yn groes i'w ddymuniadau. Mae'n fwy o syndod fyth na fyddai penderfyniad i gyhoeddi Gorchymyn, fel y mae wedi ei ddrafftio yn y Bil ar hyn o bryd, yn destun unrhyw graffu gan y Cynulliad Cenedlaethol.

Gellir defnyddio'r pŵer yn adran 26 i newid systemau etholiadol awdurdod lleol, felly nid yw hwn yn bŵer mân neu dechnegol. Gallai gael effaith sylweddol ar ffurfiant gwleidyddol awdurdod lleol ar ôl etholiad, hyd yn oed pe na byddai ond ar gyfer un gyfres o etholiadau. Gallai unrhyw benderfyniad gan Weinidogion Cymru o unrhyw blaid wleidyddol benodol i ddefnyddio'r pŵer, felly, fod mewn perygl o fod yn gymhelliant gwleidyddol ac, felly, i fod yn ddadleuol. Hyd yn oed pe na byddai cymhelliant gwleidyddol, gallai hyn, yn sicr, fod yn dybiaeth.

Fel yr amlygwn yn aml, mae'n bwysig gwahaniaethu rhwng sut y gallai Gweinidogion Cymru ddefnyddio pwerau, yn hytrach na bwriad Gweinidogion Cymru sydd yn y swydd ar hyn o bryd wrth eu cymryd. O dan yr amgylchiadau, credwn y dylid cymhwyso'r weithdrefn gadarnhaol ar gyfer gwneud Gorchymyn o dan sylw. Mae'r ffaith bod y Gweinidog wedi gwrthod ein hargymhelliad ar y sail ei fod yn anghymesur yn siomedig, o ystyried bod y pŵer i'w arfer heb i awdurdod lleol gymell hynny, fel sy'n digwydd ar hyn o bryd, a heb i'r Cynulliad graffu arno. Yn ein barn ni, nid yw'r pŵer hwn yn gweddu i Fil sy'n ceisio grymuso awdurdodau lleol.

Yn olaf, hoffwn ailadrodd ein barn bod y pwerau i wneud rheoliadau sydd yn adran 109 (2) y Bil yn rhy eang, ac, fel y nodwyd yn Argymhelliad 11, dylid dileu'r gair 'hwylus', felly, o'r ddarpariaeth hon. Diolch, Llywydd.  

16:35

[Inaudible.]—a cut-and-paste job including, possibly, 28 provisions contained within Mark Drakeford's 2017 local government White Paper, which was originally dropped. In his written statement on the Welsh Government's approach to legislation in light of COVID-19 last week, the First Minister asked this Welsh Parliament to work with the Welsh Government to explore novel approaches to scrutiny in order to allow it to progress its legislative programme under current circumstances. This statement omitted any reference to votes for convicted prisoners. It is also noted that the Welsh Government response to the Equality, Local Government and Communities Committee’s report on this Bill only accepts a quarter of our 32 recommendations, recommendations made after detailed evidence gathering from a range of expert witnesses and hours of deliberation by committee members.

The Bill provides that each principal council may decide for itself on the voting system to use, whether first-past-the-post or proportional representation using the single transferrable vote. However, 33 out of 35 respondents to its White Paper consultation disagreed and preferred to keep one voting system for the whole of Wales. Further, as our committee report states,

[Anhyglyw.]—ymarferiad torri-a-gludo yn cynnwys, o bosib, 28 o ddarpariaethau a gynhwyswyd ym Mhapur Gwyn llywodraeth leol Mark Drakeford o 2017, y'i rhoddwyd o'r neilltu yn wreiddiol. Yn ei ddatganiad ysgrifenedig ynglŷn â dull Llywodraeth Cymru o ymdrin â deddfwriaeth yng ngoleuni COVID-19 yr wythnos diwethaf, gofynnodd y Prif Weinidog i'r Senedd Cymru hon weithio gyda Llywodraeth Cymru i archwilio dulliau newydd o graffu er mwyn caniatáu iddi ddatblygu ei rhaglen ddeddfwriaethol o dan yr amgylchiadau presennol. Nid oedd unrhyw gyfeiriad yn y datganiad hwn at roi'r bleidlais i garcharorion a euogfarnwyd. Sylwn hefyd bod ymateb Llywodraeth Cymru i adroddiad y Pwyllgor Cydraddoldeb, Llywodraeth Leol a Chymunedau ar y Bil hwn ddim ond yn derbyn chwarter ein 32 argymhelliad, argymhellion a wnaed ar ôl casglu tystiolaeth fanwl gan amrywiaeth o dystion arbenigol ac oriau o drafodaeth gan Aelodau'r Pwyllgor.

Mae'r Bil yn darparu bod pob prif gyngor yn cael penderfynu drosto'i hun ar y system bleidleisio i'w defnyddio, boed hynny y cyntaf i'r felin neu gynrychiolaeth gyfrannol drwy ddefnyddio'r bleidlais sengl drosglwyddadwy. Fodd bynnag, roedd 33 o'r 35 a ymatebodd i'r ymgynghoriad ar y Papur Gwyn yn anghytuno ac roedd yn well ganddyn nhw gadw un system bleidleisio ar gyfer Cymru gyfan. Ymhellach, fel y dywed ein hadroddiad pwyllgor, mae'r

'the majority of the evidence received oppose the provisions that allow principal councils to choose their own voting system.'

The regulatory impact assessment also notes that an additional cost would be incurred should a principal council opt to change its voting system, but that these costs are currently unknown. It is therefore deeply concerning that the Minister rejected the committee recommendation that the Welsh Government undertakes an engagement programme with the Welsh Local Government Association—WLGA—principal councils and communities across Wales around reforming voting arrangements of local government elections. Provisions in the Bill will enable the Welsh Ministers to establish and maintain an all-Wales database of electoral registration. The WLGA highlighted the benefit in reducing the potential for individuals to be registered at more than one address. However, our committee report notes that the regulatory impact assessment does not define any costs for developing an all-Wales database, and acknowledges concerns raised around the security of individuals' personal data. It is again, therefore, deeply concerning that the Minister rejected our recommendation that the provisions relating to registration without application are amended to ensure that individuals registered in this way are placed on the closed electoral register rather than the open register.

We support the Bill's provision to remove the power to enable imprisonment as a sanction for non-payment of council tax. As our committee report notes, however, 22 respondents to the Welsh Government consultation felt the removal should be supported by the introduction of alternate methods of recovery, including local authorities. It is therefore deeply concerning that the Minister rejected our recommendation that Welsh Government works with the WLGA to consider alternative measures for recouping debt accrued through non-payment of council tax. The Minister is right to focus on prevention, but a non-custodial penalty will always be needed for some.

Currently, Irish and Commonwealth citizens and relevant EU citizens can vote in local government and devolved elections, but this Bill will enable all foreign citizens legally resident in Wales to vote in local government elections. There is a long-standing reciprocal agreement between the UK and the Republic of Ireland as a consequence of the historic relationship between both countries, and the ability of Commonwealth citizens to vote in UK elections is a legacy of the Representation of the People Act 1918. However, this Bill proposes a step too far. At least most of the countries that allow foreign citizens to vote have a minimum residency requirement, but even that is missing here. As my colleague David Melding said when scrutinising similar provisions in the Senedd and Elections (Wales) Bill,

'their citizenship should determine where they principally vote, and if they make the choice not to pursue citizenship here, then it's their choice not to have political rights to the extent of voting in our elections.'

Even worse, although the Welsh Government did not include in this Bill a provision for prisoners to be given the right to vote, the Minister has confirmed that if Members pass this motion today, she will then table amendments to allow prisoners serving sentences of less than four years, such as for racially aggravated common assault, breaching a sex offender order, or courting prostitution of women, to vote in local government elections. In other words, at a time of national crisis, this Welsh Government wants for us to help them rush through Welsh Government legislation that will introduce changes that are massively unpopular with the people, and which we cannot support.

'rhan fwyaf o’r dystiolaeth a gafwyd yn gwrthwynebu’r darpariaethau sy’n caniatáu i brif gynghorau ddewis eu system bleidleisio eu hunain.'

Mae'r asesiad effaith rheoleiddiol hefyd yn nodi y byddai cost ychwanegol pe byddai prif gyngor yn dewis newid ei system bleidleisio, ond nad yw'r costau hyn yn hysbys ar hyn o bryd. Mae'n destun pryder mawr felly fod y Gweinidog wedi gwrthod argymhelliad y Pwyllgor y dylai Llywodraeth Cymru gynnal rhaglen ymgysylltu â Chymdeithas Llywodraeth Leol Cymru—CLlLC—prif gynghorau a chymunedau ledled Cymru ynghylch diwygio trefniadau pleidleisio ar gyfer etholiadau llywodraeth leol. Bydd darpariaethau yn y Bil yn galluogi Gweinidogion Cymru i sefydlu a chynnal cronfa ddata ar gyfer Cymru gyfan o'r bobl sydd ar y gofrestr etholiadol. Tynnodd Cymdeithas Llywodraeth Leol Cymru sylw at y fantais o leihau'r posibilrwydd i unigolion gofrestru mewn mwy nag un cyfeiriad. Fodd bynnag, mae adroddiad ein pwyllgor yn nodi nad yw'r asesiad effaith rheoleiddiol yn diffinio unrhyw gostau ar gyfer datblygu cronfa ddata Cymru gyfan, ac mae'n cydnabod pryderon a grybwyllwyd ynghylch diogelwch data personol unigolion. Unwaith eto, mae'n destun pryder mawr bod y Gweinidog wedi gwrthod ein hargymhelliad y dylid diwygio'r darpariaethau sy'n ymwneud â chofrestru heb wneud cais er mwyn sicrhau y caiff unigolion sydd wedi cofrestru yn y modd hwn eu rhoi ar y gofrestr etholiadol gaeedig yn hytrach na'r gofrestr agored.

Rydym yn cefnogi darpariaeth y Bil i ddileu'r pŵer i ganiatáu carcharu fel cosb am beidio â thalu'r dreth gyngor. Fodd bynnag, fel y mae ein hadroddiad pwyllgor yn ei nodi, roedd 22 o'r rhai a ymatebodd i ymgynghoriad Llywodraeth Cymru o'r farn y dylid cyflwyno dulliau eraill o adfer y dreth pe byddai hynny'n cael ei ddileu, gan gynnwys awdurdodau lleol. Mae'n destun pryder mawr, felly, bod y Gweinidog wedi gwrthod ein hargymhelliad y dylai Llywodraeth Cymru weithio gyda Chymdeithas Llywodraeth Leol Cymru i ystyried mesurau amgen ar gyfer adennill dyledion a gronnwyd drwy beidio â thalu'r dreth gyngor. Mae'r Gweinidog yn iawn i ganolbwyntio ar atal, ond bydd yn dal angen cosb nad yw'n garchar ar gyfer rhai.

Ar hyn o bryd, caiff dinasyddion Iwerddon a'r Gymanwlad a dinasyddion perthnasol yr UE bleidleisio mewn etholiadau llywodraeth leol a rhai datganoledig, ond bydd y Bil hwn yn galluogi pob dinesydd tramor sy'n byw yn gyfreithlon yng Nghymru i bleidleisio mewn etholiadau llywodraeth leol. Ceir cytundeb cyfatebol hirsefydlog rhwng y DU a Gweriniaeth Iwerddon o ganlyniad i'r berthynas hanesyddol rhwng y ddwy wlad, ac mae gallu dinasyddion y Gymanwlad i bleidleisio yn etholiadau'r DU yn waddol o Ddeddf Cynrychiolaeth y Bobl 1918. Fodd bynnag, mae'r Bil hwn yn cynnig cam yn rhy bell. Mae gan y rhan fwyaf o'r gwledydd sy'n caniatáu i ddinasyddion tramor bleidleisio o leiaf ofyniad o statws preswylio o leiaf, ond mae hyd yn oed hynny ar goll yn y fan yma. Fel y dywedodd fy nghyd-Aelod, David Melding, wrth graffu ar ddarpariaethau tebyg yn Bil y Senedd ac Etholiadau (Cymru),

dylai eu dinasyddiaeth benderfynu ble maen nhw'n pleidleisio yn bennaf, ac os ydyn nhw'n gwneud y dewis i beidio â cheisio dinasyddiaeth yma, yna eu dewis nhw yw peidio â chael hawliau gwleidyddol i'r graddau o gael pleidleisio yn ein hetholiadau ni.

Yn waeth byth, er nad oedd Llywodraeth Cymru yn cynnwys darpariaeth yn y Bil hwn ar gyfer rhoi'r hawl i garcharorion bleidleisio, mae'r Gweinidog wedi cadarnhau, os bydd Aelodau yn derbyn y cynnig hwn heddiw, y gwnaiff gyflwyno gwelliannau i ganiatáu i garcharorion sy'n cael dedfrydau o lai na phedair blynedd, megis ar gyfer ymosodiad cyffredin a symbylwyd gan hil, torri gorchymyn trosedd rhyw, neu buteinio menywod, i bleidleisio mewn etholiadau llywodraeth leol. Mewn geiriau eraill, ar adeg o argyfwng cenedlaethol, mae'r Llywodraeth hon yng Nghynulliad Cymru eisiau i ni ei helpu i ruthro deddfwriaeth Llywodraeth Cymru trwodd a fydd yn cyflwyno newidiadau sy'n aruthrol o amhoblogaidd ymhlith y bobl, ac na allwn ni eu cefnogi.

16:45

Before starting, I'd like to put my thanks to the Minister and the Government on record, and to express my support for the action that you've taken in extending the lockdown. On this piece of legislation, the Minister and her team have done a great deal of work already, and I'd associate myself with the comments made by John Griffiths, as a member of his committee.

When the Bill was first introduced, I thought there was a lot to welcome in it—I still do think that. Votes at 16 and the removal of barriers to participation in the political process, in particular, are really important provisions. Under normal circumstances, we would have been supporting this Bill today and looking towards strengthening it via amendments and testing the will of the Government with some new ideas. But these are not normal circumstances, and now is not the time to be discussing this Bill. There will be many people who will be wondering how this could be any kind of a priority for the Government at the moment, when people are dying every day. All of us should be resolutely focused on helping the nation deal with the biggest health emergency in decades, in which it would not be an exaggeration to say that we are pretty much on a wartime footing.

From a practical point of view, it's extremely difficult to communicate at this time, and impossible to scrutinise effectively. We don't actually know, with clarity, what the Welsh Government's intentions are with this Bill going towards Stage 2, as, clearly, thorough scrutiny of a piece of legislation that is this extensive would be impossible, at least in the foreseeable future. It is Plaid Cymru's view that if we can't legislate properly because of the circumstances, we shouldn't be legislating at all, and to do so would be irresponsible.

We have limited time today to scrutinise the Government this week, and all of this time should be devoted to the scrutiny of the Government's coronavirus response. It's dismaying that, of the scheduled time we were given, half of that was given over to this debate on legislation that we would argue isn't time-sensitive.

I do note that the Government has said that it needs to pass this legislation today in order for work to be undertaken in time for 2022. I'm not certain that this does completely add up. If we're really saying that a delay of a few months would jeopardise a project of many years, I'm sure that there are questions over the project management of that two-year project that has no slack in the timescale. It's also worth highlighting, I think, that it is legislative lethargy that has delayed matters already. Votes at 16 has been the express will of the Senedd on a cross-party basis for several years now. We are paying a price in a time of emergency for the Welsh Government's inaction during normal times. So, Plaid Cymru will be voting against the Bill today, not because we disagree with the general principles, but because we believe firmly that this debate and this vote shouldn't be brought forward under these circumstances.

But now I want to turn to some of the comments that the Conservatives have been circulating on social media in particular. All I'll say is that if it's wrong for the Government to be continuing with this Bill at this time, it's also wrong for the Conservatives to be misrepresenting this Bill and pushing some quite disgusting attacks on it. The Conservatives have been saying that—well, falsely claiming it contains provisions for votes for prisoners, when the Bill that we're voting on today doesn't contain those provisions. Those are amendments to be tabled at Stage 2 by the Government at an unknown date in the future, and certainly won't be applied to murderers, as some members of the party have claimed wrongly. The leader of the Welsh Conservatives made this claim himself, which was really delving into gutter politics, I would argue, when the leader of his own party is in intensive care. So, I would welcome Paul Davies having the opportunity to apologise for misleading the electorate for narrow party political gain at this time.

Furthermore, I understand that 10 prisoners have already died from COVID-19, and over 100, possibly many more, are infected. To attack them at this time is, frankly, appalling. I would suggest to the Llywydd that the standards committee may be the appropriate forum, if elected Members think this is a good time to promote fake news about this institution.

So, to close, I look forward to revisiting the Bill in the future when this crisis is over, but, for the reasons I've explained, it's obvious that we should not be discussing this today, when we should be discussing PPE, testing and saving lives. So, Plaid Cymru will be voting against. 

Cyn dechrau, hoffwn ddiolch ar goedd i'r Gweinidog a'r Llywodraeth, a datgan fy nghefnogaeth i'r camau yr ydych chi wedi eu cymryd wrth ymestyn y cyfyngiadau ar symud. Ar y darn hwn o ddeddfwriaeth, mae'r Gweinidog a'i thîm wedi gwneud llawer iawn o waith eisoes, ac rwy'n cytuno â'r sylwadau a wnaed gan John Griffiths, â minnau'n aelod o'i bwyllgor.

Pan gyflwynwyd y Bil am y tro cyntaf, roeddwn i'n credu bod llawer i'w groesawu ynddo—rwy'n dal i gredu hynny. Mae pleidleisio yn 16 oed a dileu'r rhwystrau i gymryd rhan yn y broses wleidyddol, yn enwedig, yn ddarpariaethau pwysig iawn. O dan amgylchiadau arferol, byddem wedi bod yn cefnogi'r Bil hwn heddiw ac yn edrych tuag at ei gryfhau drwy welliannau a phrofi ewyllys y Llywodraeth gyda rhai syniadau newydd. Ond nid yw'r rhain yn amgylchiadau arferol, ac nid nawr yw'r amser i drafod y Bil hwn. Bydd llawer o bobl yn pendroni sut y gallai hyn fod yn unrhyw fath o flaenoriaeth i'r Llywodraeth ar hyn o bryd, pan fo pobl yn marw bob dydd. Dylai pob un ohonom ni ganolbwyntio'n gadarn ar helpu'r wlad i ymdrin â'r argyfwng iechyd mwyaf mewn degawdau, pan na fyddai'n or-liwio i ddweud ein bod ni mewn sefyllfa debyg i adeg rhyfel i raddau helaeth.

O safbwynt ymarferol, mae'n anodd iawn cyfathrebu ar hyn o bryd, ac yn amhosib craffu'n effeithiol. Nid ydym ni'n gwybod mewn gwirionedd, yn glir, beth yw bwriadau Llywodraeth Cymru wrth i'r Bil hwn fynd tuag at Gyfnod 2, oherwydd, yn amlwg, byddai craffu trwyadl ar ddarn o ddeddfwriaeth mor helaeth â hyn yn amhosibl, o leiaf yn y dyfodol rhagweladwy. Barn Plaid Cymru yw, os na allwn ni ddeddfu'n iawn oherwydd yr amgylchiadau, ni ddylem ni fod yn deddfu o gwbl, ac y byddai gwneud hynny'n anghyfrifol.

Amser cyfyngedig sydd gennym ni heddiw i graffu ar y Llywodraeth yr wythnos hon, a dylid neilltuo'r holl amser hwn i graffu ar ymateb y Llywodraeth i'r coronafeirws. Mae'n drueni ein bod ni, o'r amser a roddwyd i ni, wedi rhoi hanner hynny i'r ddadl hon ar ddeddfwriaeth y byddem yn dadlau nad yw'n sensitif o ran amseru.

Rwyf yn sylwi bod y Llywodraeth wedi dweud bod angen iddi basio'r ddeddfwriaeth hon heddiw er mwyn i waith gael ei wneud mewn pryd ar gyfer 2022. Dydw i ddim yn siŵr a yw hyn yn dal dŵr yn llwyr. Os ydym ni mewn gwirionedd yn dweud y byddai oedi o ychydig fisoedd yn peryglu prosiect o flynyddoedd lawer, rwy'n siŵr bod cwestiynau ynglŷn â rheoli'r prosiect dwy flynedd hwnnw nad oes ganddo unrhyw hyblygrwydd yn yr amserlen. Mae hefyd yn werth nodi, rwy'n credu, mai llusgo traed deddfwriaethol sydd wedi dal materion yn ôl yn barod. Pleidleisio yn 16 oed fu ewyllys pendant y Senedd ar sail drawsbleidiol ers sawl blwyddyn bellach. Rydym yn talu pris mewn cyfnod o argyfwng am ddiffyg gweithredu Llywodraeth Cymru yn ystod amseroedd arferol. Felly, bydd Plaid Cymru yn pleidleisio yn erbyn y Bil heddiw, nid am ein bod yn anghytuno â'r egwyddorion cyffredinol, ond oherwydd ein bod yn credu'n gryf na ddylid cyflwyno'r ddadl hon a'r bleidlais hon o dan yr amgylchiadau hyn.

Ond nawr rwyf eisiau troi at rai o'r sylwadau y mae'r Ceidwadwyr wedi bod yn eu cylchredeg ar y cyfryngau cymdeithasol yn enwedig. Y cwbl a ddywedaf yw, os nad yw'n iawn i'r Llywodraeth barhau â'r Bil ar hyn o bryd, nid yw'n iawn ychwaith i'r Ceidwadwyr fod yn camddehongli'r Bil hwn ac ymosod arno mewn modd eithaf ffiaidd. Mae'r Ceidwadwyr wedi bod yn dweud bod—wel, honni yn anghywir ei fod yn cynnwys darpariaethau ar gyfer pleidleisiau i garcharorion, pan nad yw'r Bil yr ydym yn pleidleisio arno heddiw yn cynnwys y darpariaethau hynny. Gwelliannau i'w cyflwyno yng Nghyfnod 2 gan y Llywodraeth ar ddyddiad anhysbys yn y dyfodol yw'r rhain, ac yn sicr ni fyddan nhw yn berthnasol i lofruddion, fel y mae rhai aelodau o'r blaid wedi ei honni yn anghywir. Gwnaeth arweinydd y Ceidwadwyr Cymreig yr honiadau hyn ei hun, sy'n ymostwng i wleidyddiaeth y gwter, byddwn yn dadlau, pan fo arweinydd ei blaid ei hun mewn gofal dwys. Felly, byddwn yn croesawu'r cyfle i Paul Davies ymddiheuro am gamarwain yr etholwyr er mwyn cael mantais wleidyddol fechan ar hyn o bryd.

Hefyd, rwy'n deall bod 10 carcharor eisoes wedi marw o COVID-19, a bod dros 100, o bosib llawer mwy, wedi eu heintio. Mae ymosod arnyn nhw ar yr adeg hon, a bod yn onest, yn warthus. Byddwn yn awgrymu wrth y Llywydd mai'r pwyllgor safonau yw'r fforwm priodol efallai, os yw Aelodau etholedig o'r farn bod nawr yn amser da i hyrwyddo newyddion ffug am y sefydliad hwn.

Felly, i gloi, edrychaf ymlaen at ailedrych ar y Bil yn y dyfodol pan fydd yr argyfwng hwn ar ben, ond, am y rhesymau yr wyf wedi eu hegluro, mae'n amlwg na ddylem ni fod yn trafod hyn heddiw, pan ddylem ni fod yn trafod cyfarpar diogelu personol, profi ac achub bywydau. Felly, bydd Plaid Cymru yn pleidleisio yn erbyn.  

16:50

It's regrettable that the Welsh Government have chosen to push ahead with this legislation, and I feel it's extremely ill-judged to be diverting resources at this moment in time when we could postpone this until our country is better placed following the coronavirus pandemic. Because at this moment in time, pushing ahead with legislation is also hugely unpopular with the public.

I have made my views on the Local Government and Elections (Wales) Bill perfectly clear in the past, but even if I had fully supported the Government's aim, I would not support pushing ahead at this time of national emergency. We cannot legislate properly and we cannot just rush something through, because people are dying from a deadly and virulent disease, and in order to limit the number of deaths and reduce the strain on our NHS, the liberties of each and every one of us have been curtailed. We have shut down vast swathes of our country and our economy, and some of our constituents have lost their jobs and their lives, yet here we are debating legislation.

My view on granting rights for prisoners to vote has never been because it isn't the right thing to do. It has always been because I don't think that that is the priority that we should be looking at when we visit a prison. Having worked there, I've seen people for seven years going out with a black bag on a Friday with no roof over their head at all, no food, no clothes and no support mechanism, and this is why I think that our priorities on true rehabilitation are totally wrong.

Democracy has been put on hold to fight this virus and elections around the UK have been postponed, and we should not be using valuable time during an international crisis in order to extend the voting franchise. We can discuss this and postpone it until such restrictions are lifted and business reverts back to something that we don't currently recognise. Until then, and only then, should we think about moving forward with this Bill.

I have supported the Welsh Government. They've had my full support and that of my party during the coronavirus outbreak, and we will continue to support the Welsh Government as they forge ahead, but I cannot and will not support them on this legislation. Diolch yn fawr.

Mae'n drueni bod Llywodraeth Cymru wedi dewis bwrw ymlaen â'r ddeddfwriaeth hon, ac rwy'n teimlo mai annoeth iawn yw dargyfeirio adnoddau ar hyn o bryd pan allem ni ohirio hyn nes bod ein gwlad mewn sefyllfa well yn dilyn pandemig y coronafeirws. Oherwydd ar hyn o bryd, mae gwthio ymlaen â deddfwriaeth hefyd yn amhoblogaidd iawn ymhlith y cyhoedd.

Rwyf wedi gwneud fy marn am Fil Llywodraeth Leol ac Etholiadau (Cymru) yn gwbl glir yn y gorffennol, ond hyd yn oed petawn i wedi cefnogi nod y Llywodraeth yn llwyr, ni fyddwn yn cefnogi bwrw ymlaen ar yr adeg hon o argyfwng cenedlaethol. Ni allwn ni ddeddfu'n iawn ac ni allwn ni ruthro i gyflawni rhywbeth, oherwydd mae pobl yn marw o glefyd enbyd ac angheuol, ac er mwyn cyfyngu ar nifer y marwolaethau a lleihau'r straen ar ein GIG, cyfyngwyd ar ryddid pob un ohonom ni. Rydym ni wedi cau rhannau helaeth o'n gwlad a'n heconomi, ac mae rhai o'n hetholwyr wedi colli eu swyddi a'u bywydau, ac eto dyma ni yn trafod deddfwriaeth.

Nid yw fy marn i ynglŷn â rhoi hawliau i garcharorion bleidleisio erioed wedi bod oherwydd nad dyna'r peth iawn i'w wneud. Mae bob amser wedi bod oherwydd nad wyf i'n credu mai dyna'r flaenoriaeth y dylem ni fod yn edrych arni pan fyddwn yn ymweld â charchar. A minnau wedi gweithio yno, rwyf wedi gweld pobl ers saith mlynedd yn mynd allan gyda bag du ar ddydd Gwener heb do uwch eu pennau o gwbl, dim bwyd, dim dillad a dim mecanwaith cymorth, a dyma pam yr wyf yn credu bod ein blaenoriaethau ar adsefydlu gwirioneddol yn gwbl anghywir.

Mae democratiaeth wedi ei hatal i frwydro yn erbyn y feirws hwn ac mae etholiadau o amgylch y DU wedi eu gohirio, ac ni ddylem fod yn defnyddio amser gwerthfawr yn ystod argyfwng rhyngwladol er mwyn ymestyn yr hawl i bleidleisio. Gallwn drafod hyn a'i ohirio nes y caiff y cyfryw gyfyngiadau eu codi a bod y byd busnes yn dychwelyd i sefyllfa nad ydym ni'n ei adnabod ar hyn o bryd. Tan hynny, a dim ond bryd hynny, y dylem ni ystyried bwrw ymlaen â'r Bil hwn.

Rwyf wedi cefnogi Llywodraeth Cymru. Mae hi wedi cael fy nghefnogaeth lawn a chefnogaeth fy mhlaid yn ystod haint y coronafeirws, a byddwn yn parhau i gefnogi Llywodraeth Cymru wrth iddi fwrw ymlaen, ond ni allaf ac ni wnaf ei chefnogi gyda'r ddeddfwriaeth hon. Diolch yn fawr.

I've got few brief comments to make on the Bill, and in saying this, of course, I do recognise, as the Minister said, that this has been subject to immense consultation, and across three different committees in the Senedd, including the committee that I serve on under the eminent stewardship of John Griffiths. We looked at this in great detail, and I think my first point would be that, in recognising that the Minister has said in her opening remarks that she's bringing this Bill forward with an eye to the future, we should, of course, as Senedd Members be trying to keep an eye on what comes beyond this dire emergency that we are currently in. But with that eye to the future, I would urge the Minister to look at the recommendations that have only been partially accepted, or which have been rejected from the committee's extensive exploration of this with many, many witnesses in front of us. I'd really welcome, if she could, as this Bill progresses, going back to have a look at some of those recommendations.

But in taking this Bill forward, it has an immense amount of support behind it. It is something that local government has been calling for in broad terms for quite some time, in many of the areas within this Bill, including the areas of general competences and the ability to work together voluntarily and so on.

The power to extend the voting franchise to 16 and 17-year-olds is something that I know has had strong support within the Senedd as well as from those within, for example, the Youth Parliament as well. But we do need—the point has been made already—to make sure that, if we take that forward, then those who are 13, 14, 15 years old actually learn not only about the process of engaging in democracy, but also about the political processes as well, in a sort of citizen engagement. And I think that Minister does need to consider with other colleagues how that is best embedded within our education system.

There are great measures within this Bill as well in terms of openness and transparency. I do remember taking a cohort of students, when I was a lecturer in Swansea, to Neath Port Talbot County Borough Council. So, they sat in the galleries and watched a session in action. They were all tourism students. Unfortunately, the day we turned up was a day in which they were talking about grass cutting in the parks and cemeteries. However, it did show actually how local authorities proceeded and how they made their decisions and how they voted. But the fact that we could now be looking at extending the ability of people who can't attend in person to actually see these, and engage with it, potentially, as well, on screens and remotely, as we are doing today, should be something we are looking to take forward.

There were different positions on our committee in terms of the measures around STV and first-past-the-post. Now, I'll speak personally here: I'd be a supporter of greater electoral reform, but I think there is a balance to tread within this Bill. The fact that we actually have STV here as a possibility, if we're talking to the general principles of the Bill, I think is a remarkable step forward. But I would encourage the Minister, as John Griffiths has said as well, to explore with the local authorities where they felt there was a mood amongst the local public to actually take this forward and amongst members to enable them to do so, because, otherwise, as many witnesses said to us, we might actually never see the day when STV gets off the ground. And, of course, with STV, it's not simply the concept of it, but the fact that it can lead to each vote being more equal in the way that it weighs within the ballot box, but also the impact that STV can have on diversity as well.

And that brings me to my next point, about job sharing. I am one of those Members that would like the job-sharing proposals to go forward, although there is the great step forward within this Bill in terms of job sharing for executive members, and we heard evidence on this about how it can work. But, ultimately, I think we do need to move to that point where we can see job sharing when people stand for election, because, again, in terms of increasing diversity of candidature, that could be a major step forward. Now, I realise there are practical issues around all of these, and the Minister has to wrestle with all of these, but I welcome the fact this Bill is here.

In my final closing remarks, can I just thank John and all the other committee members for the way they've wrestled with some quite complex matters within this Bill, all the witnesses who came in front of us and engaged with us fully and frankly, and just urge the Minister again, in closing, to look at those areas that she hasn't yet been able to concede on and to engage with those areas as this Bill goes forward? It's a good Bill; it could be an excellent Bill if we have some movement. Thank you. 

Mae gennyf ambell sylw byr i'w gwneud ynghylch y Bil, ac wrth ddweud hyn, wrth gwrs, rwy'n cydnabod, fel y dywedodd y Gweinidog, y bu hyn yn destun ymgynghori aruthrol, a chyda thri gwahanol bwyllgor yn y Senedd, gan gynnwys y Pwyllgor yr wyf i'n gwasanaethu arno dan stiwardiaeth flaenllaw John Griffiths. Fe wnaethom ni ystyried hyn yn fanwl iawn, ac rwy'n credu mai fy mhwynt cyntaf fyddai, wrth gydnabod bod y Gweinidog wedi dweud yn ei sylwadau agoriadol ei bod yn cyflwyno'r Bil hwn gyda golwg ar y dyfodol, y dylem ni, wrth gwrs, Aelodau'r Senedd, geisio cadw llygad ar yr hyn sy'n dod y tu hwnt i'r argyfwng enbyd hwn yr ydym ni ynddo ar hyn o bryd. Ond gyda'r llygad hwnnw ar y dyfodol, byddwn yn annog y Gweinidog i edrych ar yr argymhellion nad ydyn nhw ond wedi cael eu derbyn yn rhannol, neu sydd wedi eu gwrthod o archwiliad helaeth y pwyllgor o hyn gyda llawer iawn o dystion ger ein bron. Byddwn yn croesawu'n fawr, pe gellid, wrth i'r Bil hwn fynd yn ei flaen, dychwelyd i edrych ar rai o'r argymhellion hynny.

Ond wrth fynd â'r Bil hwn yn ei flaen, mae cefnogaeth aruthrol iddo. Mae'n rhywbeth y bu llywodraeth leol yn galw amdano yn gyffredinol ers cryn amser, mewn llawer o'r meysydd yn y Bil hwn, gan gynnwys meysydd cymwyseddau cyffredinol a'r gallu i gydweithio'n wirfoddol ac yn y blaen.

Gwn fod y pŵer i ymestyn yr etholfraint bleidleisio i bobl ifanc 16 ac 17 oed yn rhywbeth y mae cefnogaeth gref iddo yn y Senedd yn ogystal ag ymhlith y rheini sydd, er enghraifft, yn y Senedd Ieuenctid hefyd. Ond mae angen i ni—mae'r sylw wedi ei wneud yn barod—wneud yn siŵr, os ydym yn bwrw ymlaen â hynny, fod y rhai sy'n 13, 14, 15 oed mewn gwirionedd yn dysgu nid yn unig am y broses o ymwneud â democratiaeth, ond hefyd am y prosesau gwleidyddol yn ogystal, mewn rhyw fath o ymarferiad ymgysylltu â dinasyddion. Ac rwy'n credu bod angen i'r Gweinidog ystyried gyda chyd-Aelodau eraill beth yw'r ffordd orau o ymgorffori hynny yn ein system addysg.

Mae mesurau gwych yn y Bil hwn yn ogystal o ran bod yn agored a thryloyw. Rwy'n cofio cymryd carfan o fyfyrwyr, pan oeddwn yn ddarlithydd yn Abertawe, i Gyngor Bwrdeistref Sirol Castell-nedd Port Talbot. Felly, roedden nhw'n eistedd yn yr orielau ac yn gwylio sesiwn ar waith. Roedden nhw i gyd yn fyfyrwyr twristiaeth. Yn anffodus, y diwrnod i ni ymweld oedd diwrnod pan yr oedden nhw yn siarad am dorri glaswellt yn y parciau a'r mynwentydd. Fodd bynnag, roedd yn dangos sut yr oedd awdurdodau lleol yn mynd ati i wneud eu penderfyniadau a sut yr oedden nhw'n pleidleisio. Ond dylai'r ffaith y gallem ni bellach fod yn ystyried ymestyn gallu pobl nad ydyn nhw'n gallu bod yn bresennol yn bersonol i weld y rhain, ac i fod yn rhan o hynny, o bosib, yn ogystal, ar sgriniau ac o bell, fel yr ydym ni yn ei wneud heddiw, fod yn rhywbeth yr ydym ni'n bwriadu bwrw ymlaen ag ef.

Roedd gwahanol safbwyntiau ar ein pwyllgor o ran y mesurau ynghylch y bleidlais sengl drosglwyddadwy a'r cyntaf i'r felin. Nawr, rwyf am siarad yn bersonol yn y fan yma: byddwn i'n gefnogol i fwy o ddiwygio etholiadol, ond rwy'n credu bod angen cydbwysedd yn y Bil hwn. Credaf fod y ffaith bod gennym ni bleidlais sengl drosglwyddadwy yma fel posibilrwydd, os ydym ni'n sôn am egwyddorion cyffredinol y Bil, yn gam hynod ymlaen. Ond byddwn yn annog y Gweinidog, fel y mae John Griffiths wedi ei ddweud hefyd, i archwilio, gyda'r awdurdodau lleol, lle'r oedden nhw'n teimlo bod teimlad ymhlith y cyhoedd lleol i fwrw ymlaen â hyn mewn gwirionedd ac ymhlith yr Aelodau i'w galluogi i wneud hynny, oherwydd, fel arall, fel y dywedodd llawer o dystion wrthym ni, efallai na fyddwn ni byth yn gweld y diwrnod pan fydd pleidlais sengl drosglwyddadwy ac, wrth gwrs, gyda'r bleidlais sengl drosglwyddadwy, nid y cysyniad yn unig ydyw, ond y ffaith y gall arwain at weld pob pleidlais yn fwy cyfartal yn y ffordd y mae'n pwyso yn y blwch pleidleisio, ond hefyd yr effaith y gall y bleidlais sengl drosglwyddadwy ei chael ar amrywiaeth hefyd.

Ac mae hynny'n dod â mi at fy mhwynt nesaf, ynglŷn â rhannu swyddi. Rwyf i'n un o'r Aelodau hynny a hoffai weld y cynigion rhannu swydd yn mynd ymlaen, er bod y Bil hwn yn gam mawr ymlaen o ran rhannu swyddi i aelodau gweithredol, a chlywsom dystiolaeth am hyn ynglŷn â sut y gallai weithio. Ond, yn y pen draw, rwy'n credu bod angen i ni symud i'r pwynt lle gallwn ni weld rhannu swyddi pan fydd pobl yn sefyll mewn etholiad, oherwydd, unwaith eto, o ran cynyddu amrywiaeth yr ymgeisyddiaeth, gallai hynny fod yn gam mawr ymlaen. Nawr, rwy'n sylweddoli bod materion ymarferol yn ymwneud â phob un o'r rhain, ac mae'n rhaid i'r Gweinidog ymgodymu â phob un o'r rhain, ond rwy'n croesawu'r ffaith bod y Bil hwn yma.

Yn fy sylwadau olaf i gloi, a gaf i ddiolch i John ac i holl Aelodau eraill y pwyllgor am y ffordd y maen nhw wedi ymgodymu â rhai materion eithaf cymhleth yn y Bil hwn, i'r holl dystion a ddaeth ger ein bron ac ymgysylltu â ni'n llwyr ac yn ddidwyll, a dim ond annog y Gweinidog unwaith eto, i gloi, i edrych ar y meysydd hynny nad yw wedi gallu eu derbyn hyd yma ac ymgysylltu â'r meysydd hynny wrth i'r Bil hwn fynd rhagddo? Mae'n Fil da; gallai fod yn Fil rhagorol os cawn ni rywfaint o fireinio. Diolch.  

16:55

During such a time of global crisis and very serious circumstances affecting many of our people in Wales, I simply cannot welcome the Local Government and Elections (Wales) Bill today. To concentrate, during this period of emergency, on this Bill, when we've seen our local democracy stifled, scrutiny has been downplayed as a result of us all working together to adapt to social distances—. So, for me, precious Plenary time is being lost due to this legislation. One only has to look at today, where nine Members were unable to raise very important serious scrutiny questions to the First Minister to give way for the time for this, and it's just something that doesn't lay easily with me. 

Now, in the first instance, you will be aware that the Welsh Government, local government and public sector response to COVID-19 is putting a remarkable and considerable strain on the financial resources available to our local authorities, and I would like to place on my record the work of our local authority and all the personnel in coping with this horrendous emergency situation that we have, but it is putting a financial strain on our local authorities. 

Now, many of those financial resources have had to come from their current budgets and things. So, for me, it does seem rather irresponsible for us to be considering a Bill, which, according to its own regulatory impact assessment, will cost over £17 million, and that includes transitional costs to local government of approximately £3 million. To make matters worse, the Finance Committee's commented that the Bill contains a number of areas that have not yet been costed and this—. I'm sorry, but this is happening too often with the passing of Welsh Government legislation. We know the removal of reasonable chastisement—only passed weeks ago—was underfinanced in terms of the impact that it's going to have. 

Yn ystod cyfnod o argyfwng byd-eang ac amgylchiadau difrifol iawn sy'n effeithio ar lawer o'n pobl yng Nghymru, ni allaf ar unrhyw gyfrif groesawu'r Bil Llywodraeth Leol ac Etholiadau (Cymru) heddiw. I ganolbwyntio, yn ystod y cyfnod hwn o argyfwng, ar y Bil hwn, pan ein bod ni wedi gweld mygu ein democratiaeth leol, a lle na ellir craffu'n briodol o ganlyniad i bob un ohonom ni'n cydweithio i addasu i gadw pellter cymdeithasol—. Felly, i mi, mae amser gwerthfawr yn y Cyfarfod Llawn yn cael ei golli oherwydd y ddeddfwriaeth hon. Nid oes ond angen i rywun edrych ar heddiw, pan oedd naw Aelod nad oedd modd iddyn nhw holi cwestiynau craffu difrifol a phwysig i'r Prif Weinidog a gorfod ildio i roi amser ar gyfer hyn, ac mae'n rhywbeth nad wyf i'n hapus iawn o gwbl ag ef.

Nawr, yn y lle cyntaf, byddwch yn ymwybodol bod Llywodraeth Cymru, llywodraeth leol ac ymateb y sector cyhoeddus i COVID-19 yn rhoi straen rhyfeddol a sylweddol ar yr adnoddau ariannol sydd ar gael i'n hawdurdodau lleol, a hoffwn gydnabod ar goedd waith ein hawdurdod lleol a'r holl bersonél wrth ymdopi â'r sefyllfa argyfwng erchyll hon sydd gennym ni, ond mae yn rhoi straen ariannol ar ein hawdurdodau lleol.

Nawr, mae llawer o'r adnoddau ariannol hynny wedi gorfod dod o'u cyllidebau cyfredol ac ati. Felly, i mi, mae'n ymddangos braidd yn anghyfrifol i ni fod yn ystyried Bil, a fydd, yn ôl ei asesiad effaith rheoleiddiol ei hun, yn costio dros £17 miliwn, ac mae hynny'n cynnwys costau trosiannol i lywodraeth leol o tua £3 miliwn. I wneud pethau'n waeth, dywedodd y Pwyllgor Cyllid fod y Bil yn cynnwys nifer o feysydd na chyfrifwyd eu cost hyd yma a bod hyn—. Mae'n ddrwg gennyf, ond mae hyn yn digwydd yn rhy aml gyda phasio deddfwriaeth Llywodraeth Cymru. Gwyddom fod dileu cosb rhesymol—a basiwyd dim ond wythnosau yn ôl—wedi ei dangyllido o ran yr effaith a gaiff. 

Now, I do agree with their recommendation that the Welsh Government commit to providing a full and robust regulatory impact assessment for any relevant subordinate legislation made as a result of this Bill, but would add that we all consider very carefully whether pursuing the legislation is considered reasonable, especially given such uncertain times that we see ourselves in at the moment due to COVID-19.

Given that this Bill is likely to be pushed through, and in an effort to be constructive however, I would note there are some aspects that I welcome. I do support the ability that Welsh Ministers will have to establish and maintain an all-Wales database of electoral registration information. However, the RIA does not define any costs for developing an all-Wales database. So, some clarity today would be welcomed on this.

Two: provisions to require a principal council to create a petition scheme. Now, as ERS Cymru have noted—and I know very well from our own Petitions Committee—petitions are a fantastic way to engage with the public, and I see democracy at its best when we're doing that. I would like to put on record Monmouthshire County Council's call for the Bill to be explicit in stating, though, that the petitions are not referenda, that they are only advisory rather than binding. 

Three: that the Bill provides for two or more principal councils to submit a joint application to the Welsh Ministers for the voluntary merger of their respective areas and councils should they wish to do so. Local accountability and decision making is key. So, should two authorities wish to merge, I would like some assurances that the Welsh Government would not have a means in place to block that plan and would work with them in terms of resources and guidance to help make that happen. Another positive that I have long campaigned for is the amending of the eligibility for local government candidacy to allow council employees to stand for election. However, I would urge the Minister to consider whether it really is necessary for individuals such as school teachers, cooks, swimming instructors to have to stand down from their paid employment should they be elected. If one looks at our education system, one can be a teacher and be a governor of a school. So, I think we need to be looking at that again.

Now, in addition to local government candidates, the Bill is set to bring major changes to those who can vote, and albeit at amendment stage, in amendments and at Stage 2 and 3, I am strongly opposed to giving prisoners the vote. I have consulted widely with a number of my constituents in Aberconwy, and the overwhelming majority of correspondence I have received is strongly opposed.

So, I would like some clarification—because I may have missed the point on this—from the Minister, in what you said earlier: is it correct now that at Stage 2 or 3 you will not now be proceeding with amendments that would allow votes for prisoners? Because I cannot support that in any shape or form. Bringing a Bill in, amendments at Stage 2, for me, that will allow for the right of prisoners serving sentences of less than four years I do not believe is in the interests of democracy. So, I would ask you to confirm, and indeed to rule votes for prisoners out today. I would like to suggest that I am dismayed that we have a Welsh Government that is prepared to believe such an issue right now to be a legislative priority.

Finally, whilst I do acknowledge and support the precedents set by the Isle of Man and Scotland for extending the franchise to 16 and 17-year-olds, I would ask for greater assurances today that there will be some confirmation that these young adults will be provided with a stronger education in politics, so that, when they do go to cast their first vote, they do so with a fair context of what democracy means and how they can play their part in it. Thank you. Diolch, Llywydd.

Nawr, rwyf yn cytuno â'u hargymhelliad bod Llywodraeth Cymru yn ymrwymo i ddarparu asesiad effaith rheoleiddiol llawn a chadarn ar gyfer unrhyw is-ddeddfwriaeth berthnasol a wneir o ganlyniad i'r Bil hwn, ond byddwn i'n ychwanegu ein bod i gyd yn ystyried yn ofalus iawn a yw mynd ar drywydd y ddeddfwriaeth yn rhesymol, yn enwedig o ystyried y cyfnod ansicr yr ydym ni'n gweld ein hunain ynddo ar hyn o bryd.

O ystyried ei bod yn debygol y caiff y Bil hwn ei wthio drwodd, ac mewn ymdrech i fod yn adeiladol fodd bynnag, fe fyddwn i'n nodi bod rhai agweddau yr wyf yn eu croesawu. Rwyf yn cefnogi'r gallu y bydd gan Weinidogion Cymru i sefydlu a chynnal cronfa ddata Cymru gyfan o wybodaeth am gofrestru etholiadol. Fodd bynnag, nid yw'r asesiad effaith rheoleiddiol yn diffinio unrhyw gostau ar gyfer datblygu cronfa ddata Cymru gyfan. Felly, byddai rhywfaint o eglurder ynghylch hyn heddiw yn cael ei groesawu.

Dau: darpariaethau i'w gwneud yn ofynnol i brif gyngor greu cynllun deisebau. Nawr, fel y mae ERS Cymru wedi nodi—ac rwy'n gwybod yn dda iawn o'n Pwyllgor Deisebau ein hunain—mae deisebau'n ffordd wych o ymgysylltu â'r cyhoedd, ac rwy'n gweld democratiaeth ar ei gorau pan ein bod ni'n gwneud hynny. Hoffwn gofnodi galwad Cyngor Sir Fynwy i'r Bil nodi'n glir, er hynny, nad refferenda yw'r deisebau, a'u bod yn gynghorol yn hytrach nag yn rhwymol.

Tri: bod y Bil yn darparu ar gyfer dau neu fwy o brif gynghorau i gyflwyno cais ar y cyd i Weinidogion Cymru ar gyfer uno gwirfoddol yn eu hardaloedd a'u cynghorau nhw pe bydden nhw'n dymuno gwneud hynny. Mae atebolrwydd a phenderfyniadau lleol yn allweddol. Felly, pe byddai dau awdurdod yn dymuno uno, hoffwn gael rhywfaint o sicrwydd na fyddai gan Lywodraeth Cymru ddull ar waith i atal y cynllun hwnnw ac y byddai'n gweithio gyda nhw o ran adnoddau a chanllawiau i helpu i sicrhau bod hynny'n digwydd. Rhywbeth cadarnhaol arall yr wyf wedi ymgyrchu'n hir amdano yw diwygio cymhwysedd ar gyfer ymgeisyddiaeth mewn llywodraeth leol i ganiatáu i weithwyr cyngor sefyll mewn etholiad. Fodd bynnag, byddwn yn annog y Gweinidog i ystyried a yw wir yn angenrheidiol i unigolion megis athrawon ysgol, cogyddion a hyfforddwyr nofio roi'r gorau i'w gwaith cyflogedig os cânt eu hethol. Os edrychir ar ein system addysg, caiff rhywun fod yn athro ac yn llywodraethwr ysgol. Felly, rwy'n credu bod angen i ni edrych ar hynny eto.

Nawr, yn ogystal ag ymgeiswyr llywodraeth leol, mae'r Bil yn bwriadu cyflwyno newidiadau mawr o ran pwy sy'n cael pleidleisio, ac er ei fod yn y cyfnod diwygio, yn y diwygiadau ac yng Nghyfnodau 2 a 3, rwy'n gwrthwynebu'n gryf rhoi'r bleidlais i garcharorion. Rwyf wedi ymgynghori'n eang â nifer o'm hetholwyr yn Aberconwy, ac mae mwyafrif llethol yr ohebiaeth yr wyf i wedi ei chael yn gwrthwynebu'n chwyrn.

Felly, hoffwn gael rhywfaint o eglurhad—gan, efallai, fy mod wedi colli'r pwynt ynghylch hyn—gan y Gweinidog, yn yr hyn a ddywedasoch chi'n gynharach: a yw'n gywir na fyddwch chi yn awr, yng Nghyfnod 2 neu 3 yn bwrw ymlaen â diwygiadau a fyddai'n caniatáu i garcharorion bleidleisio? Oherwydd ni allaf gefnogi hynny mewn unrhyw ffurf. Nid wyf i'n credu bod cyflwyno Bil, diwygiadau yng Nghyfnod 2 a fydd yn rhoi'r hawl i garcharorion sydd wedi eu dedfrydu i lai na phedair blynedd, o fudd i ddemocratiaeth. Felly, hoffwn ofyn i chi gadarnhau, ac yn wir, i ddiystyru pleidleisiau ar gyfer carcharorion heddiw. Hoffwn awgrymu fy mod yn siomedig bod gennym ni Lywodraeth Cymru sy'n barod i gredu bod mater o'r fath yn flaenoriaeth ddeddfwriaethol ar hyn o bryd.

Yn olaf, er fy mod yn cydnabod ac yn cefnogi'r cynseiliau a osodwyd gan Ynys Manaw a'r Alban ar gyfer ymestyn yr etholfraint i bobl ifanc 16 a 17 oed, gofynnaf am fwy o sicrwydd heddiw y bydd rhywfaint o gadarnhad y caiff yr oedolion ifainc hyn fwy o addysg mewn gwleidyddiaeth, fel y byddan nhw, wrth fynd ymlaen i fwrw eu pleidlais gyntaf, yn gwneud hynny gyda chyd-destun sylweddol o'r hyn y mae democratiaeth yn ei olygu a sut y gallan nhw chwarae eu rhan ynddi. Diolch. Diolch, Llywydd.

17:05

Well, I think this is an extraordinary time to be bringing this Bill forward. This is a constitutional measure, and we are in a highly attenuated forum in this debate today. Despite the marvels of modern technology, which have enabled us quite effectively, I think, to participate in proceedings in the last two weeks, I don't believe that it's right, when two thirds of the Members of the Assembly are not able to participate in this debate, to bring it forward today for discussion and for a vote.

The only reason that this Bill is being progressed—in my view, it's a desperate attempt by the Labour Party to shore up its dwindling political support throughout the electorate. We see in the recent general election how the electoral map of Britain, and Wales in particular, has changed. Labour has lost a great deal of its traditional voter support, and it's a measure of its desperation that it now seeks some salvation by extending the vote to children, prisoners and foreigners. If that's the measure of the Labour Party's desperation, I don't give much for their chances in the next set of elections. It seems to me they're in the same position today as the great silent film actor Harold Lloyd—hanging from the hands of the clock, desperate to try and stop himself falling into an abyss. And I don't believe that they will succeed in this respect.

As regards votes for people who are not citizens of the United Kingdom, I believe that that is wrong in principle, that if you are to determine the make-up of a Parliament and the Government of a country, then you ought to be as firmly committed to that by being a citizen as you possibly can. So, this is wrong in principle and there's almost nowhere else in the world where this has been done in the past.

Whether votes should be given to those who are 16 and 17-year-olds, again I think is a highly controversial issue, and it's improper, I think, for it to be brought before the Assembly for legislation in this way. It's notable that the Labour Party today derives a very large proportion of the support it retains from younger people and from migrant communities, and, of course, those are two of the major elements of the extension of the electorate that the Government in Wales is seeking in the course of this Bill. In my view, it's a squalid political manoeuvre for partisan purposes. It's the Labour Party's emergency that this Bill has been brought in to try to benefit, rather than the national emergency. We have suspended our civil liberties over huge swathes of human rights in the course of the last few weeks, and that would never be done in times of normality. This is an emergency, currently, in relation to the COVID virus, which we've not seen before in our lifetimes, and, in these circumstances, I think it is absolutely extraordinary that the Welsh Government should feel it right and proper to bring forward this Bill for consideration today. So, I hope that the Assembly will stand up for its rights and the rights of its Members who are not able to participate in the proceedings in the course of this debate, and throw this Bill out today.

Wel, rwy'n credu bod hon yn adeg anhygoel i gyflwyno'r Bil hwn. Cam cyfansoddiadol yw hwn, ac rydym mewn fforwm sydd wedi'i wanhau'n fawr yn y ddadl hon heddiw. Er gwaethaf rhyfeddodau technoleg fodern, sydd wedi ein galluogi'n eithaf effeithiol, rwy'n credu, i gymryd rhan yn y trafodion yn ystod y pythefnos diwethaf, dydw i ddim yn credu ei bod yn iawn, pan nad yw dwy ran o dair o Aelodau'r Cynulliad yn gallu cymryd rhan yn y ddadl hon, i'w dwyn ymlaen heddiw i'w thrafod ac i gael pleidlais.

Yr unig reswm y mae'r Bil hwn yn cael ei wthio ymlaen—yn fy marn i, yw ei bod yn ymdrech daer gan y Blaid Lafur i sicrhau hwb i'w chefnogaeth wleidyddol sydd wedi edwino ymhlith yr etholwyr. Gwelwn yn yr etholiad cyffredinol diweddar sut y mae map etholiadol Prydain, a Chymru yn arbennig, wedi newid. Mae Llafur wedi colli llawer iawn o gefnogaeth ei phleidleiswyr traddodiadol, ac mae'n fesur o'i hanobaith ei bod bellach yn ceisio achubiaeth o ryw fath drwy ymestyn y bleidlais i blant, carcharorion a thramorwyr. Os mai dyna yw maint anobaith y Blaid Lafur, dydw i ddim yn credu y bydd ganddyn nhw lawer o obaith yn y gyfres nesaf o etholiadau. Mae'n ymddangos i mi eu bod yn yr un sefyllfa heddiw ag yr oedd yr actor mawr hwnnw yn y ffilmiau mud, Harold Lloyd—yn hongian ar fysedd y cloc, yn ceisio'n daer i atal ei hun rhag disgyn i'r ddaear. A dydw i ddim yn credu y byddan nhw'n llwyddo yn hynny o beth.

O ran y pleidleisiau ar gyfer pobl nad ydyn nhw yn ddinasyddion y Deyrnas Unedig, credaf fod hynny'n anghywir mewn egwyddor, sef os ydych chi eisiau pennu ffurf Senedd a Llywodraeth gwlad, yna dylech chi ymrwymo gymaint ag y gallwch chi i fod yn ddinesydd. Felly, mae hyn yn anghywir mewn egwyddor a does bron unman arall yn y byd lle mae hyn wedi digwydd yn y gorffennol.

A ddylid rhoi pleidleisiau i'r rhai sy'n 16 ac yn 17 oed, eto credaf ei fod yn fater dadleuol iawn, ac mae'n amhriodol, rwy'n credu, iddo gael ei ddwyn gerbron y Cynulliad ar gyfer deddfwriaeth yn y modd hwn. Mae'n werth sylwi bod y Blaid Lafur heddiw yn cael cyfran fawr iawn o'r gefnogaeth y mae'n ei chadw oddi wrth bobl iau ac oddi wrth gymunedau mudol, ac, wrth gwrs, dyna ddwy o brif elfennau ymestyn yr etholwyr y mae'r Llywodraeth yng Nghymru yn eu ceisio yn ystod hynt y Bil hwn. Yn fy marn i, mae'n weithred wleidyddol ddirmygadwy at ddibenion pleidiol. Cyflwynwyd y Bil hwn i geisio rhoi mantais i'r Blaid Lafur yn ei hargyfwng, ac nid oherwydd yr argyfwng cenedlaethol. Rydym ni wedi atal dros dro ein rhyddid sifil o ran nifer fawr o hawliau dynol yn ystod yr ychydig wythnosau diwethaf, ac ni fyddai hynny byth yn digwydd mewn cyfnod arferol. Mae hwn yn argyfwng, ar hyn o bryd, o ran feirws COVID, nad ydym wedi ei weld o'r blaen yn ystod ein hoes, ac, o dan yr amgylchiadau hyn, rwy'n credu ei bod yn gwbl anghredadwy bod Llywodraeth Cymru yn teimlo ei bod yn iawn ac yn briodol i gyflwyno'r Bil hwn i'w ystyried heddiw. Felly, gobeithiaf y bydd y Cynulliad yn sefyll dros ei hawliau a hawliau ei Aelodau nad ydyn nhw yn gallu cymryd rhan yn y trafodion yn ystod y ddadl hon, ac yn gwrthod y Bil hwn heddiw.

Diolch yn fawr. Excuse me a minute. Yes, thank you for the opportunity of speaking in this debate. I wanted to come in behind Mick Antoniw's earlier contribution and also part of what Delyth Jewell was saying about is this the appropriate time to be able to give this Bill proper scrutiny, so I want to discuss less the policy objectives of this, but to concentrate a bit more on our role as legislators in connection with a major piece of legislation. And I have to say that the Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee is there to help us as Assembly Members with the singular and primary responsibility that we have, regardless of our political preferences, for making good law. I would say that the Welsh Local Government Association, whatever they want from this Bill, they want this law to be good and something they can use, and something they can rely upon. So, I'm not going to be talking about those policy objectives, except from an illustrative point of view.

Diolch yn fawr. Esgusodwch fi am funud. Ie, diolch am y cyfle i siarad yn y ddadl hon. Roeddwn i eisiau cyfrannu yn sgil cyfraniad Mick Antoniw yn gynharach a hefyd yn sgil rhan o'r hyn yr oedd Delyth Jewell yn ei ddweud ynghylch pa un ai dyma'r amser priodol i graffu'n iawn ar y Bil hwn, felly rwyf eisiau trafod llai ar amcanion y polisi, ond canolbwyntio ychydig yn fwy ar ein swyddogaeth ni'r deddfwyr mewn cysylltiad â darn mawr o ddeddfwriaeth. Ac mae'n rhaid i mi ddweud bod y Pwyllgor Deddfwriaeth, Cyfiawnder a'r Cyfansoddiad yno i'n helpu ni Aelodau'r Cynulliad gyda'r cyfrifoldeb unigol a sylfaenol sydd gennym ni, ni waeth beth yw ein blaenoriaethau gwleidyddol, sef gwneud cyfraith dda. Byddwn i'n dweud bod Cymdeithas Llywodraeth Leol Cymru, beth bynnag y maen nhw'n dymuno ei gael o'r Bil hwn, eisiau i'r gyfraith hon fod yn dda ac yn rhywbeth y gallan nhw ei ddefnyddio, ac yn rhywbeth y gallan nhw ddibynnu arno. Felly, ni fyddaf yn siarad am yr amcanion polisi hynny, ac eithrio o safbwynt esboniadol.

I'm not embarrassed to say this yet again, that it is the Welsh Parliament that makes the law, not the Government. So, it's the very least we can expect as a first step from Government that it lays a Bill that is, first, complete; that is, secondly, fully fleshed out in terms of its policy objective and at least its initial delivery; and, thirdly, has been properly costed. I think the failure to accept certain recommendations from the Finance Committee on this is a mistake. I don't think that this Bill satisfies those three general principles. If it doesn't do that, I think as legislators we should reject it today, send it back and, maybe, reinvite it to be re-laid in a form that does satisfy those tests. That's notwithstanding the point that's already been made about the period in which this piece of legislation has been brought forward.

The Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee—the former version, of course, of Mick Antoniw's committee—said that amendments are for debating and suggesting improvements to a Bill, and not to deliver large and significant amounts of text and not to complete Bills that are not considered fully developed at the point of introduction. As an Assembly, of course, we ignored that when we passed the Senedd and elections Bill, and as legislators we shouldn't do that again. Fool us once and it's shame on you, Welsh Government, but fool us twice and it's shame on us. I'd like to say it's for the first time, but it's not. I think it is time for us to do our jobs and say why this is bad law now.

So, just to look back at the Senedd and elections Bill, one of the arguments put forward by the Welsh Government was that the unscrutinised inclusion of votes for resident foreign nationals would be to make it more consistent with this—the contents of, at the time, an unseen Bill. Now, this unseen Bill will, belatedly, be offering votes to certain prisoners, although I heard what the Minister said earlier, and perhaps she could clarify the position now and what she meant when she said that she would not be asking officials to devote any more resources to this. But, the point is that it was completely inconsistent with the Senedd and elections Act, already poor reasoning on the part of the Welsh Government, and now they're seeking to have it both ways, unless the Minister has something else to say on this. As legislators, we should, therefore, say 'no'.

The obvious question is why prisoner voting wasn't included in the original Bill. I'm sorry to say that the answers that the Minister gave to our committee in her evidence to us were particularly weak. We've known that responsibility for elections was to be devolved to this institution as far back as 2017, so there's been a good 18 months to prepare for a draft to be included at the beginning of the Bill on this. Citing the Hirst decision for a delay: you know, that's a decision that goes back, or the issue goes back, to 2005, so that's not very credible either.

If you want further evidence of incomplete preparation, I think it's the inclusion of the 98 powers that Mick Antoniw referred to earlier. You've been at this for six years now—it's a lot for a lengthy Bill. At this stage, we would need to know why you're seeking powers, rather than committing to duties in some cases, and then the circumstances in which you would use those powers. You've had plenty of time for scenario planning, and we don't have clarity on that.

We have some powers, as Mick mentioned, with no procedure attached to them, including powers material to changes in how councils conduct elections. Your justification for this is that it was done that way in legislation that predates the existence of the Assembly by almost 30 years. That's not a good reason. Those weighty powers relating to the operation of the single transferable vote: you should be clear now about how those should be used and they should be in a Schedule to this Bill. We've already heard about the creation of an electoral database. The problem with that, as you said, Minister, yourself, is that you hadn't worked it out yet.

Conversely, we have a situation where the Government is certain about what it wants to do about certain types of publication, as in Schedule 4—a couple of paragraphs there. But, rather than set it out, it actually seeks powers to do it instead, when there's no need for that.

So, rather than repeat what others have said, I'll finish by drawing Members' and Ministers' attention to the recommendations that have been refused by the Minister—they do require further ministerial response—but also to chapter 3 of the committee's report, and to take to heart what it says, so that Government can draft better law and that we can become better legislators, quite frankly. I hope the Minister, and us all, as legislators, will bear that in mind. Thank you.

Nid oes arnaf gywilydd dweud hyn unwaith eto, mai Senedd Cymru sy'n gwneud y gyfraith, nid y Llywodraeth. Felly, dyma'r lleiaf y gallwn ni ei ddisgwyl fel cam cyntaf gan y Llywodraeth ei bod yn gosod Bil sydd, yn gyntaf, yn gyflawn; yn ail, â chig digonol ar yr esgyrn o ran ei amcan polisi ac o leiaf ei ddarpariaeth gychwynnol; ac, yn drydydd, wedi ei gostio'n iawn. Rwy'n credu bod y methu â derbyn argymhellion penodol gan y Pwyllgor Cyllid ynghylch hyn yn gamgymeriad. Nid wyf yn credu bod y Bil hwn yn bodloni'r tair egwyddor gyffredinol hynny. Os nad yw'n gwneud hynny, rwy'n credu fel deddfwyr, y dylem ni ei wrthod heddiw, ei anfon yn ôl ac, efallai, ei ail-wahodd er mwyn ei ail-osod ar ffurf sy'n bodloni'r profion hynny. Mae hynny er gwaethaf y pwynt a wnaed eisoes ynghylch y cyfnod y mae'r darn hwn o ddeddfwriaeth wedi ei gyflwyno ynddo.

Dywedodd y Pwyllgor Materion Cyfansoddiadol a Deddfwriaethol—y fersiwn  flaenorol, wrth gwrs, o bwyllgor Mick Antoniw—mai diben diwygiadau yw trafod ac awgrymu gwelliannau i Fil, ac nid darparu symiau mawr a sylweddol o destun na pheidio â chwblhau Biliau nad ystyrir eu bod wedi eu datblygu'n llawn ar adeg eu cyflwyno. Fel Cynulliad, wrth gwrs, anwybyddwyd hynny pan basiwyd Bil y Senedd ac Etholiadau, ac fel deddfwyr, ni ddylem wneud hynny eto. Os twyllwch ni unwaith yna rhag eich cywilydd, Lywodraeth Cymru, ond os twyllwch ni ddwywaith yna rhag ein cywilydd ni. Fe fyddwn i'n hoffi dweud mai dyma'r tro cyntaf, ond nid yw hynny'n wir. Rwy'n credu ei bod hi'n bryd i ni wneud ein gwaith a dweud pam y mae hon yn gyfraith wael nawr.

Felly, dim ond i edrych yn ôl ar Fil y Senedd ac Etholiadau, un o'r dadleuon a gyflwynwyd gan Lywodraeth Cymru oedd y byddai cynnwys pleidleisiau ar gyfer gwladolion tramor preswyl heb graffu yn ei wneud yn fwy cyson â hyn—cynnwys, ar y pryd, Bil heb ei weld. Nawr, bydd y Bil nas gwelwyd hwn, yn hwyr, yn cynnig pleidleisiau i rai carcharorion, er i mi glywed yr hyn a ddywedodd y Gweinidog yn gynharach, ac efallai y gwnaiff hi egluro'r sefyllfa yn awr a'r hyn yr oedd yn ei olygu pan ddywedodd na fyddai'n gofyn i swyddogion neilltuo rhagor o adnoddau ar gyfer hyn. Ond, y pwynt yw ei fod yn gwbl anghyson â'r Ddeddf Senedd ac Etholiadau, sydd eisoes yn rhesymu gwael ar ran Llywodraeth Cymru, a nawr maen nhw'n ceisio ei chael hi bob ffordd, oni bai bod gan y Gweinidog rywbeth arall i'w ddweud am hyn. Fel deddfwyr, dylem, felly, ddweud 'na'.

Y cwestiwn amlwg yw pam nad oedd pleidleisio gan garcharorion wedi ei gynnwys yn y Bil gwreiddiol. Mae'n ddrwg gennyf ddweud bod yr atebion a roddodd y Gweinidog i'n Pwyllgor yn ei thystiolaeth i ni yn arbennig o wan. Roeddem yn gwybod y byddai'r cyfrifoldeb dros etholiadau yn cael ei ddatganoli i'r sefydliad hwn mor bell yn ôl â 2017, felly bu 18 mis da i baratoi ar gyfer drafft i'w gynnwys ar ddechrau'r Bil ynghylch hyn. Dyfynnu penderfyniad Hirst i oedi: wyddoch chi, mae hwnnw'n benderfyniad sy'n mynd yn ôl, neu mae'r mater yn mynd yn ôl i 2005, felly nid yw hynny'n gredadwy iawn ychwaith.

Os ydych eisiau rhagor o dystiolaeth o baratoi anghyflawn, rwy'n credu mai hynny fyddai cynnwys y 98 o bwerau y cyfeiriodd Mick Antoniw atyn nhw yn gynharach. Rydych chi wedi bod yn ymwneud â hyn ers chwe blynedd bellach—mae'n dipyn o gyfnod ar gyfer Bil hir. Ar hyn o bryd, byddai angen i ni wybod pam yr ydych chi'n ceisio pwerau, yn hytrach nag ymrwymo i ddyletswyddau mewn rhai achosion, ac yna o dan ba amgylchiadau y byddech chi'n defnyddio'r pwerau hynny. Rydych chi wedi cael digon o amser i gynllunio ar gyfer sefyllfa, a dydyn ni ddim yn glir ynglŷn â hynny.

Mae gennym ni rai pwerau, fel y crybwyllodd Mick, heb unrhyw weithdrefn ynghlwm wrthynt, gan gynnwys pwerau sy'n berthnasol i newidiadau yn y ffordd y mae cynghorau'n cynnal etholiadau. Eich cyfiawnhad dros hyn yw iddo gael ei wneud felly mewn deddfwriaeth a oedd yn rhagflaenu bodolaeth y Cynulliad gan bron i 30 mlynedd. Nid yw hynny'n rheswm da. Y pwerau trymion hynny sy'n ymwneud â gweithredu'r bleidlais sengl drosglwyddadwy: dylech chi fod yn glir nawr ynglŷn â sut y dylid defnyddio'r rheini a dylent fod mewn Atodlen i'r Bil hwn. Rydym eisoes wedi clywed am greu cronfa ddata etholiadol. Y broblem ynglŷn â hynny, fel y dywedasoch, Gweinidog, eich hun, yw nad oeddech wedi gweithio pethau allan eto.

Ar y llaw arall, mae gennym sefyllfa lle mae'r Llywodraeth yn sicr ynglŷn â'r hyn y mae eisiau ei wneud ynghylch mathau penodol o gyhoeddi, fel yn Atodlen 4—ychydig o baragraffau yn y fan honno. Ond, yn hytrach na'i osod allan, mae mewn gwirionedd yn ceisio pwerau i wneud hynny yn hytrach, pan nad oes angen hynny.

Felly, yn hytrach nag ailadrodd yr hyn y mae eraill wedi ei ddweud, rwyf eisiau gorffen drwy dynnu sylw Aelodau a Gweinidogion at yr argymhellion sydd wedi eu gwrthod gan y Gweinidog—mae arnyn nhw angen ymateb pellach gan Weinidogion—ond hefyd at bennod 3 o adroddiad y pwyllgor, ac i ystyried yr hyn a ddywed, fel y gall y Llywodraeth ddrafftio cyfraith well ac y gallwn ninnau ddod yn well deddfwyr, a dweud y gwir. Rwy'n gobeithio y bydd y Gweinidog, a ninnau i gyd, fel deddfwyr, yn cadw hynny mewn cof. Diolch.

17:15

I, again, say thank you very much for arranging this sort of Assembly meeting, which I've never experienced before, especially these days when the whole country is gridlocked. I, personally, think it’s a bit ill timed to bring this local government Bill in front of one third of the Assembly.

I wish to speak on one area clearly regarding this, this afternoon. I wish to speak against the motion giving the right to vote, in devolved Welsh elections, to Welsh prisoners who are serving custodial sentences of less than four years. Prisoners convicted of crimes such as paedophilia, racially aggravated common assault and breaking sexual offence orders would be allowed to vote under this legislation, which is very strange to my thinking. It is not surprising that this proposal is not supported among the public. A person in my office put it to public opinion, and not a single person supported this view.

Also, I believe, in principle, that law makers should not be the law breakers. If we produce in society a framework of laws setting out the standard of responsibility and behaviour that we expect our citizens to abide by and maintain, by definition, also, people who have committed crimes against their fellow citizens have not met those standards. By breaking the law, they have abdicated or forfeited the right to make laws for others. There has been much discussion about prisoners' civil liberties, however, by definition, sentencing someone to a term of imprisonment involves a suspension of the right to liberty. The right to vote in elections, in a democracy, is a civil liberty, combined with others such as freedom of association, freedom of assembly and movement, and the right to stand for election. By the consequences of their action, prisoners are deprived of their very liberties. It is a choice they have made in full knowledge of what imprisonment entails. There are two aims of imprisonment: to punish and to rehabilitate. I fully support the rehabilitation of offenders. The restoration of the right to vote should be regarded as an important symbol that the individual has paid their debt to society. It is an incentive to integrate offenders back into society; this will be lost if prisoners are given the right to vote.

Presiding Officer, there are also practical reasons why this proposal will not work. They create a bureaucratic nightmare that will place an additional unnecessary burden on our prison service staff and officials, but many Welsh prisoners serve their sentences in England. There is, for example, no Welsh women prison in Wales. The Welsh Government is, therefore, proposing to allow people to vote without the privilege of accessing Welsh media coverage to inform them of the issues, of their local issues. So, people will be totally unaware of the local issues while they will be voting. Elections entail the right of electors to meet the candidates standing for elections. It is totally impractical for candidates to travel to prisons, even within Wales, to meet electors, let alone to hold hustings on their premises. The risk to security is also obvious.

Presiding Officer, I repeat: there is no public support for this proposal. I urge the Assembly to assert the right of the public over the right of the criminal and reject this motion today. Thank you.

Rwyf, unwaith eto, yn dweud diolch yn fawr iawn am drefnu'r math hwn o gyfarfod o'r Cynulliad, nad wyf erioed wedi cael profiad ohono o'r blaen, yn enwedig yn y dyddiau hyn pan fo'r holl wlad yn methu â symud. Yn bersonol, rwy'n credu ei fod yn amseru gwael i gyflwyno'r Bil llywodraeth leol hwn o flaen traean o'r Cynulliad.

Rwyf eisiau siarad yn glir ar un maes yn ymwneud â hyn, y prynhawn yma. Hoffwn siarad yn erbyn y cynnig sy'n rhoi'r hawl i bleidleisio, mewn etholiadau datganoledig Cymru, i garcharorion o Gymry sy'n bwrw tymor dedfrydau o lai na phedair blynedd. Byddai carcharorion a gollfarnwyd am droseddau fel pedoffilia, ymosod cyffredin ar sail hil a thorri gorchmynion troseddau rhywiol yn cael pleidleisio o dan y ddeddfwriaeth hon, sy'n rhyfedd yn fy marn i. Nid yw'n syndod na chefnogir y cynnig hwn ymhlith y cyhoedd. Fe wnaeth person yn fy swyddfa i ofyn i'r cyhoedd am eu barn, ac nid oedd unrhyw berson yn cefnogi'r farn hon.

Hefyd, rwy'n credu, mewn egwyddor, na ddylai gwneuthurwyr cyfraith fod yn dorwyr cyfraith. Os ydym ni'n cynhyrchu fframwaith o gyfreithiau mewn cymdeithas sy'n nodi safon y cyfrifoldeb a'r ymddygiad y disgwyliwn i'n dinasyddion lynu wrtho a'i gynnal, drwy ddiffiniad, hefyd, nid yw pobl sydd wedi troseddu yn erbyn eu cyd-ddinasyddion wedi bodloni'r safonau hynny. Drwy dorri'r gyfraith, maen nhw wedi ildio neu wedi fforffedu'r hawl i ddeddfu ar gyfer eraill. Bu llawer o drafod am ryddid dinesig carcharorion, ond er hynny, drwy ddiffiniad, mae dedfrydu rhywun i gyfnod mewn carchar yn golygu atal yr hawl i ryddid. Mae'r hawl i bleidleisio mewn etholiadau, mewn democratiaeth, yn hawl dinesig, wedi ei gyfuno ag eraill megis rhyddid cymdeithasol, rhyddid i ymgynnull a symud, a'r hawl i sefyll mewn etholiad. Oherwydd canlyniadau eu gweithred, mae carcharorion yn cael eu hamddifadu o'u hawliau. Mae'n ddewis y maen nhw wedi ei wneud gan wybod yn llwyr beth y mae carcharu yn ei olygu. Mae dwy nod i garcharu: cosbi ac adsefydlu. Rwyf yn llwyr gefnogi adsefydlu troseddwyr. Dylid ystyried bod adfer yr hawl i bleidleisio yn symbol pwysig bod yr unigolyn wedi talu ei ddyled i gymdeithas. Mae'n gymhelliant i integreiddio troseddwyr yn ôl i Gymdeithas; bydd hyn yn cael ei golli os rhoddir yr hawl i garcharorion bleidleisio.

Llywydd, mae hefyd rhesymau ymarferol pam na fydd y cynnig hwn yn gweithio. Maen nhw'n creu hunllef fiwrocrataidd a fydd yn rhoi baich diangen ychwanegol ar staff a swyddogion y gwasanaeth carchardai, ond mae llawer o garcharorion o Gymru yn bwrw eu dedfrydau yn Lloegr. Er enghraifft, nid oes carchar i fenywod yng Nghymru. Mae Llywodraeth Cymru, felly, yn cynnig caniatáu i bobl bleidleisio heb y fraint o allu cael gafael ar wybodaeth yng nghyfryngau Cymru i roi gwybod iddyn nhw am y materion, eu materion lleol. Felly, bydd pobl yn gwbl anymwybodol o'r materion lleol pan fyddant yn pleidleisio. Mae etholiadau yn golygu hawl etholwyr i gwrdd â'r ymgeiswyr sy'n sefyll mewn etholiadau. Mae'n gwbl anymarferol i ymgeiswyr deithio i garchardai, hyd yn oed yng Nghymru, i gwrdd ag etholwyr, heb sôn am gynnal hustyngau ar eu safleoedd. Mae'r risg i ddiogelwch hefyd yn amlwg.

Llywydd, fe ddywedaf eto: nid oes cefnogaeth ymhlith y cyhoedd i'r cynnig hwn. Anogaf y Cynulliad i fynnu hawl y cyhoedd dros hawl y troseddwr a gwrthod y cynnig hwn heddiw. Diolch.

Llywydd, thank you very much for calling me. Am I being heard?

Llywydd, diolch yn fawr am fy ngalw i. Ydw i'n cael fy nghlywed?

Yes, you are. You can carry on.

Ydych, mi ydych chi. Cewch fynd ymlaen.

Thank you, sorry. I had 'unmuted' flash up on my screen.

This is a very important constitutional Bill. We've heard that it's been six years in the making. It's a long time for the Government to get its priorities together and now we are going to see, it seems, a very truncated legislative process, despite the fact that the three committees that looked at this Bill made extensive recommendations for amendments, very few of which have been accepted by the Government. And I do note that the Minister has received next to no enthusiastic support from her own colleagues. It's been a very tepid C- approval when she's been able to get it. I think this should send a signal to you about the process you are following and that the legislative function is not being fully honoured in the approach that you've taken, and it's a problem, I think, when an Executive acts in an overbearing way.

Diolch, mae'n ddrwg gennyf. Roedd 'unmuted' yn fflachio ar fy sgrin.

Mae hwn yn fesur cyfansoddiadol pwysig iawn. Rydym ni wedi clywed bod y broses o wneud hyn wedi cymryd chwe blynedd. Mae'n amser hir i'r Llywodraeth gael ei blaenoriaethau at ei gilydd ac yn awr rydym am weld, mae'n ymddangos, proses ddeddfwriaethol wedi ei chwtogi yn helaeth, er gwaethaf y ffaith fod y tri phwyllgor a edrychodd ar y Bil hwn wedi gwneud argymhellion helaeth ar gyfer gwelliannau, ac ychydig iawn ohonyn nhw sydd wedi eu derbyn gan y Llywodraeth. Ac rwyf yn nodi nad yw'r Gweinidog wedi cael cefnogaeth frwd gan ei chydweithwyr ei hun. Cymeradwyaeth glaear iawn yw hi wedi bod, pryd y mae hi wedi llwyddo i'w chael. Rwy'n credu y dylai hyn anfon neges atoch am y broses yr ydych chi yn ei dilyn, ac nad yw'r swyddogaeth ddeddfwriaethol yn cael ei hanrhydeddu'n llawn yn y dull yr ydych chi wedi ei ddilyn, ac mae'n broblem, rwy'n credu, pan fydd y Weithrediaeth yn gweithredu mewn modd gormesol.

I have to say that I think this is quite an ambitious Bill, and there are aspects of it that I do very much favour. I would have enjoyed the prospect of trying to work genuinely in the fullness of legislative time with proper consultation—we heard John Griffiths say that many stakeholders just couldn't engage in the timescale that was given. But, I think there's a really good, important local government Bill to be had here, and that this is really the tragedy of the fact that we are not going to see fully coherent proposals come through in a well-worked Bill that probably would have had cross-party support, which should be the aim of constitutional changes.

I very much support the franchise being extended to 16 and 17-year-olds. With apologies to my colleagues, I think local councils should be able to decide what their electoral system is, as long as they get support for that change amongst their electorate. I don't think that 22 systems, which is one choice or the other, first past the post or STV, would exercise our electorate particularly. They would just get used to wherever they were having that particular form of local elections. If we believe in local democracy, why not extend that principle to them to decide on how they are represented and how they constitute their councils?

I don't agree with extending council terms from four to five years. Our change in the Assembly to go from four to five years has not been successful, in my view, and I think a four-year term has a lot to recommend it at all levels of government.

There's much to be said about the general power of competence; the public participation strategy is something that would drag us into the modern age. Corporate joint committees between councils, I think that extends: we've seen how effectively city regions are working at the moment. There's a lot to be said for performance in governance reforms, and then allowing local mergers where councils want to do that.

There is good material here, but we have to face the difficulty that this Bill now requires very extensive committee stage work to look at the amendments. Those amendments are very comprehensive and will have to be crafted by the political groups in co-operation with the Assembly's lawyers. These are extensive meetings. This is serious law, probably one of the most important Bills in this Assembly term.

It's unfortunate the Government has been overtaken by a crisis they couldn't have anticipated, and I accept the challenges that has brought. But your timetabling was your decision, and to place major reform very late in the electoral cycle is always inviting trouble. I made this point when we discussed the Senedd Bill, around using two Bills to reduce the voting age. Also, I think some major things do need to be very well considered when we extend the franchise to people who are not citizens. That is clearly a huge principle that needs a lot of thought and examination, and similarly with the issue of prisoners, if that is brought forward.

Again, I don't completely agree with the very hostile view that no prisoners should receive the franchise. I think for lesser crimes—. We do imprison an awful lot of people in Britain, and have done so since the 1980s when we had roughly 40,000 prisoners, now we have about 90,000, many serving short sentences, and I think we have to be aware of the international organisations and treaties that we have signed, and some of the policy changes we might have to make are a consequence of international law, or decisions in international law, going against us. So, I don't condemn the Welsh Government for looking at that, because it's something that the UK Government has had to do as well. But it's still not elegant to bring in such a reform at Stage 2 and not have it fully consulted on.

So, I really think it would be an act of grace on the Government's part now to accept that, in the situation we find ourselves, which is not the fault of the Welsh Government, it is just not possible to give this Bill the extensive legislative scrutiny that it requires, and it's better to decide to postpone something than to rush something through that would not get cross-party support and may have serious deficiencies because of the unintended consequences. Thank you very much, Llywydd.

Mae'n rhaid i mi ddweud fy mod yn credu bod hwn yn Fil eithaf uchelgeisiol, ac mae agweddau arno yr wyf yn eu ffafrio'n fawr. Byddwn wedi mwynhau'r cyfle i geisio gweithio mewn gwirionedd yng nghyflawnder y cyfnod deddfwriaethol gan ymgynghori'n briodol—clywsom John Griffiths yn dweud na allai llawer o randdeiliaid ymwneud ag ef yn briodol yn yr amser a roddwyd. Ond, rwy'n credu bod yna Fil llywodraeth leol pwysig iawn yn y fan yma, a dyma yw'r gwir drasiedi, y ffaith nad ydym yn mynd i weld cynigion cwbl gydlynol yn cael eu cyflwyno mewn Bil wedi ei lunio'n dda a fyddai, mae'n debyg, wedi cael cefnogaeth drawsbleidiol, a ddylai fod yn nod newidiadau cyfansoddiadol.

Rwy'n cefnogi'n frwd ymestyn yr etholfraint i bobl ifanc 16 ac 17 oed. Gan ymddiheuro i'm cyd-Aelodau, credaf y dylai cynghorau lleol benderfynu beth yw eu system etholiadol, ar yr amod bod  cefnogaeth i'r newid hwnnw ymhlith eu hetholwyr. Nid wyf yn credu y byddai 22 o systemau, sydd ag un dewis neu'r llall, y cyntaf i'r felin neu bleidlais sengl drosglwyddadwy, yn trethu ein hetholwyr yn arbennig. Bydden nhw'n dod i arfer â'r math arbennig hwnnw o etholiadau lleol. Os ydym yn credu mewn democratiaeth leol, beth am estyn yr egwyddor honno iddyn nhw er mwyn iddyn nhw benderfynu ar sut y cânt eu cynrychioli a sut y maen nhw'n ffurfio eu cynghorau?

Dydw i ddim yn cytuno ag ymestyn tymhorau cyngor o bedair i bum mlynedd. Ni fu ein newid ni yn y Cynulliad o bedair i bum mlynedd yn llwyddiannus, yn fy marn i, a chredaf y gellir argymell tymor o bedair blynedd ar bob haen o lywodraeth.

Mae llawer i'w ddweud o blaid y pŵer cymhwysedd cyffredinol; byddai'r strategaeth o gael cyfranogiad y cyhoedd yn rhywbeth a fyddai'n ein llusgo i'r oes fodern. Cyd-bwyllgorau corfforaethol rhwng cynghorau, rwy'n credu bod hynny'n ymestyn: rydym ni wedi gweld pa mor effeithiol y mae dinas-ranbarthau yn gweithio ar hyn o bryd. Mae llawer i'w ddweud o blaid perfformiad mewn diwygiadau llywodraethu, ac yna caniatáu uno lleol lle mae cynghorau eisiau gwneud hynny.

Ceir deunydd da yma, ond rhaid inni wynebu'r anhawster fod y Bil hwn bellach angen gwaith helaeth iawn yn y cam pwyllgor i edrych ar y gwelliannau. Mae'r diwygiadau hynny'n gynhwysfawr iawn a bydd yn rhaid iddyn nhw gael eu saernïo gan y grwpiau gwleidyddol mewn cydweithrediad â chyfreithwyr y Cynulliad. Mae'r rhain yn gyfarfodydd sylweddol. Mae hon yn gyfraith ddifrifol, yn ôl pob tebyg yn un o'r biliau pwysicaf yn y tymor Cynulliad hwn.

Mae'n anffodus bod y Llywodraeth wedi cael ei dal gan argyfwng na allai hi fod wedi'i ragweld, ac rwy'n derbyn yr heriau sydd wedi dod yn ei sgil. Ond eich penderfyniad chi oedd eich amserlen chi, ac mae cyflwyno diwygiadau mawr yn hwyr iawn yn y cylch etholiadol bob amser yn gofyn am helynt. Gwneuthum y pwynt hwn pan wnaethom ni drafod Bil y Senedd, ynghylch ddefnyddio dau Fil i ostwng yr oedran pleidleisio. Hefyd, rwy'n credu bod angen ystyried rhai pethau mawr yn ofalus iawn pan fyddwn yn ymestyn yr etholfraint i bobl nad ydyn nhw'n ddinasyddion. Mae honno'n amlwg yn egwyddor enfawr y mae angen llawer o feddwl ac archwilio arni, ac yn yr un modd gyda mater y carcharorion, os caiff hwnnw ei gyflwyno.

Unwaith eto, dydw i ddim yn cytuno'n llwyr â'r farn elyniaethus iawn na ddylid rhoi'r etholfraint i unrhyw garcharor. Rwy'n credu o ran troseddau llai—. Rydym yn carcharu llawer iawn o bobl ym Mhrydain, ac wedi gwneud hynny ers y 1980au pan oedd gennym ni tua 40,000 o garcharorion, erbyn hyn mae gennym ni tua 90,000, llawer ohonyn nhw'n wedi cael dedfrydau byr, a chredaf fod yn rhaid inni fod yn ymwybodol o'r cyrff rhyngwladol a'r cytundebau yr ydym wedi'u llofnodi, a rhai o'r newidiadau polisi y bydd yn rhaid inni efallai eu gwneud o ganlyniad i gyfraith ryngwladol, neu benderfyniadau mewn cyfraith ryngwladol, yn milwrio yn ein herbyn. Felly, dydw i ddim yn condemnio Llywodraeth Cymru am ystyried hynny, gan ei fod yn rhywbeth y mae Llywodraeth y DU wedi gorfod ei wneud hefyd. Er hynny nid yw'n briodol iawn i gyflwyno'r fath ddiwygiad yng Nghyfnod 2 a heb ymgynghori'n llawn yn ei gylch.

Felly, rwy'n credu o ddifrif y byddai'r Llywodraeth yn gwneud cymwynas fawr drwy dderbyn, yn y sefyllfa yr ydym ni ynddi, nad yw'n fai ar Lywodraeth Cymru, nad yw'n bosib gwneud y gwaith craffu deddfwriaethol helaeth sydd ei angen ar y Bil hwn, ac mae'n well penderfynu gohirio rhywbeth na rhuthro rhywbeth na fyddai'n cael cefnogaeth drawsbleidiol ac a allai fod â diffygion difrifol oherwydd y canlyniadau anfwriadol. Diolch yn fawr iawn, Llywydd.

17:25

Thank you very much. I hear the hostility there is from the opposition, but I just want to remind us all that when we did a cross-party inquiry into prisoners voting, it was notable not just for the support it attracted from prisoners, but also from prison governors, including one of the most senior governors in this country. So it's always possible to whip up hostility to prisoners voting. That is, unfortunately, one of the hallmarks of our criminal justice system, that it is so bedogged by the attitudes and prejudices of many of the newspapers in this country, which is why it's so difficult to have a proper debate on this subject. But I think it would be a tragedy if we missed this opportunity to introduce legislation that I think we can demonstrate will actually improve the civic engagement of marginalised people, many of whom end up in the prison system on relatively minor offences—and we are talking about a very limited franchise—and this would enable us to pay much more attention to improving our criminal justice system, on which we spend billions of pounds, and which is not effective at addressing recidivism.

Diolch yn fawr iawn. Clywaf elyniaeth y gwrthbleidiau, ond rwyf eisiau ein hatgoffa ni i gyd, pan wnaethom ni ymchwiliad trawsbleidiol i garcharorion yn pleidleisio, roedd yn drawiadol nid yn unig oherwydd y gefnogaeth ymhlith y carcharorion, ond hefyd ymhlith llywodraethwyr carchardai, gan gynnwys un o'r llywodraethwyr uchaf ei statws yn y wlad hon. Felly mae bob amser yn bosib ennyn gwrthwynebiad i'r syniad o garcharorion yn pleidleisio. Yn anffodus, dyna un o nodweddion ein system cyfiawnder troseddol, sef ei bod ar drugaredd agweddau a rhagfarnau llawer o'r papurau newydd yn y wlad hon, a dyna pam ei bod hi mor anodd trafod y pwnc hwn yn ystyrlon. Ond rwy'n credu y byddai'n drychineb pe byddem yn colli'r cyfle hwn i gyflwyno deddfwriaeth y credaf y gallwn ni ddangos y bydd yn gwella ymgysylltiad dinesig pobl ar y cyrion, llawer ohonyn nhw yn y pen draw yn y system garchardai am droseddau cymharol ddibwys—ac rydym yn sôn am etholfraint gyfyngedig iawn—a byddai hyn yn ein galluogi ni i roi llawer mwy o sylw i wella ein system cyfiawnder troseddol, yr ydym yn gwario biliynau o bunnau arni, ac nad yw'n effeithiol o ran mynd i'r afael ag aildroseddu. 

The Minister to respond to the debate, Julie James.

Y Gweinidog i ymateb i'r ddadl, Julie James.

Diolch, Llywydd. I'm very grateful for Members' comments today, and for all the work done by the committees, and I will reflect further on everything Members have said today, and on the full set of committee recommendations that are in front of us.

Sadly, Llywydd, I do feel the need to reiterate my opening remarks on two points, which seem to have been missed by a large number of Members today. As I said in my opening remarks, unfortunately I've had to take the decision, as part of the Welsh Government's wider consideration of its legislative programme, at the start of our planning for coping with the grave circumstances, unforeseeable circumstances, we are in, not to commit any future official resource to the proposed prisoner voting Stage 2 amendments, and so we will not be bringing forward those amendments, which I did say at the beginning of this debate. The Bill we are voting on today does not contain those provisions, so a large number of Members have taken up their time today on something that is not currently contained in the Stage 1 Bill.

I, too, seriously regret the discourtesy shown to the committee's thoughtful work on this point by the recent Conservative media, which I think they should really seriously consider withdrawing. And Llywydd, as I also said at the outset, Members I'm sure will be aware that today's debate will, if the motion is passed, allow us to continue to include future work on the Bill in our planning for matters that we will want to be ready to progress once the crisis that we now face is past.

I know many Members support the principles in the Bill and its policy objectives, and in passing this motion today, it will allow us to continue to plan to have that happen in the future. If we do not pass the motion today, we could not include it in the planning. That would be a serious disrespect to the Senedd. The Senedd's input is required for us to continue to do that planning. We cannot do it without that, as some Members appear to be suggesting.

So, Llywydd, on that basis, and on the basis that I will reflect seriously on the recommendations that the committees have made once more, I will urge Members to agree the general principles and the financial resolution of the Bill today, to allow that progress to be made. Thank you.

Diolch, Llywydd. Rwy'n ddiolchgar iawn am sylwadau'r Aelodau heddiw, ac am yr holl waith a wneir gan y pwyllgorau, a byddaf yn myfyrio ymhellach ar bopeth y mae Aelodau wedi'i ddweud heddiw, ac ar y gyfres lawn o argymhellion yr amrywiol bwyllgorau sydd ger ein bron.

Yn anffodus, Llywydd, teimlaf fod angen ailadrodd fy sylwadau agoriadol ar ddau bwynt, y mae nifer fawr o Aelodau wedi'u colli yn ôl pob golwg heddiw. Fel y dywedais yn fy sylwadau agoriadol, yn anffodus bu'n rhaid i mi wneud y penderfyniad, yn rhan o ystyriaeth ehangach Llywodraeth Cymru o'i rhaglen ddeddfwriaethol, ar ddechrau ein cynllunio ar gyfer ymdopi â'r amgylchiadau difrifol, yr amgylchiadau nad oedd modd eu rhagweld, yr ydym ni ynddyn nhw, i beidio ag ymrwymo unrhyw adnodd swyddogol yn y dyfodol i'r diwygiadau arfaethedig yng Nghyfnod 2 o ran carcharorion yn pleidleisio felly ni fyddwn yn cyflwyno'r diwygiadau hynny fel y dywedais ar ddechrau'r ddadl hon. Nid yw'r Bil yr ydym yn pleidleisio arno heddiw yn cynnwys y darpariaethau hynny, felly mae nifer fawr o Aelodau wedi treulio eu hamser heddiw ar rywbeth nad yw wedi'i gynnwys yn y Bil Cyfnod 1 ar hyn o bryd.

Rwyf fi, hefyd, yn gresynu'n ddifrifol at yr anghwrteisi a ddangoswyd at waith meddylgar y pwyllgor ynghylch hyn gan y cyfryngau Ceidwadol diweddar, a chredaf y dylen nhw o ddifrif ystyried eu dileu. A Llywydd, fel y dywedais ar y dechrau hefyd, rwy'n siŵr y bydd yr Aelodau'n ymwybodol y bydd y ddadl heddiw, os caiff y cynnig ei basio, yn caniatáu inni barhau i gynnwys gwaith yn y dyfodol ar y Bil yn ein cynlluniau ar gyfer materion y byddwn ni eisiau iddyn nhw fod yn barod i'w symud ymlaen ar ôl i'r argyfwng yr ydym yn ei wynebu nawr fynd heibio.

Gwn fod llawer o Aelodau'n cefnogi'r egwyddorion yn y Bil a'i amcanion polisi, ac wrth basio'r cynnig hwn heddiw, bydd yn caniatáu inni barhau i gynllunio er mwyn i hynny ddigwydd yn y dyfodol. Os na fyddwn yn pasio'r cynnig heddiw, ni allem ei gynnwys yn y cynllunio. Byddai hynny'n amarch difrifol i'r Senedd. Mae angen mewnbwn y Senedd er mwyn inni barhau â'r cynllunio hwnnw. Ni allwn wneud hynny heb hwnnw, fel y mae rhai Aelodau, yn ôl pob golwg, yn ei awgrymu.

Felly, Llywydd, ar y sail honno, ac ar y sail y byddaf yn myfyrio o ddifrif ar yr argymhellion y mae'r pwyllgorau wedi'u gwneud unwaith eto, byddaf yn annog Aelodau i gytuno ar egwyddorion cyffredinol a phenderfyniad ariannol y Bil heddiw, er mwyn caniatáu'r cynnydd hwnnw. Diolch.

The proposal is to agree the motions. Does any Member object? [Objection.] I can see that Members are objecting, and I defer the voting under this item until voting time. [Interruption.]

Y cynnig yw ein bod yn cytuno ar y cynigion. A oes unrhyw Aelod yn gwrthwynebu? [Gwrthwynebiad.] Gwelaf fod Aelodau'n gwrthwynebu, ac rwy'n gohirio'r pleidleisio o dan yr eitem hon tan y cyfnod pleidleisio. [Torri ar draws.]

Gohiriwyd y pleidleisio tan y cyfnod pleidleisio.

Voting deferred until voting time.

17:30
6. Cyfnod Pleidleisio
6. Voting Time

And I'll move to the voting time. As indicated on the agenda, today's votes will be conducted in accordance with Standing Order 34.11—[Interruption.] Each political group may nominate one Member of the group or grouping to carry the same number of votes as there are Members of the group. In the case of a political group with an Executive role, the nominee will carry the same—[Interruption.] Before I carry on, can all officials and translators mute their microphones? Members who do not belong to a group or a grouping will vote for themselves and I will conduct the vote by roll call.

The vote, therefore, is a vote on the motions tabled in the names of Julie James and Rebecca Evans. On behalf of the Labour group and the Government, I call on John Griffiths. How do you cast your 30 votes? John Griffiths, how do you cast your 30 votes? Once again, John Griffiths.

A symudaf i'r cyfnod pleidleisio. Fel y nodwyd ar yr agenda, cynhelir y pleidleisiau heddiw yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog 34.11—[Torri ar draws.] Caiff pob grŵp gwleidyddol enwebu un Aelod o'r grŵp neu'r grwpiad i gario'r un nifer o bleidleisiau ag y sydd o Aelodau'r grŵp. Yn achos grŵp gwleidyddol sydd â swyddogaeth Weithredol, bydd gan yr enwebai yr un—[Torri ar draws.] Cyn imi barhau, a all y swyddogion a'r cyfieithwyr i gyd ddiffodd eu meicroffonau? Bydd Aelodau nad ydynt yn perthyn i grŵp neu grwpiad yn pleidleisio drostynt eu hunain a byddaf yn cynnal pleidlais drwy alw'r enwau.

Mae'r bleidlais, felly, yn bleidlais ar y cynigion a gyflwynwyd yn enwau Julie James a Rebecca Evans. Ar ran y grŵp Llafur a'r Llywodraeth, galwaf ar John Griffiths. Sut ydych chi'n bwrw eich 30 o bleidleisiau? John Griffiths, sut ydych chi'n bwrw eich 30 o bleidleisiau? Unwaith eto, John Griffiths.

Thank you. On behalf of the Welsh Conservative group, Darren Millar, how do you cast your 11 votes? 

Diolch. Ar ran grŵp Ceidwadwyr Cymru, Darren Millar, sut ydych chi'n bwrw eich 11 pleidlais?

On behalf of Plaid Cymru, Helen Mary Jones, how do you cast your nine votes? 

Ar ran Plaid Cymru, Helen Mary Jones, sut ydych chi'n bwrw eich naw pleidlais?

On behalf of the Brexit Party, Caroline Jones, how do you cast your four votes? 

Ar ran y Blaid Brexit, Caroline Jones, sut ydych chi'n bwrw eich pedair pleidlais?

Neil Hamilton, how do you cast your vote?

Neil Hamilton, sut ydych chi'n bwrw eich pleidlais?

That concludes the vote. The result of the vote: for the motions 30, no abstentions, against 25, and, therefore, the motions are agreed.